https://www.duolingo.com/SprightBark

Possible incorrect exercise type error: Arlī ____ ?

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Re: Arlī ____ ?

Lesson encountered in: Present Tense

I am largely duplicating my post on the above sentence; this has been done for greater visibility in an effort to sooner fix what I believe to be an error.

I have flagged the sentence with the error report mechanism, but have had to use an erroneous error type selection. :-( The choices given were not wide enough.

Encountered as a select the missing word exercise (“Arlī ____ ?”), the following words were given:

  1. nagen
  2. nagē
  3. nages
  4. nagī
  5. nagēt
  6. nagesi

(but not in that order).

Only: Arlī nagen is accepted as valid. Should all the others be valid too - given that we don’t get to see the English until after we have submitted a selection?

If they are all valid, can that exercise type be disabled for that sentence?

Is there some grammar regarding adverbs that I have overlooked that means only nagen should be accepted? (If this is so, I humbly offer an apology in advance.)

(We also get this as a straightforward translation exercise, with which there is no problem.) :-)

Kirimvose.


[Later addition below; 23rd May 2018]

I thought I might as well mention here that while searching through the sentences - not in lesson so I couldn't use the report function - I came across these two sentences:

"Sylvī zaldrīzesse iotāptī." Translation: We respect the wise dragons.

"Aōha kepa iotāpten." Translation: I respect your father.

Both zaldrīzesse and Aōha kepa appear to be in the nominative. I presume this is incorrect?

May 7, 2018

7 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/Dedalvs
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Rytsas SprightBark!

When I first started working on this course, I didn't understand how form exercises were presented to the user. I tagged a lot of sentences to be used as form exercises without giving it a thought assuming that it would (a) give you the Valyrian with a blank; (b) give you options to fill in that blank; and (c) give you an English translation. After all, if it didn't give you the English translation, how would you be expected to correctly fill it in?! Consequently for something like Arlī nagen, I tagged it and never thought twice about it. I assumed it would give you the English "I'm sweating again", and the user would have to select the correct conjugation. That makes perfect sense to me. It was much later that I learned that there was absolutely NO English given, and that, of course, horrified me—because, indeed, every option for a question like the one you gave should be correct.

At that point, it was on me to go and either fix or disable every single form exercise for which multiple answers were possible with no English translation given. Unfortunately, there were 50 or more, and there is no simple way to identify which words have form exercises with the Incubator UI.

What's even worse is that there's no way for users to indicate that there's an error SPECIFICALLY with a form exercise! A sentence like Arlī nagen would get flagged again and again with users saying "This question is incorrect or unnatural", and I'd look at it again and again and again and see absolutely nothing wrong with it. I had no way of knowing that they meant the associated form exercise—unless someone wrote in a free form post, or someone made a post here, and I happened to see it.

So. This one has been fixed, but I guarantee you there are others that have problems. I can only hope that eventually I'll find them all.

As to your other questions (the ones you found), those are grammatically incorrect sentences that were removed from the course. I have no idea how you found them, and am slightly horrified that you can. I assumed if I clicked "Remove sentence from course" it meant that I was removing the sentence from the course—permanently. Instead, it appears you can find them, for some reason, if you search the right way...? I'm not pleased by that. :( They're supposed to be banished to the nether regions. I hope others aren't finding them and using them for any reason...

June 22, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/SprightBark
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Thank you for your reply. I had suspected something like what you have described; it is good to know that you are aware of the issue and - albeit slowly, hampered by the (lack of) tools provided - are fixing it.

Hopefully there is not much cause to worry about the two sentences I found - the discussion tab has a search area at the top of it; by typing in iotāptī and iotāpten (as well as other variations) it returns comments that have been made on sentences with those words in. What I did not realise is that this includes sentences deleted from the course. I suspect that given the number of sentences a course contains, and how few of them need to be deleted (and how few people use the discussion search), it is quite rare for people to come across these. Hopefully they are not accessible in any other way. (It would of course be better if at the same time that a sentence is deleted from a course, Duolingo also deleted or made inaccessible the associated sentence discussion.)

June 24, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/Dedalvs
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Thanks for letting me know how you got to those other sentences! That seems like a QA thing. I wonder if they even know about it... I won't worry about it too much.

June 25, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/SprightBark
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A minor Duolingo issue I want to make you aware of; as far as I know free form error reports no longer exist in the web version (they don't for me). This means that complex errors have to be reported on either the sentence discussion or here on the main forum.

Whether or not the free form error report option is still there in some of the apps I do not know.

June 24, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/Dedalvs
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That is unfortunate, since they added a place for freeform responses recently. Can you do that in mobile? Weird you can't do it on desktop. The discussion forum is not as good, as I often don't remember to check it; the discussion on individual sentences is even worse. I'll NEVER see those. How do you even find them?! Take that particular lesson and hope you happen upon that particular sentence? As far as I know they're not stored anywhere we can see them in the Incubator back end. That seems like a design flaw... Either that, or I simply don't know where to look. :(

June 25, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/estas_Connor

I don't know how to answer this question, but I think that you might find the answer over on the High Valyrian discord if you're not already a member. Take a look! https://discord.gg/pPPv7X9

May 9, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/Greatscotteh
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I cannot find anything that would imply that "nagen" is the only correct blank without knowing the English translation beforehand. I would say that this is a minor error in the order of which the Duolingo gods had given you those exercises. This is likely not to be fixed until DJP comes back to work on the course, or appoints a moderator to fix minor errors.

May 27, 2018
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