There is nothing challenging me at all in Level 3 of this Crown system.
It is such basic Spanish. I don't think I've come across a sentence yet with more than 4 or 5 words.
What a waste of time.
Why would anyone want to waste study hours for weeks and weeks just to get back to a level where they are challenged and learning something? I'm going to give it a few days, but if this proves as dreadfully boring as it was today for 90 minutes, I'm going to have to move on.
I'm trying to learn a language here, not regurgitate simple phrases like, "Ellas son mujeres" and "el oso, el ratón, el conejo", again and again and again, ad nauseum.
After 677 days, this is a big step backwards, and a huge disappointment.
And I'll add that it is not the Crown system itself that I have an issue with. It's the rigidity of being put at a certain level that is not challenging or conducive to learning, and having no way of bumping myself up to a more appropriate level. Why not give us the option of skipping up to the next level, or going back to the previous level, without having to claw our way up repeating the same basic words and phrases that we already know backwards and forwards? I know "Ellas son mujeres". I will never forget it. I do not need to practice it 30 times a day, and yet that's where you've placed me. It's really demotivating.
For me even if the first lesson on Spanish needed reviewing I could use timed practice and bring it back to gold in less than two minutes. Duolingo is now expecting me to practice it over and over on extra slow and I really don't want to have to practice basic lessons forty times for each language. I was hoping with the updates we would see things like audio, more languages and more effective courses but its really the opposite and with unnecessary features.
I have found the Duo stories to be more challenging than the lessons. The stories at least have different tenses, phrases, etc. and ask questions as the story progresses to see how well you're following it. I do agree, the lessons are pretty monotonous. I've tested out of so many to try and get through the whole lesson tree. I don't even know if I want to push through all the levels.... Oui.
You can test out of each lesson. When you start a lesson, rather than clicking the big Start button click the little Key button just above it.
So I have just discovered a topic (Adjective 1) currently at level 2, where you have to do 18 lessons just to progress to level 3.....surely this is excessive!? I wonder how many I would have to do to progress to level 4 and 5! (Slap in the face emoji)
Completely agree. 2 days ago I had a completed gold tree. Today i was doing "Yo soy un hombre" repeatedly. A lot of the skills are at level 1. So frustrating!
I agree. My tree was golden. I came back everyday to make sure it stayed golden. Now, what’s the point? crowns mean starting over.
Exactly. A thousand times yes. I will never need to practice anything about boys, milk, and apples in Spanish unless it involves advanced material like the subjunctive tense, which is exactly what timed practice would do. If ever my Basics skill decayed, it would give me exercises that involved everything on the tree that I had done up to that point (the whole thing), so if I had to do an exercise about an apple, it would be about whether or not someone was hoping to eat an apple in the subjunctive. Now each exercise does not invoke the ones after it. I am actually getting worse at Spanish because of the Crowns system, because the vocabulary is so mind-numbingly repetitive that I completely forget what the exercise is even supposed to be teaching and just regurgitate the four or five words that exercise uses, all the way to level 5. The diversity of exercises has disappeared, and basically everything is a reading and writing exercise. There are already vastly superior apps for the reading and writing portions of languages, Duolingo's strength was in its variety, both in exercise type and actual material. The Crowns system has removed both of those in such an ineffective way that if you asked me to develop a system that makes Duolingo ineffective for learning languages, I would not have been able to come up with anything half as awful as Crowns.
I too was initially frustrated, but then I followed a suggestion and started working at the hardest subject for me (the subjunctive). I found I rapidly went to level 4, but surprisingly some of the basics were suddenly raised from level 1 to 2 -- apparently progress in the more difficult parts raises the challenge in the easier parts. I am moving through different areas and finding the brush-up is really needed, and I am advancing overall.
Yes, I definitely needed to go over things to a more in-depth level than just the quick test to keep the topic gold! It’s surprising how many words just drop out of your head.
I am actually starting to like the crowns system, as I believe if I did actually complete it, I should be able to recall everything so easily.
