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"At a temperature of fifteen degrees, mercury is liquid."

Translation:Při teplotě patnáct stupňů je rtuť tekutá.

April 25, 2018

16 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Shathu_Entayla

Why is it wrong to say "...rtut je tekuta", instead of "...je rtut tekuta" in the end of the sentence?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/endless_sleeper

Second position rule for je.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Shathu_Entayla

But it though that was only for personal pronouns. It's a verb. And, in fact, you czech people say different things. I heard, for example "Je to skvele", in which "je" is clearly not in the second position. Is "Je to skvele" kind of an exception?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/endless_sleeper

Eh, sorry for the confusion. I was referring to something else.

Despite all of its quirks, Czech is basically a S-V-O language. That's why je is placed second. The same applies when rtuť is placed at the beginning: Rtuť je při 15 stupních tekutá.

Now concerning the other second position rule you have mentioned. It's not only about personal pronouns. Those are clitics. Yes, some personal pronouns are clitics, but auxiliary verbs, and other pronouns and certain prepositions are clitics too. I suggest looking at some grammar reference.

Finally, regarding your second question. To je skvělé. is the neutral sentence (or an exclamation). Clearly, its pattern is S-V-O. Je to skvělé is more of a question (V-S-O), but I can imagine it being used for emphasis or as a reply to a question as well. Look at this dialogue: A: Je to skvělé? B: Ano, je to skvělé. A: Tak to je skvělé!

TL;DR: Czech is way too much complicated.

(And please give me some award for the most imaginative dialogue ever.)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Shathu_Entayla

WTF! Ok.. Where could I find information about cclitics in czech? I mean, I really have no way to find them. When I put "clitics in czech" in Google, the results are not really satisfying xD.

About "Je to skvele", I heard it specially when someone did or said something "skvele". As "Mohl jsi to udelat na konci?" "Ano!" "Je to skvele".

I don't know what TLDR means, but it remind me "trdlnik" xD

(And yes! Sure you have a lingot! ;))


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/endless_sleeper

Post titled 96.5% , Chapter 9 in Naughton. The basics are mentioned in tips and notes too.

TL;DR


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Shathu_Entayla

What do you mean with "pots titled 96.5%"?

And thanks about the reference! :D Take a lingot.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/walkinwolk

I am finding this out about auxiliary verbs here. I realize now, based on your explanation, this is the case, but it is hard to get my head around it. I hope if I just keep drilling for a few more years, this will become second nature.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/rob941529

I appreciate your detailed effort and thank you for taking time to answer this, however i dont think S-V-O applies here at all.

"Při teplotě patnáct stupňů" is not a subject, but instead something like and adverbial phrase. Finally, there really isn't an object in the sentence. From what i remember "je" does not take an object. It's called something else (i cant remember) but that's why that word takes the nominative (1st), while an object takes the accusative (4th).

Unfortunately I don't have an answer, I'm looking for one myself and can't find anything using Google. Am i totally off here? Help!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/svrsheque

"je" is a copula. and its positive present tense forms are inconstant clitics that like to hang out in the 2nd position, the 1st here being that lovely adverbial phrase.

you could look up and download the dissertation by Hana, or just read this condensed intermediate-level clitic post: https://forum.duolingo.com/comment/38369227


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JohnBraga1

I don't understand what case patnáct is in this sentence. I would want to make it genitive to agree with stupňů but it obviously isn't. Help please!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/VladaFu

Při uses locative. In general, not just here.

nom. patnáct stupňů
gen. patnácti stupňů
dat. patnácti stupňům
acc. patnáct stupňů
loc. patnácti stupních
instr. patnácti stupni

You may think that it is inconsistent and it may actually be true, but it is how the language works. The genitive is only used in nominative, genitive and accusative.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JohnBraga1

Sorry but I am still puzzled. Při uses locative so it is followed by teplotě. Stupňů is presumably genitive plural? so why don't we have genitive patnácti . Sorry to be hloupý!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/VladaFu

OK, my bad. We would have "při patnácti stupních". That is what I was saying, but it is not that relevant here.

Here we just have nominative but you can also use genitive. Both "při teplotě patnáct stupňů" and "patnácti stupňů" works.

The nominative here can be used for quantities and prices like this. It is like some tag "temperature: 15 degrees" "teplota: patnáct stupňů". So we can use "při teplotě patnáct stupňů".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JohnBraga1

Thank you. A very confusing language at times, but I am sure English grammar seems equally absurd!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AgnusOinas

We make our lives simpler for ourselves sometimes by reducing the cases. VladaFu called it "tag", I think that's a very apt name for it. When we want to say "I bought it for the price of twenty four Crowns", the ideal way would be "Koupil jsem to za cenu dvaceti čtyř korun", where the number is in the genitive (similar to the "of" in English), but it just seems too much of a mouthful, so in real life it gets reduced to: "Koupil jsem to za cenu dvacet čtyři korun" (korun remains in the genitive as it follows a number), it's a form or laziness/sloppiness, but it's very common (to the point of being correct) - so, literally "I bought it for the price: 24 crowns". (And of course, in real real life, we would omit the whole "price" thing and just state the number directly.)

Now "při teplotě patnácti stupňů" sounds like an old textbook, it sounds almost too correct.

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