"This snack is not that delicious."

Translation:このお菓子はあまりおいしくないです。

September 5, 2017

42 Comments
This discussion is locked.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/superowlcat

Shouldn't 菓子 be accepted as well as お菓子?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/IsolaCiao

I had to actually look up 菓子 in the dictionary, because I've never heard it without the お. It's listed as a common word, so it seems you're right. I don't think it's commonly spoken, though.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/superowlcat

Good to know, thanks! Jisho also has a page for お菓子 and it's listed as JLPT N5, whereas 菓子 is listed as JLPT N3, so that seems to agree with what you were saying. https://jisho.org/search/%E3%81%8A%E8%8F%93%E5%AD%90


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/marti_MG

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9d3EUwb8Loo&t=499s

@1:43 Japaneseammo with Misa almost always avoids formal speech and will point it out. Here お菓子 is used in ordinary everyday speech.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Cryopneuma

This is polite for "these taste horrible."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mnau

What is the difference between おかし and あめ?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KagayakuSeiza

おかし can refer to sweets in general, including baked goods. (Actually, I think "snack" is kind of an odd translation for it.) あめ is more like hard candy.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/IsolaCiao

おかし can also refer to savory snacks like potato chips.

[Edit: Google Image Search of お菓子 brings up jagariko and potato chips, not sure why someone disagrees that okashi is not for savory snacks if you could please explain? I especially find when children get an "okashi" prize, it's usually umaibou, another savory snack.]


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/TempestTeacup

Perhaps because 和菓子 (わがし) only refers to japanese "baked" goods, such as taiyaki and daifuku mochi, people might have then inferred that お菓子 would be general confections. But nope, it really just means snacks.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ZetsKai

These sentences need some good rework with the translations. A better translation for this would be: このお菓子はそんなにおいしくないです。


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Aelise_627

I am interested to know whether what you said would really be a good translation. Being literal, I also thought that using そんなに might be appropriate, but I don't know if using it in this context is actually good Japanese. Would someone please write in here?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/IsolaCiao

It sounds natural to me (as does the Duolingo sentence).

It's discussed below: https://forum.duolingo.com/comment/24324665?comment_id=47610692

and hannaBanana5094 cites this HiNative link that explains the difference: https://hinative.com/en-US/questions/4795056


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Risu_kun

このお菓子はおかしいです。


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BriannaBrandt

QUESTION: If あまり means "not really," and おいしくない is "not delicious," how is the sentence not a double negative?

Wouldnt this be, " This snack is not really not delicious." Meaning it's not so bad tasting?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/IsolaCiao

あまり is used with negative verbs/adjectives to mean "not really". It's the combination of あまり and おいしくない that makes it "not really delicious".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Christophe588346

「このお菓子はそんなにおいしくないです」should be accepted.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/marti_MG

Very good!「このお菓子はそんなにおいしくないです」might be another good translation, using そんなに + negative adjective (here: おいしくない), as an alternative to the lesson's focus on あまり + neg. adj.

But, I wouldn't call them synonyms. Also, grammatically そんな needs the に + negative and expresses that something is comparatively speaking "not a great measure" of, for example, a quality , whereas あまりexpresses a direct attribute of said quality.

Both might express disappointment comparatively, but they are different. Any help describing the difference would be appreciated.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/hannaBanana5094

Well, hinative says:

They could be same meaning depends on the context.

Same meaning example here; そんなに(あまり)残っていない There is not much left.

Slightly different meaning example here; (1) あまり美味しくない。 It's not very tasty (my opinion) (2) そんなに美味しくない It's not so tasty ( I expected that it's tasty but not really. Or like, someone told me that this is very tasty but it is not...)

Depends on the situation, あまり and そんなに could be same meaning even above example...


