"虽然那条裤子很便宜,但是不舒服。"

Translation:Although that pair of pants is cheap, it is not comfortable.

November 20, 2017

106 Comments
This discussion is locked.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/uwaaa

"Although those pants are cheap, they're uncomfortable" should also be added


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/roman2095

Yes I was wondering if I should put "it is not comfortable" (which most native English speakers would not say) to match the verb, and I thought they must surely accept "they are not comfortable" which most people would say, but sadly it was not the case. This course requires more input from native English speakers.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Geoff470860

They are not comfortable is obviously correct.
'It is not comfortable' is definitely incorrect.....who vets this stuff??


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ChiNane

Yeah, i just ran into that same trap.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JaydenLaury

moreovere, it is the same as in the hint page.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sojumonkey

Again with the discrimination against users of British English! Trousers! :-)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JamieAYat

褲子 trousers should be ok


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/carpiediem

The English translation is pretty strange. It send to imply that all cheap pants should be comfortable, with this being said exception. Would "those pants are cheap, but not comfortable," be a better translation? Or is the Chinese version making the same strange implication?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LuisJp3

I feel strange with this pair of a reason and a result. I prefer to "Although those pants are cheap, they are comfortable." or "Although those pants are expensive, they aren't comfortable." I would like to propose to change the original Chinese sentence.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/CinnamonTe1

The Chinese phrase is correct. The 虽然, 但是 construct translates to either "although" or "but" in English. If one of them doesn't sound right, you can try the other one.

Although those pants are cheap, they are not comfortable.
Those pants are cheap, but they are not comfortable.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/roman2095

The speaker is saying that the fact that they are cheap is a plus, but the fact that they are not comfortable is a minus. He is not linking cause and effect between the two, just weighing up the pros and cons as to whether he will buy them.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/e.l.l.i.e.

It's hard to directly translate this sentence structure directly because it's not how we use "although" in English, but that's the closest translation word for word. I would say this structure would be used to present contrasting points. The best way to understand the idea of the sentence in English would be like if someone was like "Wow, those pants are cheap" and you respond "Yeah they cheap, but they're not comfortable. I wouldn't wear them". (As always would love if a native speaker could confirm this?)

tl;dr Your translation is right, but no direct English translation quite captures the idea of "although this is a valid point, this is another thing to consider" the way the Mandarin sentence does.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RobinThor

This seems to be a general problem of this lesson, even in the grammar section. Seems like the authors have a different understanding of the word although than me.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/cvet

If this is the case, this should be made clear with more context. For example, "this is the reason why I don't want to buy them"...


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AndyP0987654321

For goodness sake, TROUSERS should be correct! It's even in the dictionary hints! How many times must we report it?!!!

...so frustrating.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/aizixin

In British English pants are underwear; we wear Trousers on the outside


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/aindriu80

'it is not comfortable' doesn't sound right for pants but 'they are not comfortable' should be accepted.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RichardWrigley

"Although those TROUSERS are cheap, they are not comfortable."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Brett506171

Again I get the you have a typo in your answer error. This is clearly a bug in the system as I select the correct answer using the supplied words!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/albizgil

This seems to happen when shortened forms that use apostrophes are split up! This one had "are" and "n't" which turn into "are n't" in the answer. I think the extra space is what registers as a typo.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Juan49481

Pants and pair take the plural 'they are' - that might not seem logical since you talking about one item of clothing, but that's just how the English language works.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/johnsark

These lessons are all messed up! Practically every other perfectly fine English translation that I submit is marked as incorrect! It's getting really frustrating!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/VWieVendetta

The course is still in beta! The people making it can't possibly account for everything people will input, and the further down the tree, the fewer people have submitted feedback. It's annoying but if you submit feedback you'll make it better for those after you!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Iwilleatyouall

It's not in beta any more, and yet this is still a huge issue.

The people making it can and should account for some of the more obvious variations, especially if they are similar to other corrections that they have had to make. This question is a classic example. Here we have a collective noun (a pair of pants) that is referred to as singular, but really it's equally valid to refer to a collective noun as plural. It can vary with region and context, but most of the people I know would say, "That pair of pants are uncomfortable."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DestinationVoid

I've just answered using words Dou gave me:

"Although those trousers are cheap, they aren't comfortable."