Even in the clothes section it’s helpful because I am always mixing up the words for belt and sock in Spanish and I want everything to be instantly recognisable.
That said, some rounds are shockingly long and I am not sure there ever needs to be more than 10 lessons per Crown. However on the very basic topics, like the first 3-4 circles, I still think 5 rounds is a bit too much for an advanced learner.
It is such a drastic change though, that it’s no surprise everyone freaked out!
I completely agree with every sentiment below or above. I was at 65% fluency and now I'm back doing absolute beginner Spanish at Level 2! Is there any way to get to higher levels without having to go through stuff I learned in Junior High? It is so excruciatingly boring.
After a few days of playing with the new crown system, I have to admit that I'm liking it more than I was before.
I had finished both my trees and reached level 25 in both courses quite some time ago, so I've been coming back daily and using timed practice to keep them golden, before moving on to another online Spanish course.
It really was getting to be a bit of daily drudgery.
I'm finding it kind of nice to not have to worry about keeping the tree golden, and the added variety of going back to the lessons--even the ones I felt were too easy and that I didn't need--is making it all a bit more interesting again. And I like that my focus is once again on the lessons and the language, and less on doing just enough to keep my tree gold and my fluency % from dropping. It's kind of a nice shift in focus for me.
Yeah I agree, I am trying to get my whole tree to level 2 then I will get them all to level 3 and so on. After the first check point I have found this very valuable and my the time I finish everything to level 5 I have no doubt it will be ingrained in my brain.
However 18 lessons to get from level 2 to level 3 in Adjective 1 is a lot! Especially for me as someone who doesn’t like to leave a level incomplete!
What a waste of time. I want to learn Spanish and have already mastered how to say apples, boy, girl etc. I don't need six more exercises to get to 3 crowns, and goodness knows how many exercises to get to four or five crowns.
Shame on you Duolingo. I haven't got the time each day to do huge amounts of repetitive Spanish.
Overnight, you have ruined something that I enjoyed doing. Forget my 133 day run, and the lingots too - I am going to find something else.
Pathetic! Pathetic! Pathetic! - I had better repeat that another three hundred times, in case I forget - this has what Duolingo has become.
It is like Tellytubbies all over again.
I agree with you. I've had my tree completed and gold for 4 years, and have redone the tree 10 times just to review and keep it gold. if I never see I am a boy or I eat apples again it will be too soon, and yet now that seems to be the only thing that pops up. I have a 1610 day streak going and had planned on continuing it, but now just don't know. I hope that they will change something. They could have kept the original format, but just added more topics. They did that several years ago with Foods and Food 2 and also Adject. 1, 2, and so on. we could get more words and harder lessons without throwing out something that worked well.
One sad thing about this new feature is if you have feedback to give, there is very little reception for it because so many people are talking about it all at once that there's much less possibility of being heard yourself.
I had switched from the Spanish for English speakers course to the English for Spanish speakers some time back. The challenge was gone from the first but I was positively challenged by the latter. I returned to the Spanish course for the alpha test and was looking forward to this update.
So far I've seen an improvement for those just beginning but see the potential for wasting a lot of study time just trying to level up for those hoping to progress past basics.
I applaud Duo for putting out this effort and believe that it will ultimately show great promise but I will be going to mostly outside study for now.
A month has passed since I made that comment and I have changed my view. Rather than grind away at one subject I work on those areas I need most work on (mostly verbs). Today I did 8 lessons on 8 different subjects. It's less boring this way and I've found my verb usage has gotten more instinctive.
At some point I'm going to stop bothering with duolingo entirely and this certainly isn't helping. I'd golded the entire tree for spanish maybe two years ago, finished all the conversations on the mobile app and decided to just keep my skills ticking over by trying to keep the whole tree gold.
Now I've got no clue where to start? It was nice being able to keep track of which lessons I needed to catch up on when they un-golded themselves. Now I just have a tree full of random numbers with no clear indication of what I need to practice.
