It feels more natural to put 'big' before 'new' in English. Are there any rules governing the order of multiple adjectives in Czech?
If I understand the grammar correctly (and it is possible that I am wrong) than the rule is: the nearer the adjective to the word is the less general it is. So, you would say: "Velký růžový moderní dům" = "big pink modern house" ,because there are many things that can be big, less that can be pink and less that can be modern. If you find both words on the same level you can use "a" "Červený a zelený dům" = "red and green house"
Thank you. However, in this sentence, I'd certainly have thought that 'new' is less general than 'big'—with the passing of time, everything becomes less new, whereas all things remain uniformly big; age is transitory but size is not. This does indeed appear to be the case in your example 'velký (růžový) moderní dům', so why does 'nové velké děvče' work?
That is the question. And I have to say that I do not know and also that I did not find a case when I would say something like "nové velké děvče."
It is possible that "nové" is first, because there was one "velké děvče" already before and just to distinguish between them "nové" was just added. So if I would apply that pattern if there would be some "nové děvče" and there would come two girls, one big and one small then one would be call: "velké nové děvče" and the second one "malé nové děvče"
However, it is just my theory and in real communication I would never say about a girl that she is "velké." ne "velké děvče" already before and just to distinguish between them "nové" was just added. So if I would apply that pattern if there would be some "nové děvče" and there would come two girls, one big and one small then one would be call: "velké nové děvče" and the second one "malé nové děvče"
However, it is just my theory and in real communication I would never say something like it. That is not much common for me to use more then one adjective and every time I have to do so in a writing or so I am trying to obey it.
And of course the phrase is a strange one. When would anyone need or want to call a person "a new big girl"? I think the point is just to learn genders of nouns and proper endings for adjectives. I appreciate your tip about placement of adjectives in general, however, in actual Czech speech and writing.
How to arrange adjectives in English if there are more than one? 1. Determiner 2. Number of quantity 3. Opinion 4. Size 5. Age 6. Shape 7. Color 8. Nationality 9. Noun
New is considered as 3, big is considered as 4, and girl is considered as 9. Thus, it would be new big girl.
Let's add more adjectives! Determiner, quantity, and nationality.
"The three new big czech girls".
"The" is considered as 1, theee is considered as 2, new is considered as 3, big is considered as 4, czech is considered as 8, and girls is considered as 9. Thus, it should be written as "the three new big czech girls".
Natural is not always grammatically correct.
Natural is not always grammatically correct.
What is grammatically correct is merely a descriptive reduction of what is natural in (hopefully) a large sample of given examples. As a pretty widely-read native speaker of English, I cannot agree that you should normally put 'new' before 'big' in this instance.
'New big girl' implies that all the girls under consideration are usually big, but this one is new, whereas 'big new girl' implies a new girl who happens also to be big—a much more likely reading. If you were running an all-female weight-loss group and received a new member, you might describe her as a 'new big girl' (a description she might well object to, but that's by the by!), but in most circumstances you'd say 'big new girl', which doesn't emphasise the category of size over that of age.
No doubt the order of adjectives specified in your grammar book works for other examples, but please take my word for it that it doesn't work for this one.
That's a great question! Native English speakers are not taught this, but somehow we learn it anyway. Not an answer to your question (because I'm still an early Czech learner) but here's a link to the proper order for adjectives in English. And yes, size comes before age. https://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/grammar/british-grammar/about-adjectives-and-adverbs/adjectives-order
Nope. Děvče is slightly more formal than dívka and holka.
Dívka is more common in Moravia, holka in Bohemia.
About plurals, I'd say děvčata is more common than dívky which sounds super formal to my ears, while holky sounds really informal.
Your grandmother would be more likely to use děvče than holka while your friend would probably use holka.
There are also diminutives (that we don't teach; it's something to look forward to in Tree 2.0)
So it's a pretty complicated mix of personal/regional preferences. All three words are very common, so we couldn't really pick 'one' to stick with through the entire course.
Yes, "děvče" is, oddly, a neuter word for "girl," and it is not a form of "dítě." That word, however, is also odd, being neuter in the singular and feminine in the plural. (Go figure...)