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/draigyddaear

Daft question - what exactly is a snack? In Britain we don't buy snacks as such. We talk about having a snack, but not buying one. A snack here is something to eat between meals. We might buy a roll, some crisps, an energy bar, etc, but will call them that. So I was wondering what the exact meaning is in Japan.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/IsolaCiao

In American English, a snack can be as you've described, something to eat between meals, or it can be food itself that is suitable to eat as a snack. We would call things like crisps/chips "snacks" (I went to the store to buy snacks). The word お菓子 is closer to this second meaning. It's the kind of food you would buy to eat between meals or for dessert. To talk specifically about eating between meals, I think おやつ would be a better word to use (3時のおやつ, "the 3:00 snack" is something I hear a lot in Japanese).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/draigyddaear

Thanks. Is the 3 o'clock snack something you would eat while working, or would you take a break to eat something. In Britain we are very fond of our afternoon tea, which you would definitely sit down to have - often with visitors. It is a pot of tea, and something light, such as small sandwiches and/or cake. It was introduced in the 19th century by a duchess, I believe, and now it is a great British tradition. Unfortunately, for most of us it is during the working day, so not something to indulge in every day. Unless you are a duchess, of course!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/IsolaCiao

Snack time at my workplace in Japan tends to be pulling some food out of your desk, sticking it in your mouth, and continuing to work. Afternoon tea sounds lovely!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/draigyddaear

It is. If ever you are in England, be sure to experience it.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sakata_Kintoki

このお菓子はあまり美味しくないのです should be accepted.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/5GS

「このお菓子はあまり美味しくありません。」


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Kelaihc

このお菓子は余り美味しくないです。

Not accepted due to Kanji use from what I could see. Hate it when Duo does this. Or is there something wrong with it I'm not seeing?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/IsolaCiao

Accepted answers aren't complete and the contributors rely on us to submit error reports to help add answers: https://forum.duolingo.com/comment/38591435

I do think it's better to write あまり and おいしい in hiragana to follow official writing conventions, but of course some native speakers write them in kanji: https://forum.duolingo.com/comment/37707647?comment_id=37760044


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/UnknownUserrr

Can someone please explain the placement/meaning of あまり here?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/IsolaCiao

あまり is an adverb that is used together with a negative word to mean "not that ~" or "not very ~". It softens the negative.

  • おいしくないです。

It's not delicious. (direct statement)

  • あまりおいしくないです。

It's not that delicious. / It's not very delicious. (not as direct, but still negative)

In general, the placement of adverbs is pretty free, but since このお菓子は is the topic, it sounds the most natural for that to come first, followed by あまり.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/EricPooley

It rejected 「このお菓子はあまり美味しくない」. Was it the kanji or the lack of でず that it didn't like?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/osazeidemu

The question does not have "very" in it. I wonder how it appeared in the answer


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/IsolaCiao

From jisho.org:

あまり

(not) very; (not) much​

Usually written using kana alone, with neg. sentence

Or did you mean the current English translation doesn't have "very" in it?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Dylan_Nicholson

"Not that delicious" definitely comes off as sounding like something only a non-native English speaker would say. 9 times out of 10 we'd just say "Not that good", or maybe "Not so tasty". You'd very rarely use the word "Delicious" in a negative construct, though you can of course use it sarcastically to describe something that's obviously not likely or expected to taste great.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Cryopneuma

Eh, I think it's up to user preference and actually more likely to say in response to someone claiming something is delicious. You mimic phrasing when you're trying to contradict it.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Dylan_Nicholson

Sure, there might be occasions it'd be used, but even if someone handed me a snack and said "Try this, it's delicious", I'd be more likely to respond "It's not that good" than "not that delicious".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Cryopneuma

If there are occasions in which it may be used as part of natural English for a native English speaker, then it directly contradicts your point that it sounds like something only a non-native would say.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Dylan_Nicholson

Which is why I hedged my statement with "comes off as sounding like something".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Cryopneuma

But it doesn't. It's said naturally by natives and recognized as natural by natives when hearing the phrasing in context.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Dylan_Nicholson

Clearly we hang around different English speakers. The people I can think of that would be likely to say "not that delicious" are all non native speakers (including my own partner).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Cryopneuma

@Dylan_Nicholson

It's not a question of how likely it is to hear certain phrasing. It's a question of correctness, and whether it would be said naturally at all by a native speaker of English.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Dylan_Nicholson

I never said it was incorrect, just pointing out for the benefit of any non-native speakers that it wasn't a common thing to say.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Cryopneuma

@Dylan_Nicholson

But it's not an unnatural thing to say at all, hence it's perfectly fine to say in everyday speech and won't make you sound non-native. After all, natives do use it.

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