WRONG! Should have used "pants" instead of "trousers"!

Damn you Duo!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JamesLick

Keep reporting the errors and they'll eventually fix it.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Juan49481

People don't bother to say a 'pair of pants' these days; just 'pants' will do, and that takes the plural.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/hippietrail

This should accept "that pair of pants/trousers" as well.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jpolin

"Although thar pair of pants is very cheap, it's uncomfortable" should be accepted


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Puffin222

It's is a singular referance as a pair of pants/trousers are the reference they are uncomfortable would be a better translation


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/VemSrG5r

"That pair of pants is cheap, but it is not comfortable." Why is this incorrect?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PeaceJoyPancakes

I guess Duolingo is trying to teach that "虽然" should be translated as "although".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/baharem

Is "...they're not.." grammatically wrong? (as opposed to "...they aren't...")


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/hippietrail

Both are grammatically correct. If one isn't accepted, submit it as an answer that should be accepted.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sakura89phoenix

但是 is but. It should be said 'but they are not comfortable'


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Lexie218004

'that pair' is singular, then the next part of sentence should be 'it is not comfortable' and not 'they are' There is a lack of consistency here, which happens fairly frequently.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PeaceJoyPancakes

Edited.

It probably does make sense for the verbs in the two halves of the sentence to be consistent for stylistic reasons.

Interestingly, because of the phenomenon in English and other languages called (among other names) "synesis" or "notional agreement", this is a sentence that people will probably have different approaches to, on the basis of individual or regional preference, when it comes to making the verbs singular or plural. With this in mind I think both "that pair is" with "it is" and "that pair are" with "they are" should be marked correct, and it's even possible that one or more combinations of the two conjugations will seem natural to a lot of English speakers.

In any event, as of the original date of this comment, there was a lot of inconsistency in the course as a whole, but 10 months later as I edit, I do see things improving quite a bit.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/arukihenro

The "correct" answer is a non sequitur.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Benno1010

Hmmm, we are tought chenglish here!!!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Juan49481

People have stopped saying 'a pair of pants' -> 'those pants' is sufficient


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PeaceJoyPancakes

Huh? Stopped saying it? When did that happen?

(I agree, though, that "those pants" should be accepted here.)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Juan49481

It pains me to say 'that pair of pants' when 'those pants' is more natural.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Athina747872

Your translation irritates me! Sometimes you say wrong although it is right


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mikey_dredz

It just seems wrong to me to refer to a pair of pants/trousers as "it" (singular). Imagine the dialogue "Mate, I love those pants!".. "yeah I bought it from Target!"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Javkhaa

there is a word "but" in Chinese version,


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PeaceJoyPancakes

Yes, but in English, where you have two clauses and one is meant to be the main or independent clause (i.e. where the main clause is explicitly stated and not merely implied), you can't start the first clause with "although" and the second with "but", as that would give you two dependent clauses and no main clause, which is ungrammatical.

If the Chinese sentence starts with "虽然", use "although", but if it only has "但是", use "but". That's the conventional way for these conjunctions to be translated.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Aleksandro_RU

And what if it is without "although"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PeaceJoyPancakes

I assume you mean a sentence with "but" instead of "although". That would be a good translation for a sentence with "但是" by itself without "虽然".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KevinAbel13

I cannot get duolingo to accept an answer for this one. I will use what is posted above and see if it works. This one part is giving me a difficult time. I hope duolingo fixes it soon but I see remarks from a year ago.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/NathanRasm
  • Although X, Y ~ X, but Y
  • pants ~ trousers
  • that pair of ... it is ~ those ... they are ~ that pair of ... they are
  • not ~ -n't ~ un-

36 variants, you can type them all out in 5 minutes. Now if somebody at Duolingo would do so, we could carry on learning our language instead of memorizing translation trivia.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Leighchina

Are and is incorrect again


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/maartendoc

衤= clothes radical

裙子 (qúnzi) = dress
裤子 (kùzi) = pants


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ElderRW

I feel the system is wrong to make you lose a heart for just mistyping one word!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Leelamadhu2

Pair of pants or only pants ?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PeaceJoyPancakes

"Those pants" should be accepted. We don't need a measure word in English.