I can no longer do timed practice and you turned the mobile app into an ad-ridden skinner box. I have the option to pay, but then whats the point? There are no extra lessons available, the incentive to have offline lessons and no ads isn't worth it.
I'm going to be honest I ended up buying Rosetta stone instead as it felt worth paying for.
I've got to admit that I tried it years ago without any Spanish knowledge and hit a wall very quickly. Now I do it alongside duolingo and I feel like I'm progressing nicely. I also want to learn concentrate on Castilian Spanish which it has some nice things for pronunciation.
Tbf at this point I should probably just drop duo and go to some spanish classes or find a spanish speaker to help me but I feel kinda embarrassed about it. Hell, my co-worker is from Galicia.
I'm still finding it frustrating to figure out which skills I'm weak in though. Doesn't help that duo just pushes the same questions to you again and again until you just get frustrated and copy paste the answer from the bar at the bottom.
The mobile app is even worse, I still don't know how anyone manages to learn anything with the health system aside from throwing money at it like a skinner box game.
I'm still finding it frustrating to figure out which skills I'm weak in though.
For 0-24% strength skills with many dead words (0.0xxx strength number) you need the Tampermonkey user script "Duolingo Skill strength viewer" which does its own skill calculations and does not rely on the minimum 25% value of Duolingo strength bar code.
The crowns have made the app too repeatative, taking the same 10 lessons, 5 Times to master a topic is overly laborious and counter productive.
I am hoping they will realise this and have less lessons to achieve each extra crown as you progress in a topic, otherwise I may give up all together.
They claim there is new content, but after the discussion round I am not noticing any differences.
Maybe the app should be intelligent enough to know after passing the different check points you are bound to have achieved level 5 certain topics eg the basics and they could start to flash and automatically award you Five crowds if you pass a quick fire test or something.
I agree. This winter when they added all that to the tree, I felt like I had to start over. Now I have to start over again and this time it is soooo redundant. Do you know if when the section gets to level 5 will it stay there or keep losing the gold? It is super frustrating.
Apparently the plan at the moment is for it to stay there...but who knows what the future leads too!
Well done to Duolingo for attempting to improve the app and make it harder for experience learners however I'm afraid I do agree with these comments, although it really doesn't matter to me what colour the tree is or what % fluency, I do duolingo to improve my spanish rather than obtain these "rewards". They are just a bonus. What does matter to me and is now a problem to my learning is the inability to use the Practice button. I have been on Duolingo for years and currently have a 1185 streak. I too DO NOT need to do the basic lessons again. What I do use and find invaluable is the practice button. Using this I don't know what is coming next - future, past, any subject etc. It keeps me on my toes and keeps everything to the forefront of my mind so that I can easily converse/read in reality. It is this flexibility and mixture that helps me the most. Now this practice button does nothing to improve achievement. You have to do the tree - which is one subject at a time. I like to do 40-50 points per day, usually on the timed practice (& try to get full marks) all of which is achievable and motivating, but now I won't be able to do this type of practice which covers everything at once. I will have to do a different subject each day and currently at far too easier a level, it is going to drive me mad. At my level of Spanish it is covering everything at once that is key, along with learning new vocab and new verbs of all which the practice button did. This is very disappointing for me and I do hope by posting this comment Duolingo can review and improve this button.
I don't like the crown system. Keeping my tree gold was annoying enough when it came to the very very basic work, but this? No thanks, I'll just review the stuff I feel like I need to review and plug onward. I can only be so OCD before I start wasting my precious time going over the same stock phrases.
