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  5. "I don't understand, Mara."

"I don't understand, Mara."

Translation:jIyajbe', mara.

August 1, 2018

8 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Doctorine_

What is the difference between vl- and jl- ?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jdmcowan

jI- indicates that there is no object (or at least a general, non-specific object), so things like, "I sleep", "I am happy", "I eat" (notice that I must eat something, but by using jI- I am saying that it is general and I'm not talking about eating something specific). So in this sentence it is saying that the not-understanding is general and not that there is something specific that I don't understand.

vI- indicates that there is a specific object (or objects) I have in mind, whether I have stated it (them) or not. So things like, "I eat it", "I hate them", "I want a weapon."

If I do want to specify what it is, I have to include it in the sentence in the object position: nuH vIneH ("I want the weapon.") But if I think you already know what I'm talking about, like if we have already been talking about the weapon, I don't have to put it in the sentence: vIneH ("I want it.") You will learn later about pronouns, which can be added to the sentence (like the "it" in the English translation). In English such pronouns are required (you can't say "I want" as a proper English sentence if you have a specific thing in mind), but in Klingon they are optional, so the prefix tells you whether to assume a specific, but unstated object or not.

An explanation is given in the Tips, but I know it’s a lot of new information and some details are bound to slip through the memory. However, since Duolingo has hidden the Tips I want to make sure you know about them and where to find them. If you have not been reading the Tips, I would like to ask that you review those so we don’t have to repeat too much of the information that we have explained there.

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https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SueELR
  • 1875

Sometimes they have the direct address name first with a comma, sometime it is last. Why?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jdmcowan

Don't you do the same in English? Sometimes you want to call the person's name first to make sure you have their attention: "Mara, I don't understand." Sometimes you say what you wanted to say and then decide you should call the person's name so they know you are talking to them: "I don't understand, Mara." The same thing happens with Klingon speakers. And when translating from one language to the other, we ask that you keep that order. If one language calls the person's name first, then the translation into the other language should also call the person's name first. Or if one language calls the person's name after, then the translation into the other language should also call the person's name after.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SueELR
  • 1875

Of course, I do the same thing in English, but I wouldn't mark it wrong if a student were to put it on the other side of the sentence in my French or Latin classes.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jdmcowan

I completely agree. We are more strict in Klingon mostly because there is a tendency for students to just try to do everything in reverse in Klingon. Many aspects of Klingon grammar present things in reverse order from how they appear in English - but not all aspects! Because of this many students get used to reading and writing sentences from the back and treat the language as if everything should be written in reverse order. We want to break this habit from the very beginning and help students learn when the order must be reversed and when it can be kept the same. Thus we are very strict on only changing the order when the grammar calls for it and insisting that things remain in the same order when the grammar allows a similar flexibility in both languages. It is a pedagogical technique specific to Klingon and we understand that it can be a little frustrating at first, but we feel that overall it leads to better Klingon learners.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/keenjane

Okay, help me out. In English "I don't understand, Mara" and "Mara, I don't understand" are the exact same sentence. So why are "I don't understand, Mara" and "Torg, I don't understand" completely reversed? If "I" am the subject, the other person is the object? So shouldn't her name be first in sentence order? Like it is in "torgh, jIyajbe' "


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jdmcowan

I gave a similar answer on your other post, and I haven't really added anything new here, but in case someone stumbles on this explanation first, I repeat myself...
Each of the sentences matches between the English and the Klingon. In both languages one can call Mara's name first or call Mara's name at the end - same with Torg's name or any other way to call someone. They are not exactly the same since one calls the name first and the other calls it at the end. Since we can do it the same way in both languages you should match the English sentence and the Klingon sentence. I understand your argument that they essentially mean the same thing and it is such a minor difference that we should not be so picky. The reason why we are picky anyway is because we want to make sure that all of our users learn when things can be matched to English and when they have to be reversed from English. Since this can be matched to the English and does not have to be reversed, we are strict on users keeping the match. Outside of this course no one will be so strict on having them match.

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