However, in Chinese the measure word makes it clear that there's only one pair.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/johnsark

I wrote: "Although those pants are cheap but they are not comfortable." It was marked wrong! This is the third time I am trying to answer this question. I am really running out of options.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/carpiediem

I don't think you can have both "although" and "but" in the same sentence, in English...


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Aleksandro_RU

But should it accept "those pants are cheap but they are not comfortable"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PeaceJoyPancakes

The meaning is effectively the same (though there is a slightly different emphasis) and you can try reporting the version with "but". However, it's convention to translate sentences containg "虽然" with "although" instead of "but", so that's what you'll often see.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/hippietrail

Well in this case your English was not grammatical. You can't use "but" like that. The sentence should be accepted as correct without "but".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/CraigSkeel

"Although those are cheap pants..." was not accepted. I reported it, as I think any difference in meaning or connotation would be too slight to invalidate my answer.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jay318707

Some of the words for the English translation aren't showing up. This is not the first time this has happened.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RadoslawPa6

I cannot picture myself ever saying this sentence in English. i would probably not moan about how comfortable the trousers are if they are cheap. Now if the trousers were expensive and they were uncomfortable then stand back and watch me complaining!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/roman2095

He is just weighing up whether he will buy them - they are cheap but since they are not comfortable he probably won't buy them.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AlexZhao12

"Even though" should be accepted.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/pierobonal

Traduzioni opinabili.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LiXueLong1

In English: 'Although that pair of trousers is cheap, it is/they are not comfortable'. Never, N E V E R say 'pants' [内裤 Nèikù] in English when you mean trousers!!! ;-)))


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Iwilleatyouall

That's an English thing. English people say "pants" when they mean "underpants". The rest of the English speaking world, not so much. "Trousers" to me implies slightly formal, like something you'd wear to work. Jeans are not trousers.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LiXueLong1

'Although that pair of trousers is cheap, they are not comfortable.' -- NOT accepted! :-(


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Anon341685

I find the English translation strange. Those pants are not comfortable seems much better than that pair of pants is not comfortable. One can argue why they are pair, but one should be consistent surely.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/CarolAdams20

Really should decide to either use pair or pants or just pants especially when you decide it is wrong. I feel it's more of a lesson to remember what translation you want!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/3VdObMzF

AI does not accept that 很 is translated!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Mariyammy

The same sentence in the tips section is translated as "Although that pair of pants is cheap, (but) they are not comfortable", yet it is not accepted as a correct answer here (without (but)). 为什么?!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LeonardoVa599067

I'm not a native english speaker but I can't understand why I have to write "....pair of pants is cheap, it is not comfortable" I don't think that's right.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LeonardoVa599067

I'm not a native english speaker but I can't understand why I have to write "....pair of pants is cheap, it is not comfortable" I don't think that's right.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PeaceJoyPancakes

It's not wrong.

Better to copy the sentence you tried, and paste it into your comment, so we can tell you if it should have been accepted or not.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Barry331764

there is a grammar error. "they are not comfortable."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jb5000

The sentence is a mess, this is very unnatural for a native English speaker. It would be better to conatruct a sentence/statement such as, "That pair of pants are cheap, and uncomfortable".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/kewjab

It's normal to use they instead of it when referring to a pair of something


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/kewjab

Using it rather than they sounds quite wrong in English


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Flora85713

Sometimes the translation made me feel that i'm spending my time for some rubbish!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Veronika961049

Uncomfortable should be correct !!!!! Also pants = are !!!!! Not 'is'


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/888Bruce888

Translation obviously written by someone with very poor command of English. As all English speakers know, a pair of pants is never referred to as 'it', only by 'they'. How annoying to be marked "wrong" for something like this, how embarrassing for Duo. Reflects poorly on quality of course.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/_mrdisaster_

It doesn't accept a translation that instead of starting with "although"+consequence , uses affirmative+"but". This construction is actually in the tips!!!!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PeaceJoyPancakes

Well, the tips say that English uses "although" or "but", whereas Chinese "usually" uses both "虽然" and "但是", but every translation example uses "although", with "but" only in brackets to suggest the structure of the Chinese. (I'm not sure that the "usually" part is correct.)

