"Viděla jsem je odcházet spolu."

Translation:I saw them leave together.

February 10, 2018

6 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/zubkov318
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Why not "Viděla jsem je odcházeli spolu"? Why "odcházet" is in infinitive for here?

February 10, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/ortocymen
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In English you have also 'I saw them leave together.' and not left.

To be correct from linguistic point of view: declination is done on verb called predicate which creates with a noun/pronoun called subject foundation for syntagma. On these two are connected all other words in sentence. Like objects, adverbial of place, time, manner... or attribute. For example in sentence "Já jím jablko" is "já" subject, "jím" predicate and "jablko" is an object connected to noun in 4th case.¨

In upper sentence the first verb is predicate, so it is declinated to express tense etc. Odcházet on other hand is here in form of object, so it is in infinitive form.

I hope it helps.

February 10, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/zubkov318
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> In English you have also 'I saw them leave together.' and not left.

I think it is not always correct to compare English and Czech constructions. For example in Russian language construction like this is not correct.

> I hope it helps.

Not much. Because what is the role of "je" in your description? I see here the full second part: "je odcházet spolu" as object. And "je odcházet" I cannot understand. It might be "je odcházeli", "je odešli", "je odchází" or even "je odcházejíce" (not sure the word form is correct).

I can suppose that such constructions are allowed in Czech like in English too. But I would prefer to have some description of that.

February 10, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/ortocymen
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Comparing with English is not totaly out, they are both Indoeuropean languages and both follow the same principle in the deepest roots :) I don't know Russian, but declination of non predicate seems strange to me.

OK, I did mistake (partly for simplification) but it does not change anything. Syntax is not necessary to learn Czech, it's just to explain certain things and for linguistics.

"Viděla jsem je odcházet spolu."

  • "viděla jsem" = (I) saw, predicate
  • "je" = them, object
  • "odcházet" = to leave, complement (not object)
  • "spolu" = together, adverbial of manner

TLDR: "odcházet" is not predicate, thus it is not declined

February 11, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/zubkov318
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Yes, but at the same time Czech is closer to Russian than to English, I think. I understand word-by-word translation. And even if I do it to Russian, it will be bad phrase, but still some meaning could be extracted from it. But with English-Russian example - there is many constructions that can not be mapped directly. And I sure in Czech-English too, like double negation for example. So what I want to understand is why this construction is allowed in Czech and some generic rule how it is used and when.

> TLDR: "odcházet" is not predicate, thus it is not declined

I do not understand why it is not a predicate when it is bound to "je". It is obviousely to me that "je odcházet" is subject+predicate.

February 11, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/ortocymen
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There are several reasons why it is not a predicate:

  • subject has to be in 1st case, "je" is 4th case (Koho, co) :)
  • "je" is an object in this sentence clearly bound to verb to see: "I saw them"
  • there is only one clause in the sentece, so only one subject+predicate

Though it is possible to have "odcházet" as subject in sentence with the same meaning, but there are 2 clauses.

  • "Viděla jsem je, jak odcházeli spolu"
  • I saw them, how they left together.

Two clauses, two subject+predicate. First is (já)+viděla jsem, the second "oni odcházeli". Is it more clear to you? :)

February 11, 2018
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