I Have Begun The Portuguese Tree, But I Want To Focus On European Portuguese:
I have begun the Portuguese tree, and even though it is aimed at teaching Brazilian Portuguese, I want to use it to learn European Portuguese. I want to be able to identify what concepts of vocabulary and grammar are unique to Brazilian Portuguese as I work my way down the course, so that I can learn the European Portugese equivalent. What skills containing ideas that are unique to Brazilian Portuguese should I be aware of when I come across them?
As a native European Portuguese speaker, i'd say in terms of vocabulary the difference is quite small (though there are differences), but what I would focus my attention on would be:
- the position of pronouns which is quite different between the two (for example, most brazilians would say "Me sinto bem" and we'd say "Sinto-me bem" (I feel good); or "Eu lhe daria isso" and we'd say "Eu dar-lhe-ia isso").
- Mastering the 2nd person singular ("tu") would be important, as we'd only use "você" when we address someone in a more formal way. We do use "vocês" for everyone though, "vós" is quite outdated except in rural Portugal.
- The differences in the accent... "de", "di", "te", "ti", the "l"s, the "s"s and more all sound very different from brazilian Portuguese.
- A lot more I could say that I can't remember right now :p
With that said, it is the same language and we all understand each other. So if you find more resources in Brazilian Portuguese, don't neglect them, just use them while being aware of the differences :)
Thanks for highlighting the language differences.
I have a small formatting tip for you.
If you add an empty line after "on would be:" (behind the semicolon) by hitting the ENTER hotkey twice the remaining "-" points will become converted to bulletpoints and will be much better readable.
All further "-" points will align as new bullets in a new line as you wanted it (now it is at the end of the line because of missing two spaces at the end of the previous line; you can safely ignore this 2nd hint because of the 1st bullet reformatting appearance).
With that said, it is the same language and we all understand each other.
I have no doubts that native speakers from Portugal may understand my very slow spoken PT BR variant ;)
But I have some doubts that I could even understand slow spoken PT EU and different pronunciation in Portugal without being trained for 6-12+ months extensively on it.
I will maybe use the Memrise PT EU 1-7 courses and 50languages next year when I made more progress with the two Duolingo PT-DE and PT-EN reverse trees.
For now Duo's PT BR listening TTS audio exercises are still quite challenging for me, e.g in "timed practice" mode when sentences get longer.
Quote: Sinto-me bem" (I feel good); or "Eu lhe daria isso" and we'd say "Eu dar-lhe-ia isso").
I would say that there is a zero chance to be trained on listening to this more advanced stuff as a Portuguese learner when Duolingo or any other online teaching software does not pro-actively trains you especially on this, so you can "develop" your listening skills!
So we have to rely on other Portugal books/resource content and native recorded audio cds.
Mastering the 2nd person singular ("tu") would be important
Mondly teaches the "tu" in parallel to all other person forms (e.g free 365 day lessons).
I also see the "tu" form regularly in "conversion modules" or normal lessons in other topics (você and tu get mixed).
I hardly see Duolingo using the "tu" being used in the Portuguese BR course.
Well, good for me (to get started with Portuguese in the first 1-1,5 years), but this is actually pretty bad if I can not also train this dedicated person form and all proper verb conjugations (including all the super complicated tenses) on Duolingo after 1,5-2,0 years in parallel!
Muitas saudações da Alemanha
Thanks for the tip, already edited my previous comment! And yes, I would have also predicted that sources such as Duolingo or Memrise don't actively train you on these more complicated aspects, but I do think that what's most important is to the get used to them, by listening to and reading the language extensively (for exemple, listening to the radio or watching news broadcasts which usually feature slower and correct Portuguese). I wish you the best of luck! :)
You might be interested in a blog maintained by a former course contributor here, Luís Domingos. He's Portuguese, and was a tireless advocate for making the Duo Portuguese trees more welcoming for EP students/speakers. His blog is intended to highlight and educate about EP, as well as Portuguese culture in general. It's a pretty noteworthy and impressive resource.
The EP Experience blog https://theepexperience.wordpress.com
User vascotuga251 (a European Portuguese speaker) recently wrote an article on the Differences between Brazilian and European Portuguese which covers a lot you need to know.
You can't really narrow it down to clear skills in the Duolingo tree. Concepts such as pronunciation or the usage of "você" instead of "tu" go a lot further than one topic. I suggest you start by reading this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brazilian_Portuguese
I started learning European Portuguese first, so I'm aware of all the differences with its Brasilian counterpart. So now that the Portuguese resources I'm using are Brasilian, I still speak Portuguese with a European accent.
I begun with "Michel Thomas Portuguese" AND "Teach Yourself Complete Portuguese" (both of these teach the European accent). And don't get mixed up with Teach Yourself Complete Brasilian Portuguese as it's obviously the wrong one lol.
Maybe you should first use the 100day 50languages course for European Portuguese (I used the BR variant).
There are multiple PT EU/Portugal courses available on Memrise: https://www.memrise.com/courses/english/portuguese-portugal-2/
There are a lot more resources for Brazilian Portuguese. I’d say make the most out of them, but also get familiar with the differences between European Portuguese and Brazilian Portuguese.
Also: Babadum is a cute little website to learn vocabulary that also features European Portuguese :)