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"Take a look at your children together."

Translation:Podívejte se spolu na své děti.

November 10, 2017

14 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JohnBraga1

why not podívej se and tvé, or podívejte se and vaše ?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/kacenka9

Podivejte se and vaše as well as Podivejte se and tvé is accepted.

But Podivej se and spolu does not make sense. You cannot tell a single person to look at something together


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ion1122

You seem to be saying that it is the people being addressed who are "together". But I read the sentnce as meaning that the children were "together". In that case, it is not illogical to address one person and ask them to take a look at their children (who are) together.

What would be the Czech sentence for my scenario? "You (sing.) should take a look at your children (who are in a group) together."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AgnusOinas

In that situation, it would have to be "Podívej se na své děti spolu", but I'd prefer to use another word for "together" here: "Podívej se na své děti pohromadě", or even better another clause: "Podívej se na své děti, jak jsou spolu/pohromadě" which makes the togetherness of the children a separate and highlighted piece of information.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Tibro3

Are we discriminating against imaginary people and victims of multiple personality disorders? Sad.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jamie08MD

Because these are two of the examples when you should change the possessive pronoun "můj/tvůj/jeho/její/náš/váš/jejich" for "svůj". Moreover, there is "together - spolu", which means the sentence refers to more than one person and the verb has to be in plural.

Podívejte se spolu na svoje děti. (you pl-your pl) / Podívejte se spolu na moje děti. (you pl-my)/ Podívejte se spolu na tvoje děti. (you pl-your sg) / Podívejte se spolu na její děti. (you pl-her) / etc.

Podívej se na moje děti. / Podívej se na svoje děti. (you sg-your sg) / Podívej se na jeho děti. / Podívej se na naše děti. / Podívej se na vaše děti. (you sg-your pl) / Podívej se na jejich děti. / etc.

Podívám se na svoje děti. (I-my) / Podívám se na tvoje děti. / etc.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DavidMills574753

Just picking up again on JohnPraga1's point again, which I don't think has been completely acknowledged, the English sentence to translate from is ambiguous in that it could mean the children ( possibly playing? ) together, in fact I took it as that which meant I was marked wrong for using the singular verb. I agree this is a trap for English speakers using "you" both for one or several people addressed, and the meaning should be made clear in this case by putting "together" after "take a look" i.e "take a look together at your children"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AgnusOinas

I answered in that thread. If the meaning was that the children are together and you're addressing a single person, you'd have to place the "spolu" at the end in Czech - and it still sounds weird because it still tends to sound like you're addressing more people (spolu) but then the singular (ty) makes you re-interpret the "spolu" as referring to the children. In the right context, it would probably work, but like I said, using "pohromadě" would be better as that is literally "in a heap" and would much more easily refer to the children rather than the addressed party. It's a question as to which variants to accept here.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DavidMills574753

I'm sorry, I think you are misinterpreting my issue. In this exercise we have to translate an ambiguous English sentence to Czech, with at least a 50% chance of getting it wrong even before demonstrating our Czech (lack of) knowledge. I'm saying the English should be written differently to make it clearer what is intended in the Czech. Translating from you/your in English is always potentially ambiguous unless the context or word order or word content makes it clear whether speaking to one or more than one person. In this case it could be easily done by moving the adverb "together" as I described. By the way, I do realise that in straight "you" translations Duolingo always accepts the singular or the plural in Czech, but this exercise is not straightforward.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AgnusOinas

Yes, I understood. The point is, I'm not sure if the better way to solve this conundrum is to change the English sentence or to accept the other meaning in Czech in some form. There are usually potential pitfalls in that changing something to fix one thing opens doors to other problems. That's why I'd like some input from my colleagues on this issue, and thus far I've only been discussing the problem rather than jumping to quick fixes.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BoneheadBass

@AO, there is, as I write, no Reply button for your later post, so here I am. FWIW...

I agree that the English sentence is ambiguous. And to me, something like, "Take a look together at your children" or "Together, take a look at your children" is weird, though the first feels a little less weird.

But I read the Czech sentence unambiguously as putting the parents, rather than the children, "together." And if the English-to-Czech sentence were "Take a look together at your children," my translation (at least on a good day) would be what the Czech sentence is now.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AgnusOinas

So you would agree with changing the English sentence (i.e. main translation) to "Take a look together at your children" to avoid ambiguity? Will the anticipated amount of complainers that it's not a very natural word order in English be low? :))


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BoneheadBass

It would be more accurate to say that I can Live With changing the main English translation to "Take a look together at your children." :-}

It might make the English-to-Czech exercise less confusing, annoying, or disheartening for some users. As for potential "unnatural word order" complaints, IMO, it is an unnatural word order, so I would hardly blame anyone who makes that point. On the other hand, there are plenty of reports for it, so clearly there are learners out there who have no problem with it. :-)

PS - I deleted the original of this post -- which was to a "reply" to me -- b/c the Reply button for your post appeared after I added mine. Go figure.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AgnusOinas

@BHB: The reply buttons seem to be playing hide and seek today.

Let's change the main translation then. If we get too many complaints, we can always change it back... /shrug/

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