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  5. "You all help him."

"You all help him."

Translation:Ihr helft ihm.

December 13, 2017

75 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Fast-Eddy1

What's wrong with "Ihr alle helft ihm." Because I used 'alle', it was marked wrong.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Tuman88

I'm a native German speaker and I think this should be correct. "Ihr alle helft ihm." is a correct German sentence.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PatrickKat6

It seems that they have corrected; I have tried it and it worked. However, I have tried before Ihr helft ihm alle, because in an earlier example, with all of us, they put alle to the end; however, it hasn't worked with me, I do not know why!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AlvinaVrr

Correct indeed. Suggestion to Duolingo team: to avoid confusion around the "all" disappearing in English: why not using a form such as "Julia and Karl, you help him" so it's clear that the subject is not singular but plural?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PeterHorle

Yep stupid. Ihr alle helft ihm. Is correct


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SayantanAdhikari

Ihr helfen ihm... This marked wrong Why? Helfen is prural right?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

"I helps him... this marked wrong Why? Helps is singular right?"

German doesn't have a "plural verb form" any more than English has a "singular verb form".

wir helfen (we help) and sie helfen (they help) have the same verb form but ihr helft (you [all] help) has a different verb form.

Not so much different from how "I help" and "you help" have the same verb form but "he helps" has a different verb form. There isn't just one "singular" or "plural" verb form -- in either language!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/kim1947

the word "all" is missed in translation


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

Sentences containing "you all" are those added by the Pearson team for their course - they use that phrase to indicate that they expect the answer ihr rather than du.

I suppose that both ihr and ihr alle should be accepted in that case but generally they do not.

Report the other version if you like.

Eventually, the Pearson sentences will be removed from the public course but I do not know when.

Edit: This never happened. So we're stuck with the Pearson sentences for the foreseeable future.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/lexbroch

"Eventually, the Pearson sentences will be removed from the public course but I do not know when." Is the private course strictly DuoLingo with out the Pearson additions?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

It's all a bit mixed up, unfortunately.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Joffen1

The confusion here is that Pearson is using American English, not British (and therefore English) English. The correct, original English usage is "You" not "You all". If courses use American English as a default, they need to say so, in order that English people know to be on the lookout for the American version of English.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Buddha_Bunny

And to add on to the "rather than du" bit, using "du"would be incorrect. The sentence demands a plural. Only "ihr helft..." or "Sie helfen..." are correct.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Alejandro1660207

So it should rather be "you (pl.)", to indicate it's the plural form of "you"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RyanTip

Why is the formal case not accepted here?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

This is a sentence created by the Pearson cooperation ( https://www.duolingo.com/comment/24066422 ).

They didn't add a version of the sentence with Sie in it -- perhaps they forgot or simply didn't think to add it.

Report the missing alternative if you'd like.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/az_p
Mod

    It is now.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/FrankEdger

    "You all" is okay, but where I live we prefer "y'all" or "all y'all." :)


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Kevin606066

    Where I live we would say "yinz"


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/NitaWest1

    Where I live there is no plural form of 'you', so I read it as You - all help, not You all - help.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DawsonDarl

    Now, why not euch for "you all" here?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

    Because euch is dative or accusative (object form), but here "you all" is the subject and so you need the nominative case: ihr.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DawsonDarl

    Right, thanks for the reminder!


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/rcjudyh

    Why is it helft and not helfen. Wouldn't you all be more than one person?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

    Why is it helft and not helfen.

    Because the subject is ihr, and ihr has verb forms that end in -t.

    Wouldn't you all be more than one person?

    Yes.

    But just as English doesn't have "a singular verb form" (we don't say "he sleeps and I sleeps"), so German doesn't have "a plural verb form" (we don't say wir helfen und ihr helfen).

    The verb ending -en in German is for wir (we) and for sie (they) but not for ihr (you - plural). It's not "the plural verb form" any more than -s is "the singular verb form" in English.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/simomura1

    Thank you for your support.

    [Singular] I: Ich lerne Deutsch. you: Du lernst Deutsch. (you: Sie lernen Deutsch.) he: Er lernt Deutsch. she: Sie lernt Deutsch.