As I have commented a number of times in the past couple of days I don't like the Crowns System, but I decided that I would give it a go and see if it got better. I study all day everyday. I travel a lot during the day and I carry my Phone and IPad with me and when I am waiting on something I do a couple of lessons on the moble app and then move on. What is happening now is when I do lessons on the moble app and then stop, when I come back to pick up and continue with more lessons it shows that I haven't done anything previously and i'm back at zero for the day. and I have to do the same lessons over again. I lost 90 XP's yesterday. I am at home now and I did several lessons a little while ago on my moble app and then turned my computer on to work on it and it does not show any progress that I got from the moble app. I checked with my daughter and granddaughter (which are also doing Duo Lingo and they are having the same problem so it's not just my problem. I think there is a problem with the program. I have now lost over 200 XP's since this nightmare started. I've never had this problem in the past with the other system. and I have a 1611 day streak and that's both working from my phone, IPad and Computer. It's bad enough being back at very basic vocabulary, but to laboriously go through it again only to find that if you stop it will erase everything for the day. In a few weeks I will be in Spain for 2 months and won't have my computer with me but will work with the moble app. So to think that I will lose all my work or my streak will put a nail in Duo lingo for me. I have loved this program and have always recommended it to everyone. It was the best Spanish program that I've seen. It has gotten me to where I am today. I wish that the program could have stayed the way it was but just simply add more topics and tokens and more vocabulary. I think that Duo Lingo may have shot themselves in the foot on this one. Is anyone else having the same problem that i'm having.
yes bro, that's really disappointing... I had to repeat the FIRST lessons about 30 times to become it golden. I think that the crowns are good, or simply better than the "level of fluency" , but duolingo has to repair this :c i don't want to repeat and repeat things that i already know
I miss the gold tree so much. I feel like I haven't accomplished anything now. The decaying words function of the old site was really helpful and made me stick with it every day, making sure I was thinking about learning Spanish for at least twenty minutes every morning. Now I don't even know where to start. This doesn't make learning a language into a fun game and I have a terrible feeling that I'm going to be giving up on it a lot more often than I had before. The crowns are dumb and I really hope Duolingo changes it back to the original layout. They can add more words if they want, I'm all for that. But this new system kind of sucks. I'm disappointed.
I know! The obsession with keeping my tree golden was forcing me to emmerse myself daily! Getting everything up to level 5 is such an impossible task! 9 rounds of apples and boys to get a level 4 Crown! I can’t cope!
Quote bingemac: I miss the gold tree so much.
You can visit your progress page on the SHOF site: www.duolingo.eu/bingemac/progress
You can see all gold and non-golden skills, ordered by strength or crown levels.
You can even hit the Practice button to strengthen a single skill (100%).
Is this the same with all languages? I was thinking of starting Spanish soon but it looks like Spanish is having a hard time with crowns.
I think it’s the whole platform, all languages. My phone app hasn’t changed, just the computer. A friends phone has changed, both iPhones.
My Phone and IPad have also changed to the new Crown System. The one thing that is the most frustrating is that if I do a lesson on the phone or IPad it will give me the credit, but when I long into on my computer it doesn't show the progress there. Also today I sat and did six lessons on my phone and then took a break. When I when back to my phone to pick up where I left off instead of showing 6/15 it went back to 0/15 and I got no credit for anything and again my computer showed nothing done as well. I can't help but believe that the crown system has a bug. I travel a lot and do a lot of my lessons on my phone or IPad and then when I get back home I pick up on my computer. My fear is that i won't get the credit and my streak will be broken. i wonder if anyone else is have problems like that?
I saw similar issues flipping between the app and the website. For me, the website had gold and the app had numbers. The XP would record correctly all the time. The progress would frequently be out of synch. I thought it was an app difference, not part of the transition. I liked the website Gold feature more. It was easy figure out what I need to brush up on.
Jim, both my app and the website is changed to the crown system and the XP's don't record at all from the App to the Website. I too liked the Gold feature better. I have redone my tree 10 times not to mention work on topics that I might be a little unsure of. I don't know why they couldn't have just added more topics or Tokens with new stuff in it and left the system alone.
It would be nice ...if someone who is ""working" at resoling the problems would "acknowledge" hearing the "constructive Criticisms" ...even ifthere is no plan to meet the needs of the "advanced learners"
I feel you, I only do this occasionally but still it repeats everything over and over.