In any event, in spite of Duolingo's tips, sentences with both "虽然" and "但是" are typically translated with "although", while sentences with only "但是" or "可是" are typically translated with "but".


"Consequence" is wrong. "Although" is a subordinating conjunction (it introduces a subordinate clause), whereas "but" is a coordinating conjunction (it introduces a coordinate clause).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/_mrdisaster_

Thanks for the terminology, I studied grammar in another language ;) What I meant to say is that in English the sentences " although this is cheap, it's uncomfortable " AND " this is cheap, but it's uncomfortable " are absolutely equivalent in meaning, so regardless of the Chinese construct they should both be accepted. The type of conjunction is -as you point out- different, but that's just due to where it sits in the sentence.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PeaceJoyPancakes

Yes, more or less, though there might be a slight difference in emphasis, and a subordinate clause introduced by "although" can actually come before or after the independent clause, so "although" can also sit in the middle of the sentence, but the position of the clauses would be reversed.

You can try reporting the version with "but", but just note that on Duolingo and elsewhere you'll tend to see sentences with "虽然" translated with "although".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SteveWoodinOz

Plural or singular? Consitency please. Pair is plural.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PeaceJoyPancakes

"Pair" is singular, which is why we say "a pair", and not "some pair". However, for verb agreement, some speakers treat it as notionally plural, and for some it depends on the specific context.

Do report any legitimate versions of this sentence that aren't accepted.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LeonBland

Danshi means but or however so why is wrong to use these words


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PeaceJoyPancakes

Translating word for word doesn't work in this case.

It's convention to translate sentences containg "虽然" with "although" instead of "but". However, if we leave out "although" at the beginning of the first clause, we can use "but" or "however" at the begining of the second, with effectively the same meaning.

But unlike in Chinese, in English we can't have "although" beginning the first clause, and "but" or "however" beginning the second, because that gives us two dependent clauses, and no independent clause, and that doesn't work grammatically.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SteveWG222

normally people would say "..., they are not comfortable "


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/swamidhyansuraj

They don't accept "reasonable." I think it's ridiculous.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BaskerGeor

Don't you guys have consistency?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Daftyman

"although that pair of trousers is cheap, they are not comfortable". I always refer to trousers, jeans, shorts as they. Never it. Maybe the match should be are cheap and are not comfortable.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Kevirish

Although that pair of pants is cheap, "it is not comfortable". No native speaker would ever say that!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/lexicalgap

Really shouldn't need to explicitly say the although in English.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PeaceJoyPancakes

That's not quite accurate. We do need an explicit conjunction.

We need "(al)though" for the first clause, or "but" or perhaps "however" for the second clause, but in English we can't have a conjunction at the beginning of both clauses, as that would be ungrammatical.

Chinese, on the other hand, can have both "虽然" and "但是", or it can get away with just "但是".

Sentences with "虽然" are conventionally translated with "although", and sentences with only "但是" are conventionally translated with "but". However, the sense is effectively the same, though perhaps with a minor difference in nuance.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JohnDeigha

Answer should end "they are not comfortable"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Andres.Campe

"Although that trousers are cheap they are uncomfortable"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PeaceJoyPancakes

"Trousers" is plural so it requires "those", not "that".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AndrewRodi6

A pair of pants cannot be referred to as "it is" in this context, to use "they are" instead is correct.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MONSTERPIG

Even though there pants are very cheap, they aren't comfortable.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/hippietrail

You can't use "there" before a noun like this in English. It should be "those pants".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/axiopisty

Your translation is incorrect for two reasons: first, it would be their instead of there, second, the Chinese sentence does not imply who owns the pants, so it is incorrect to assume "their" pants. They might be his pants, our her pants. But specifically, according to the Chinese sentence, it says: this pair of pants.

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