"Tu lui as remis la lettre en mains propres ?"

Translation:Did you hand the letter to him personally?

April 6, 2018

28 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/Hunter_Paul

Does not accept "Did you hand him the letter personally"? which is common usage in English

April 6, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/Sitesurf

One question for you: does the placement of "personally" after "the letter" instead of after "him" alter the meaning of the sentence at all? In other words, can your variant mean "Did you personally hand him the letter?". Thanks.

April 6, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/Andy353763

No. Adverb placement can float around for emphasis, and in this case the meaning does not change.

April 15, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/Sitesurf

Thanks. I was asking because if you say "Lui as-tu donné la lettre personnellement ?", "personnellement" can apply to "tu" or to "lui".

April 15, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/Andy353763

Ah, okay. This is nuanced, but there is a difference between the two cases. In the case when the adverb associates with tu/you, the question seeks whether [you personally] handed him the letter (i.e. if you delegated someone else to hand the letter to him). In the other case, where the adverb associates with lui/him, it asks whether you handed him the letter to [him personally] (i.e. if you handed the letter to his associate, but not him).

In the case, "Did you hand him the letter personally?", which is commonly used in English, it is ambiguous whether personally associates with you or him. It did not really occur to me that the adverb would associate with the subject or direct object instead of the verb.

In trying to learn French, I am also learning more about English.

April 15, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/Sitesurf

That's what I had guessed, many thanks!

April 16, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/CinnamonTe1

I've read your post twice and I cant seem to understand the difference you found.

when the adverb associates with tu/you, the question seeks whether [you personally] handed him the letter (i.e. if you delegated someone else to hand the letter to him). In the other case, where the adverb associates with lui/him, it asks whether you handed him the letter to [him personally] (i.e. if you handed the letter to his associate, but not him)

There is a difference between personally handing someone a letter and hand delivering a letter.

You cannot honestly say you personally gave a letter to someone if you had someone else do it on your behalf or actually delivered it to their associate.

The answer would be no and you would explain it was hand delivered by your assistant or hand delivered to their assistant.

March 14, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/CinnamonTe1

Did you hand the letter to him personally ?
Did you hand the letter personally to him ?
Did you hand him the letter personally ?
Did you personally hand the letter to him ?
Did you personally hand him the letter ?

The placement of "personally" makes no difference. All of these questions mean the same exact thing.

To "personally" hand a letter to someone means that both parties have to be involved in the exchange. One party personally gives the letter and the other party personally receives the letter. You only need to use "personally" once because otherwise it is redundant.

Did you personally hand the letter to him personally ?

No one uses this phrasing unless they have doubts about whether the person actually made a direct exchange with the other person. It's intentionally redundant because the question is being asked in an interrogative way.

March 14, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/lulularosa

But the question of both being present is exactly what is nuanced. The two phrases are not the same. In one the question is 'did you (not someone else) give it..' ; in the other 'did you give it to him directly (not through some other party)'

March 14, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/CinnamonTe1

You can "give" someone something directly or indirectly.

You cannot "hand" someone something indirectly. Handing something to someone is an action that is performed directly by you.

"Did you hand it to him?" (Direct)

"Did you have it handed to him?" (Direct/Indirect)

The English translation is faulty and should be changed to:

Did you have the letter given to him by hand?
Did you have the letter personally handed to him?
Did you have the letter handed to him?

March 14, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/lulularosa

But, as I read it, there is something intrinisic to the French that is missing in "Did you hand it to him?"

How would you ask, in English, "Did you hand it to him, not his partner?" without using "not his partner"?

March 14, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/CinnamonTe1

"Did you have the letter directly given to him by hand ?"

"Did you have the letter personally handed to him ?"

Whether the person being asked handed it to him or someone else has doesn't matter if you ask this way.

The official English translation is asking only whether you specifically handed the letter to him.

March 15, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/glaceon953

Arent ''en main propre'' and ''en mains propres'' both correct usages of this expression? I have seen both used interchangeably, there is some discussion regarding usage, as in if the recipient recieved what was delivered using one or both hands, but regarding meaning, I don't find a difference between the two. Any thoughts on this?

August 3, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/Sitesurf

Both are correct indeed, even if the plural is more common nowadays.

http://www.laculturegenerale.com/en-main-propre-pluriel-definition-2/

The hand is the recipient's who is expected to use one to take the thing brought to him/her. But it might depend on the size of the thing, don't you think?

August 9, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/Mija438073

Why not 'return the letter to him personally." Why must it be 'hand the letter to him'?

November 23, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/Sitesurf

"Remettre quelque chose à quelqu'un" does not mean "return" but "hand sth over to sb"

November 23, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/Mija438073

Thanks

November 24, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/LesterOlso

Personally could be placed after the word you without changing the meaning. "Did you personally hand the letter to him?" should be accepted, in my opinion

April 24, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/Sitesurf

The point discussed in this thread is that it is not the meaning of the French sentence: "en mains propres" at the end means in "his own hands" not "you personally".

April 24, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/CinnamonTe1

Asking if a letter was hand delivered to a recipient is different from asking someone if they handed the letter to the person themselves.

The English translation of "did you hand" is incorrect if the question is only focused on the recipient getting the letter in their hands. "To hand" someone something in English means you have done it yourself.

The French "remettre" or "as remis" is probably closer to the English "remit", which means to send.

Did you have the letter hand delivered to him?
Did you have the letter handed to him directly?
Did you have the letter handed to him personally?
Did you have the letter given to him by hand?
Did you have the letter personally handed to him?
Did you have the letter personally given to him?
Did you have the letter handed to him?

March 14, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/PercyPonce1

Sitersurf : Why not "hand over ". Why is it not accepted ?

November 30, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/Sitesurf

It is now. Thanks.

November 30, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/Susan36330

I said hand over and was marked wrong. Jan 2019.

January 11, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/edwardlr4

Just for my clarification: the French en mains propres refers only to the recipient, whereas the English in either of the first two alternatives above can refer to either donor or recipient? (Though the variant you mentioned, Did you personally ... refers only to the donor, and would be an incorrect response.) Thx.

January 10, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/CinnamonTe1

It is impossible for a person to personally hand a letter to someone without the recipient also personally receiving it at the same time.

There is a difference between personally handing a letter to someone and having a letter hand delivered.

March 14, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/lulularosa

Or, "Did you hand the letter directly to him?", seems to respect the original and avoid the subj/obj ambiguities. Acceptable?

February 24, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/DrD314

I believe there should be a larger acceptance error on these complex sentences. For example, "Have you returned the letter to him personally" means the exact same thing as "Did you hand the letter to him personally," but was not accepted

March 22, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/lulularosa

"Did you deliver the letter into his hands?"- acceptable?

February 24, 2019
Learn French in just 5 minutes a day. For free.