"Kesi lōgra biariar issi."

Translation:These are fortunate boats.

July 4, 2018

8 Comments
This discussion is locked.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BrunoSenra

This exercise is actually wrong, proceed with caution. The correct/standard answer should be "These boats are fortunate". For "fortunate boats" we'd normally have to invert "lōgra" and "biariar". Word order, however flexible, does matter!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Dedalvs

No! How do you all think this?!

First, it could never be "these boats", because kesi doesn't agree with lōgra in gender. So any answer with "these boats" will always, always be wrong.

Second, there's absolutely nothing wrong with lōgra biariar. The noun is nominative plural aquatic; the adjective is nominative plural aquatic. They agree perfectly. Furthermore, adjectives can follow the nouns they modify.

Finally, for those being confused about the order, remember that kesi is a pronoun. Kesi means "these ones". It's nominative plural. It's the plural of kesy. As a pronoun, it only agrees in animacy with its referent. Boats are not animate, so it's not bisi, it's kesi. It doesn't matter that lōgra is aquatic, as the pronouns don't agree in gender, just animacy. Since there is an overt subject nominal, the order of the adjective and noun of the complement is important—doubly so since biariar could, again, never modify kesi. Kesi is lunar nominative plural; biariar is aquatic/terrestrial nominative plural.

If this wasn't clear in the notes provided for this section, please let me know, but I would have thought by this skill the rules of noun-adjective concord and word order would have been quite clear.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Adrian729689

I'm doing this on my phone. Limited maybe, but maybe Duolingo could provide these 'notes on the section' just to be helpful? Or an obvious button to get them?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/x5pUtVcV

Thank you for this explanation, I also misunderstood the use of kesy/bisy/kesi/bisi/kony/bony/koni/boni and thought you could use them as general demonstrative pronouns for all classes, I thought you'd only have to distinguish between singular, plural, animate, inanimate, proximal and distal. Now I checked a table in a wiki from which I understand that the singular inanimate form in the aquatic class is "kesor" - "kesor lōgor" would then be: "this boat", right? I cannot find the plural form of "kesor" in the wiki, though, so how would you translate "these boats" correctly? Thank you again :)!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Dedalvs

It’s keja lōgra (from kesra). I believe this is shown on the web app in the notes, but you can’t see the notes on mobile. :(


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BrunoSenra

Thank you for replying and explaining. Reviewing this, looks like I later understood (and corrected others) that "bisy" is "this one", but up at this point I hadn't gotten the difference yet. Although I understand Duo's method of implict learning and varying possible answers/sentence structures as much as possible so people will infer that all are valid options, I think it'd be less confusing to translate it as "these ones are fortunate ships" instead of simply "these". To linguists, teachers and the like it might be obvious it's the same thing, but to the lay learner, it can be hard to grasp (that the word class/function of "this/these" varies and translates differently in HV, accordingly). I love the fact that HV made it to duo, but it's definitely a hard course for most, I think some things need to be a bit more explicit than most languages (hence the need for the aforementioned notes to further explaing the grammar). Even as a polyglot, teacher and language afficionado, I found myself going back and forth the dothraki wiki to confirm many grammar suspicions that would arrive with each new lesson (it is as rewarding as it is challenging). Anyway, just my two cents regarding the Duo course, the language itself is quite beautiful and amazingly complex. Kirimvos!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KirstenGra12

Thanks, that's what I thought too.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RobinKanters

Thanks, had that as my answer, was rejected. Reported it

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