"有没有风险的投资吗?"

Translation:Is there a risk free investment?

April 19, 2018

75 Comments
This discussion is locked.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PipuPupi

Wow this one is confusing. I thought the '有没有' in the sentence was used to indicate 'Is there or is there not' instead of having '没有‘ modifying the word '风险‘ to mean risk-free.

Would 'Is there a risky investment?' also be an acceptable translation? If not, why?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PipuPupi

Is it the 吗 at the end of the sentence that indicates that 没有 modifies 风险 in this sentence?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/carpiediem

I think you're right, but surely this would be a confusing sentence, even to Chinese ears, before you reach the last word.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/9hSF2
  • 1650

A Chinese speaker would give a slight pause after the first 有 to indicate that it does not belong with 沒有, but with the 嗎 that will be coming at the end.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/CalvinC.3

Native, can confirm - the audio should definitely be updated.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Edasaur

I think I would personally say "有无风险的投资吗?" instead, just to avoid that confusion.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JPSeaton

Well done 9hsf 2! No more including this need be said.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/xiaoshe4

besides the last 吗, if we want to mean 有没有 in this sentence, normally we will not use 的 between 风险 and 投资 i don't know why.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/iamFarren

This answered my question, xiexie


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Semeltin

If you want the sentence to be less confusing you could insert a pause before 没有 when speaking, I think.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ybqsh
  • 1276

Or insert something in between: "有什么没有风险的投资吗?"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/9hSF2
  • 1650

Yes, that's how people would normally speak. Duolingo should do the same here.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/xiaoshe4

the last word 吗 is the key.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Gabrielle145359

As you said, 没有 goes with 风险. 没有风险="does not have risk".

有=There is/There are (something exists)

没有风险=does not have risk

的=(what comes before is describing the next word)

投资=investment(s)

吗?=(The statement becomes a yes/no question.)

So, this sentence is asking if risk-free investments exist, not if risky investments exist.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/xialuote1

Same confusion here


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/e8jfx

I had the same problem. I had to track down a native speaker to explain this.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/FJSoekahar

I have the same thought. Please Duo make a correction.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Anon341685

Not a lot to add, except that it seemed to me too, to read, "Do you have a risky investment". Audio doesn't play a part in translating written Chinese to written English. Looks like one of those things one just has to remember.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AdamCunnin6

Wouldn't 无 in place of 没有 be less confusing and get the same meaning across just as well?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/iluvmemez

无 is more formal than 没有。If you see「无风险的投资」then you're probally seeing it on a contract, and you're probally being scammed.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Edasaur

My thoughts exactly. Sure无 appears more frequently in formal text, but that's not to say that I haven't heard it used in conversation.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KX3.

I don't think its confusing and it does mean the same.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/-Benjamin.

I am a fluent Chinese speaker and can confirm this is not grammatically natural without a pause after the first 有。


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Ann55075

maybe it would be better to change the tiles, since this sentense does not use 有没有 but 有 + 没有风险的


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Dublow

Good suggestion.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/waltcamp45

Which character conveys the "free" aspect of "risk free"? I would have expected this sentence to mean"Is there a risk to the investment?"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/woa7dSD5

有投资吗?= Is there an investment? 有风险的投资= a risky investment 没有风险的投资= a risk-free investment (I think)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Gabrielle145359

The first word 有 and the following 没有 have nothing to do with each other. 没有风险="does not have risk". See my comment above to PipuPupi for more details.

I would translate your question "Is there a risk to the investment?" as 这个投资有没有风险? or 这个投资有风险吗? In the translations of your sentence, notice that 投资 is the subject of the sentence, and you do not see 有没有 ocurring in the same sentence as 吗. 有没有 and 吗 both ask yes/no questions, but they don't work together. If you see a sentence (like this exercise) that has 有没有 and 吗, then the 有没有 is not really "有没有” but rather "有" (space) "没有".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Elijah.Fung

没有风险的投资a risk free investment


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Leon343243

有无风险的投资吗? would be much clearer


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/carpiediem

Can any native speaker comment on whether "有免风险的投资吗" would be a valid alternative? If so, maybe the Duolingo staff could make the change? (Copied Winston's suggestion, since it's being dragged down by its parent comment.)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ybqsh
  • 1276

Native here. As others ponined out: 无 is better than 免。无 is closest in meaning as 没有。免 on the other hand, means a little different is used in a slightly different scenario. 无 means no in a "never existed" way. 免 also means no but in a "existed or could have existed, but is preventable, prevented or exampted". For example: 无罪 means not guilty, while 免罪 means crime exempted. 无风险 means no risk to begin with, while 免风险 could be something like, there could be huge risk but because you have "good connections", you are gonna end up being able to get away with it.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/iluvmemez

Also native here. Another thing to note here that 免 can be used as a verb depending on the context, and 无 is used exclusively as an adjective.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KX3.

