"टमाटर सब्ज़ी नहीं होता है।"

Translation:Tomato is not a vegetable.

July 20, 2018

35 Comments
This discussion is locked.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DianaLR

Collective plurals should also be accepted. “Tomatoes are not vegetables” would sound more natural in English.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sivapriya15

Then the sentence would be टमाटर सब्ज़ियाँ नहीं हैं


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DianaLR

In the sentence I gave above, the word “tomatoes” is a collective noun. This means it represents a singular concept. In English, we might say, “A tomato is not a vegetable,” but it is more likely we would say, “tomatoes are not vegetables.” We would not say, “Tomato is not a vegetable” unless Tomato happened to be the name of our cat and we wanted to express that Tomato was indeed not a vegetable.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sivapriya15

You are overthinking. Hindi is different from English. The idea is in the sentence the words सब्ज़ी and है are singular. There are other sentences where plural is used. It's basically getting you used to the differences in them.

If you feel the translation is in error, report it. But, this particular sentence is singular. Some may say "a tomato is not a vegetable". I think that's what you are missing. The word "a" is not necessary in Hindi.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DianaLR

It’s good to know that the indefinite article is not necessary in Hindi; however, it is necessary in English and it has been left off here.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mike658920

Thinking is not over thinking. The translation given as "correct" is not the best translation; and the best translation is being marked as incorrect. Whatever the purpose of this particular lesson, forcing English speakers to reject the best translation in favor of a poor one completely undermines that project. We are distracted from how singular is used in Hindi and focused on proper use of articles and plurals in English, which is aptly illustrated in these comments. The lesson is a failure.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/VZbLAexr

I am here to learn Hindi, not Indian English. If Duolingo include Indian English as an answer, that's fine, but they should also include English English. The 'hota' implies a general statement. In English, we make the statement a general one by using 'tomatoes' in the plural. No English person would say, "Tomato is not a vegetable".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/marti_MG

People complaining about this sentence are only considering their own regional English dialects and/or limited knowledge of English.

To help English speakers overcome their regional bias here are 2 sites:

(1) word equivalents (based on acknowledged and accepted differences between, for example, US regional English and British regional English, but also the 'apparently' unacknowledged, unacceptable Indian regional English) https://www.immihelp.com/indian-english-american-english-language-dictionary/

(2) a very intelligent, sophisticated writing style, which uses "Tomato": https://www.indiaagronet.com/tomato/resources/1/1.htm

here is only one paragraph:

"Tomato is the world’s largest vegetable crop and known as protective food both because of its special nutritive value and also because of its wide spread production. Tomato is one of the most important vegetable crops cultivated for its fleshy fruits. Tomato is considered as important commercial and dietary vegetable crop. Botanical name of tomato is Lycopersicon esculemtun and belongs to family Lycopersicae. Tomato is protective supplementary food. As it is short duration crop and gives high yield, it is important from economic point of view and hence area under its cultivation is increasing day by day. Tomato is used in preserved products like ketch-up, sauce, chutney, soup, paste, puree etc."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PatrickMun13

That's what I thought...but then if it needs to be in the singular form to be accepted :
"A tomato isn't a vegetable" would still sound better imho.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Shadab-Rabbani

I fully agreed with DianaLR . Best English translation is " Tomatoes are not vegetables".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ph.dYaa0S

Really??? tomatoes are not vegetables???


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LexieKlima

I think this is one of those cases where the sentence does sound natural in Indian English, but does not in American English. In American English or would be far more typical to say "Tomatoes are not vegetables." Both ways should be accepted as correct answers.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LondonOwl7

Agree. We would say it this way in British English too.


[deactivated user]

    Agreed. I put that and was marked wrong, but I agree that in a normal conversation, most would say "Tomatoes are not vegetables" as opposed to "Tomato is not a vegetable".