    [Multiple] we: Wir lernen Deutsch. you: Ihr lernt Deutsch. ⇒ This case they: Sie lernen Deutsch.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AllenHowar1

    Shouldn't you be saying that the second person plural has it's own verb form as opposed to the first and third persons?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Christine963062

    Why did they add "all" to the sentence when they intended to only to ask for "they"?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/lexbroch

    As an English speaker I would say "All of you help him" in contrast to "You all help him"


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/TheDet1

    I am a native german speaker and i think: "Ihr helft ihm alle." oder "Ihr alle helft ihm." is correct.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Robbydud

    I think should be able say, Sie alle helfen ihm this was marked wrong


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

    Report it as a missing alternative if you'd like.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/qGr24eaA

    I've noticed a couple of people saying they've used certain words and been marked down. As there doesn't appear to be a keyboard option (at least on the web) and there isn't a button to press, how are they using alternative words?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

    there doesn't appear to be a keyboard option (at least on the web)

    That's odd -- I thought it was only on the web where there was a little icon at the bottom of translation exercises allowing you to switch between a tapping exercise with a word bank and a typing exercise where you could enter free text.

    It's possible that you're on the "wrong" side of an A/B test -- Duolingo is constantly testing various changes to see how they affect the learning process, and so Duolingo does not act identically for everyone.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LeoBlackma3

    I've never noticed a word bank / typing icon. I'll have to keep a look out.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AlexandraL588281

    hi. i have a question. based on " meinem hund schmeckt das essen" , out of curiosity, i put here "ihm helft ihr" and was marked wrong. could anybody help clear this for me? thanks


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/stanmann

    @AlexandraL588281: Since no one more fluent in German has responded to your query, I will, with limited fluency, try. In your first sentence, “my dog” is the subject and should, therefore, be in the nominative case, i.e., “mein Hund.” You have used the dative (indirect object) case, and that’s wrong. And nouns in German being capitalized, “das essen” should be “das Essen”. Your second sentence appears to be grammatically correct, that is, the correct words and endings are used, but it is so damn awkward (“him help you”) that I would say it is wrong. It should be “you (plural) help him,” that is, “ihr helft ihm.” If I’m wrong, I’d appreciate someone more fluent correcting me.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AmitVaid3

    Why helft is used in this Everywhere else duo is using hilft


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

    helft is the verb form to use when the subject is ihr (= you, several people)

    hilft is the verb form to use when the subject is one of er, sie, es (he, she, it)


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Craig136066

    Why not "Alle helft ihm"?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Melanietjr

    Why not "du hilfst mir"?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

    Why not "du hilfst mir"?

    mir means "me", not "him"

    du is for speaking to one person, not several at once ("you all").


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/simomura1

    4.Akkusa Direct object: Acts directly on purpose. 3.Dative indirect object: affects the purpose. (Subjects who feel or feel motions) So "help" corresponds to 3 above. So it ’s “mir”. I learned that way.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Christophe991791

    Shouldn't eure/euer also work here?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

    Shouldn't eure/euer also work here?

    No -- why do you think that a word meaning "your" would work in this sentence?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/IanisDonic

    You all implies that there are more than one people.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

    Yes.

    But you cannot say "Your help him".

    You can say "You help him" but not "Your".

    eure and euer mean "your", not "you".


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Brett240917

    What is the difference between hilft and helft?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

    What is the difference between hilft and helft?

    Please read the comment thread started by AmitVaid3 instead of repeating the question.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ksjc

    I'm confused because there's no indication if "Ihr" is "she" or "they", I put "ihr helfen ihm", because it is supposed to mean "they help him", but that was wrong. Can anybody explain how i would know the difference by looking at this sentence?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

    I'm confused because there's no indication if "Ihr" is "she" or "they"

    Uh, what?

    "she" and "they" are sie, not ihr.

    ihr could the possessive form of those pronouns ("her ...; their ..."), but there is no following noun here.

    ihr as a subject pronoun means "you" (when speaking to several people at a once). ihr requires verb forms in -t, as in ihr trinkt, ihr esst, ihr denkt, ihr wascht, ....

    "they help him" would be sie helfen ihm.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/wsiev13

    Why does their example not have "alle" for all. would not the English translation of what they have be "you help him"? This translation does not not make sense to me.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

    Why does their example not have "alle" for all.