No. However, Adam's suggestion 无 is valid. 免 isn't used this way (I don't really know how to explain how its used, sorry)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/chang107080

I think 免 means getting rid of or avoiding something actively. 无 or 低 seems to work better to mean risk free or low risk.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DMd619327

这个句子太麻烦了! I admit, I also fell into this trap, not noticing that question particle at the end. It is a really good lesson: pay attention to the details. By the way, I tried it in Google translate: it also got it wrong! So, it is not ambiguous, just tricky. But if you make a statement out of this question, that's when ambiguity comes to the scene: 有没有风险的投资 would mean "there's a risk-free investment", but can it be also a question? Like, "Is there a risky investment?" I wonder, what would our respected native experts say. Alas, no dictionary I checked provides translation for "risk-free". "Risky"? Easy: 有风险. "Risk-free"? Sorry, no such thing. :D


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Stephen241623

Google Translate is not an authority on anything, it is effectively using statistical methods to guess what is the most likely translation, and at no point does it consider the “meaning” of the sentence. As a result, it is super bad on language pairs like English and Mandarin where the sentence structures are quite different and there is not a long history of mutual borrowing.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Ant.H

"Risk free" and "no risk" are synonymous here


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/TTK223828

有 没有风险的投资吗?

没有风险的投资 有吗?

有没有风险的投资?

Is there a risk free investment?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Lena98765432

This is confusing, I mistook it as 'Is there a risky investment?'. Would '没有风险的投资有吗?' be a correct sentence? I do think it sounds a bit strange but at least the '有没有' is seperated.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Fiyalka2

I mistook it, too. ;o)
Your question 没有风险的投资有吗?is grammatically correct but would have a slightly different emphasis: "Isn't there a risky investment?"

For "Is there a risky investment?" you could say:
有没有(有)风险的投资?(without the 吗)
or 有(有)风险的投资吗?

For "Is there a risk free investment?" it would be:
有没有风险的投资吗?or
有无风险的投资吗?or
有没有没有风险的投资?:o)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Fiyalka2

It is quite logical, almost mathematical:
"Is there …… ?" is either 有 …… 吗?(with 吗, and that is the case here)
or 有没有 …… ? (without the 吗, which is not the case here).

So, on the outside, we have 有 …… 吗?= "Is there …… ?"
and on the inside we have 没有风险的投资 = risk free investment (literally: an investement that does not have risks).
And together:
有 [ 没有风险的投资 ] 吗? = "Is there [a risk free investment]?"

And when even mother tongue speakers say that she could have made a longer pause after the first 有, that means we all are not so bad. ;o)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Ray179840

Yeah, this was weird.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/94Yumi94

Same confusion here, it definitely sounds like a 有没有 type of sentence where 吗 is obsolete, they could have used 无 instead of 没有 there and none of this would be an issue.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Simon299426

Is there risk free investment?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KeironWong

Very poor word choice given in early levels again.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AlanTham2

"Is there any risk free investment?" was incorrect!? (23/1/21)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JulianC606130

Is this intended to be misleading? Because it certainly is!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SCTiew

Duolingo gave an incorrect answer. It'd be," is there any risky investment?".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sei_B

ambiguous


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Stephen241623

Is this a philosophical question, or is the answer simply “no”? Even aside from the misleading 有没有 collocation, it's a very confusing and hard to interpret sentence.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rku5A4GF

有无风险的投资吗?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Stephen241623

On reflection, I think the problem with this example is a confluence of three separate issues: first, it introduces a construction that looks like one we are familiar with, but with a completely different structure; second, it is recorded with the wrong intonation (specifically, with the intonation proper to the other, more familiar parse); and third, that it has facetious content—given that under the correct interpretation it is something that only makes sense if the speaker is stoned (or a philosopher, same thing)—and so fails to alert us to pay close attention.

So I'd suggest (a) adding another example before this one where something appears between 有 and 没有, and (b) changing this to something semantically more reasonable, like “is there a route with no connection” or “is there a duty free store” or “is there a way of changing money with no fee” (any of which would fit in the nearby travel topic).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rapax_Xihu

But can we write 有没有没有


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rapax_Xihu

And my Chinese friend says it's even the more common way to say it


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Massoluk

Bitcoin solved this /s


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Dublow

Thank you for the /s


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/btm7

It seems rhis is asking, "Does this investment have risk?" not, "Is there a risk-free investment?"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/woa7dSD5

Seems to be, is not. See DMd619327's comment.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Anon341685

Weird. Google translate says that this is asking if you have a risky investment. The exact opposite. I'd better not get a Chinese broker then


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Andrukas8

I think this one is incorrect.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Winston298006

At first, I thought so, too. Apparently there is no error here, although surely 有免风险的投资吗?would be less confusing.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/U1qX

Correct sentence could be. 有没有没有风险的投资 。有没有+吗is really wrong.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/carpiediem

"Is there risk-free mayonnaise?" => 有没有没有mayo?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mb505

The 有没有 isn't what you think it is. It uses the 有。。。吗 structure and is asking if a 没有风险的投资 exists


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KX3.

I think they are both okay


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Fiyalka2

U1qX, you made my day. A lovely and correct sentence. Have some lingots. Thanks for the smile! :o)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Translingual

This sentence is way too ambiguous. It could also be translated as "Is there a risky investment?"/"are there risky investments?"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/carpiediem

No, it can't. That's what it would say if there were no 吗 at the end. The fact that there is a 吗 is the clue that 有没有 is not for a yes/no question, but something else.

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