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ErwinRooij

    Knowledge is knowing that a tomato is a fruit. Wisdom is not putting it in a fruit salad.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AaditRaol

    couldnt agree more


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Kae486202

    Btw tomatoes are considered to be vegetables and fruit


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/weetabixfork

    I agree. Tomatoes are a botanical fruit and a culinary vegetable.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/tre_mojosa

    Some ❤❤❤❤❤❤ part of me wants to argue with you, but I have nothing. You make an excellent point.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/no.name.42

    Yes, in the US they actually legally considered vegetables. It only really matters for tax purposes, though


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/marti_MG

    नमसते Partap and everyone,

    As you can see from my flags and numbers, I have some experience with various Duolingo courses. When semantic variants appear, or variations in syntax, word order, or other grammatical difference appear in the target language, Duolingo has consistently mirrored those differences in English as a pedagogical tool, by which the particularity of the target language becomes evident and familiar (at the slightly unfortunate expense of English).

    Most people do not comment (the vast majority), but concentrate on acquiring the target language. Some people (an extremely small minority) leave comments objecting or defending the (in)correct English translations (Here, I presented my (personally novel) thoughts against 'regional bias', in order to facilitate acceptance of Duo's 'mirrored target language' approach).

    The general approach is to remain focused on learning the target language and move on. I hope this will help remind us all (myself included) of our language learning goals and bring us all some peace of mind. हरी ॐ तत्सत शांति शांति शान्तिः ॐ


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ErfanRezamand

    सब्ज़ी sabzi is a persian word the same meaning


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JosephTats

    thanks for the info


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ItzShootingStar

    I think tomato is fruit and also a vegetable


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ph.4MRy9W

    Tamatar to ek fal hai kya bolte ho dosto


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ItzShootingStar

    "Tomatoes are not vegetables" would sound more natural in English.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mike658920

    I think the general meaning of the sentence is correctly translated when the student responds with the plural form "Tomatoes are not vegetables." If the designers intended for students to learn to distinguish singular from plural in this instance, a better example might have been chosen.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sivapriya15

    I disagree. There are two clues that this is singular सब्ज़ी and है. It would be सब्ज़ियां and हैं if it were plural. The wording makes it very clear that it's singular.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mike658920

    Whether or not it is singular in Hindi, the general concept of whether or not a tomato is a vegetable is better expressed in ENGLISH using the plural form. In English "A tomato is not a vegetable" or "Tomatoes are not vegetables" are both preferred to the solution as defined by the software as correct. We would no more say or write "tomato is not a vegetable" than we would say "Car is not clothing." We would always say either "A car is not clothing" or "Cars are not clothing."

    Tomatoes (and cars) exist in distinct quantifiable (countable) entities. And therefore English expects this grammar construction. If the substance were "continuous" (not countable) like "tomato sauce" then native English speakers would switch to the grammar the software claims to be correct: "Tomato sauce is not a vegetable" or "Water is not alcohol."


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/marti_MG

    People complaining about this sentence are only considering their own regional English dialects and/or limited knowledge of English.

    To help English speakers overcome their regional bias here are 2 sites:

    (1) word equivalents (based on acknowledged and accepted differences between, for example, US regional English and British regional English, but also the 'apparently' unacknowledged, unacceptable Indian regional English)
    https://www.immihelp.com/indian-english-american-english-language-dictionary/

    (2) a very intelligent, sophisticated writing style, which uses "Tomato": https://www.indiaagronet.com/tomato/resources/1/1.htm

    here is only one paragraph:

    "Tomato is the world’s largest vegetable crop and known as protective food both because of its special nutritive value and also because of its wide spread production. Tomato is one of the most important vegetable crops cultivated for its fleshy fruits. Tomato is considered as important commercial and dietary vegetable crop. Botanical name of tomato is Lycopersicon esculemtun and belongs to family Lycopersicae. Tomato is protective supplementary food. As it is short duration crop and gives high yield, it is important from economic point of view and hence area under its cultivation is increasing day by day. Tomato is used in preserved products like ketch-up, sauce, chutney, soup, paste, puree etc."


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Robert485433

    @marti_MG your dedication will take you far. Thanks for the links and mind-twist... is Regional English Bias a term applicable to other languages, too? I know that in Italy Pasolini had much to do with the anti-Fascist movement in promoting Italian dialects.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SujataTatata

    Tomatoes are not vegetables. Controversial

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