    Please see the comment thread started by Kim1947.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/VictorPalmer

    I am just curious, but I have heard that use of the dative cases can allow one to play with word order in German. So, I tried, Ihm helft ihr, just to see if that would work, and it was marked incorrect. Which is fine, because I said it backwards.

    BUT, out of curiosity, can you switch datives around and be understood? Ihm helft ihr or Ihr ihm helft ? I just had read there was a greater freedom with sentences in German, than in English.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/iongantas

    It told me the answer should be "sie helfen ihm". Would that not be they help him?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

    It told me the answer

    "the answer" implies that there is exactly one answer. But nearly all sentences have more than one acceptable translation. So at most, Duo might tell you that the following is "an answer".

    "sie helfen ihm". Would that not be they help him?

    sie helfen ihm is indeed "they help him".

    But Sie helfen ihm is "you help him" -- Sie (always capitalised) is the formal "you" (like Lei in Italian or Usted in Spanish or vous in French).

    As a full sentence (where the first word is always capitalised), you can't tell the difference between the two.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/andreirt

    Why is it ihm instead of ihn? Why are we using the dative instead of the akkusative? (I guess it's something like 'I give help to him') How can we know when do recognize which one to use?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

    Why is it ihm instead of ihn? Why are we using the dative instead of the akkusative?

    Because the verb helfen takes an object in the dative case. Just something you have to memorise for this verb, and a handful of other ones, such as danken, folgen, gefallen, gehören, antworten.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BOYINAVAMS

    "you all" refers to plural but Duo used "helft" singular verb. Help me please


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

    "you all" refers to plural but Duo used "helft" singular verb.

    helft is never singular. It's second person plural (for the subject ihr).

    Third person singular would be (er/sie/es) hilft, with a changed vowel.

    Remember that ihr takes verb forms ending in -t: ihr trinkt, ihr esst, ihr helft, ...


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ReedFrisch1

    Ihr can me y'all. One thing I think is funny is one of my friends who is a native German and lives in Germany uses y'all a bunch despite never living in the US yet alone the South East.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Skyler2Rash

    While everybody's confused on 'Ihr', I'm wondering why the dative form of 'Ihn' is being used. Is this because the verb 'helfen' is one of those verbs that automatically turns the accusative objects into dative cases?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

    helfen takes an object in the dative case: ich helfe dir; du hilfst mir; wir helfen dem Mann; ihr helft der Frau.

    (I wouldn't describe it as "turning an accusative object into a dative case", though.)


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Klaudia80414

    Why "du hilfst ihm" is wrong?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

    Why "du hilfst ihm" is wrong?

    Because du is only for talking to one person.

    "you all" is used for talking to several people at once.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Bettina818098

    I don't understand how "Ihr helft ihm" (marked correct) translates to "you all help him" instead of "you help him" (alle was not an option from the given words)


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Steve982000

    Why isn't it "helfen" as "you all" implies plural?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

    Why isn't it "helfen"

    Because ihr verb forms end in -t, not in -en.

    "you all" implies plural?

    That's irrelevant. "I" implies singular but that doesn't mean that we use "the singular form 'helps'" in English, as in "I helps".

    German doesn't have "a plural form" for verbs any more than English has "a singular form".


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BeSafeDear

    Ihr helft ihm alle seems to be more correct!


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RogerioPer47008

    So the verb asks for dativ? It's more like "you give help to him"?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

    So the verb asks for dativ?

    Yes.

    It's more like "you give help to him"?

    If that helps you remember that helfen takes the dative case.

    But some verbs require the dative case that can't be explained with "give" (jemandem danken = thank someone / give thanks to someone, but jemandem folgen = follow someone = give ... to someone??).


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Joffen1

    "You all" is an American colloquialism. Please remove it. Correct English is "You help him". To include "all" generates confusion for speakers of English who do not use American English, as they think they need to supply an separate word for "all".


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Thorondor95

    The command form of this sentence ('hilft ihn' if I'm not mistaken) should be accepted, but it isn't. Either that, or you should be told whether or not this is the command form.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

    Commands usually end in an exclamation mark "!".


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Joffen1

    "You all" is American English, not British (and therefore English) English. The correct English phrase is "You help him". Please correct this.

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