"Hadde han suksess i den nye rollen sin?"

Translation:Did he have success in his new role?

September 26, 2017

8 Comments

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https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LilTweetingBird

So the "s"s at the end of "suksess" aren't supposed to be pronounced, or is that a glitch in the TTS system?

September 26, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Luke_5.1991

The "suksess" is pronounced correctly here (it's from the French), but the "sin" is positively butchered.

September 26, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LilTweetingBird

Oh, ok.
I noticed how badly the robot failed at pronouncing "sin." Thankfully, there are only a few glitches throughout the tree and we can learn Norwegian without much trouble! Hurra for det norske kurset! Tusen takk.

September 26, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/fveldig
Mod
  • 24

It's pronounced either suksess or sykse :)

(some people might say sukse, which is "incorrect")

September 26, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LilTweetingBird

Interesting (and good) to know, thank you!

March 18, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Moongrovenly

OK (responding to Luke and fveldig), I understand how the French "succès" is pronounced with a silent 's' at the end. Right. But then, are you saying that when Norwegian adopted the word from French, another 's' was added and the pronunciation stayed the same?

I think I'm going to go with the suksess option (thanks, fveldig). I also would say the TTS bot is producing something closer to the incorrect "sukse" than "sykse", but maybe I'm still hearing with my eyes on that one.

August 22, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/fveldig
Mod
  • 24

The problem with loanwords is that when they're loaned, they're commonly used and understood as a loanword (sykse), and so the original spelling is used (the 'succes' form was used until the 1920s). But as time goes by, younger people may fail to realize that it's a loanword, and pronounces it as it is spelled, instead of as a loanword (suksess). Some might realize it's a loanword, but not really understand the phonology of the original language and fail to pronounce it correctly (sukse). All of these are valid and acceptable pronunciations.

Sometimes loanwords have their spelling changed to better reflect the pronunciation (chauffeur -> chauffør -> sjåfør), but this isn't always the case ('interessant', pronounced intresang(t), 'krasj', pronounced kræsj [from English 'crash']), so can be difficult to know if a word is a loanword or not.

This irregularity in spelling, sometimes changing the spelling, sometimes just part of it, leads to some common pronunciation "mistakes". These have a tendency to stick around, leading to some words having multiple accepted pronunciations.

Most commonly foreign foods have a tendency to be incorrectly pronounced, to the point where the "incorrect" pronunciation has become the standard pronunciation. Correctly pronouncing them might even be considered pretentious:

Loanword (Norwegian) Pronunciation English
pommes frites påmfri fries/chips
entrecote/entrecôte entrekå entrecôte
chorizo sjoritso chorizo
August 22, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Moongrovenly

Great answer! Thank you. I see the same tendencies in English too.

An example that comes to mind is 'forte', as in, "making omelettes is my forte". Almost every American would pronounce it "for-tay" as if it were supposed to be 'forté'. And if you asked them why the accent, some wouldn't have an answer, and others would explain that the word came from French. But in actuality the word that it comes from has no accent on the 'e'. Yet the few who know this and hold forth with the correct pronunciation may come across to the majority as being pedantic.

August 22, 2018
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