"Aku dan kamu."

Translation:You and I.

August 16, 2018

53 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/no.name.42

I think "me and you" sounds a little more natural.

August 16, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/IanWitham1

Thank you Duolingo.

"Aku dan kamu" is "I and you", which is ungrammatical in English. The Indonesian course allows us to write, "You and I", which is correct.

August 16, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/Tassilo6

Or "me and you"?

November 25, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/lili114354

ditto the previous comments - i think in english we'd much more likely say 'me and you' or as an alternative 'you and i'.

August 17, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/EsperantoKajelo

Me think that "me and you" is not the same as "you and I". They sound different to I.

("I" is used for subjects, "me" is used for objects. Unless this sentence is answering a question or something, in English we should almost definitely use the subjective form.)

December 31, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/Celia790081

Agree

February 14, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/MarksAaron

Any difference in use between "saya" and "aku"?

August 16, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/JxdxTxrrX

Both saya and aku mean I, but saya is used formally, while aku is used informally!

August 16, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/tnharvey

Is there any way to make this difference apparent in the course? This was very frustrating and confusing. Maybe indicating which in parentheses: saya (formal), aku (informal)?

Also, under what circumstances would one use the formal version? With all strangers, just in business, etc? Thanks!

August 18, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/MarcusWhel1

In general you should default to the more formal "saya" and "anda" when talking to new people, especially those older or in a higher position than you. I live in Indonesia and I generally use the formal pronouns until the other person switches to the informal. The one exception that comes to mind is if a friend introduces me to one of their friends, then generally the informal is fine (assuming we're of around the same age and social standing). It's a little nuanced, but generally "better safe than sorry" is the way to go.

August 23, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/tnharvey

Great response, thank you! This is similar to Spanish, which uses "usted" under similar circumstances.

August 24, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/Bierdame_Bo

My grandmother calls 'aku' pasar Indonesia, so I should use the phrase neneku only at home

April 12, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/MarksAaron

Thank you so much!

August 18, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/JxdxTxrrX

You’re welcome! Have a great day :D

August 18, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/PeterAusti2

Also regional - Java, it is not as often used Saya unless super-polite, mas.

October 18, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/XxRenegade

Although only in Malay

October 17, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/JAndrzej

"Saya" is formal and "aku" informal.

September 28, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/drewtyler13

As with previous comments, in English we would never say 'I and you.'

August 17, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/jeppetarp

Yes, however, we are not learning English are we?

The fastest way to learn Indonesian is to your change thought pattern of the the language you know (English) in your head to fit the grammar of Indonesian.

The direct translation of “Me/I and You” should be correct as we are learning Indonesian, not English and the meaning is the same.

Both answers should be allowed.

It’s the same issue with many sentences in this beta:

For example you get wrong if you translate “Dari mana Kama” into “from where are you?” Which is exactly what it translates to and correct Indonesian grammar (thus you learn the Indonesian sentence structure faster). However Duolingo wants you to write correct English grammar, not Indonesian and therefore you get wrong until you write “where are you from”, which honestly slows down your learning of Indonesian grammar.

August 31, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/PeterAusti2

It's about learning the language beyond simple phrases and to be able to think in the language - this is why many Indonesians will speak English as direct translation, as per your example, until the language becomes fluent enough to understand that literal translation is enough to be understood but not "correct".

It is an aide to learning and also facilitates the learners psycholinguistic lexicon, if such things are fixed.

Aku/Saya = I/Me

This is Duolingo's translation order for the words presenting an error - Aku/Saya, in this instance is "me", but because it is also "I", it translates - literally - as "I [and you]", which is not correct, following preposition, objective grammatical syntax.

It may be an Indonesian language course, but if the English is not correct then it will hamper learning.

There is more discussion on "I and you" than any other phrase in the early Indonesian lessons!

The 2nd most discussed appears to be the Islamic greetings and their place in basics, rather than as a separate section on religion.

Most people using this course will perhaps likely be tourists and not Muslim - to use such greetings may be respectful, but religion and tradition is a big deal in Indonesia - it can cause offense for bule to use Muslim greetings among those who adhere to traditional, die-hard Islam.

October 18, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/Jon.Orble

I agree jeppetarp! It is really annoying when Duo trys to teach me correct ENGLISH when I am learning INDONESIAN. I have no interest at all in what Duo might think about the way I use my native language - I am always right by definition :) The issue is particularly bad for Australian English speakers when Duo forces use of American English (in some places it allows both in others it forces American, so you never know where you are!). I have to remember the American version of a translation so that I am not marked wrong the next time the phrase comes up.

December 17, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/Missmelie

So, according to "jeppetarp", we should for example translate "Nama saya Andi" with "Name me Andi"/"Name I Andi", so that we learn faster about the Indonesian language "thought pattern"... Interesting !

Beside the translation question, is it possible to put "you" first instead of "I" in the Indonesian sentence ? Is "Kamu dan Aku" impossible or only less natural ?

November 7, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/jeppetarp

Yes, however, we are not learning English are we?

The fastest way to learn Indonesian is to your change thought pattern of the the language you know (English) in your head to fit the grammar of Indonesian.

The direct translation of “Me/I and You” should be correct as we are learning Indonesian, not English and the meaning is the same.

Both answers should be allowed.

It’s the same issue with many sentences in this beta:

For example you get wrong if you translate “Dari mana Kama” into “from where are you?” Which is exactly what it translates to and correct Indonesian grammar (thus you learn the Indonesian sentence structure faster). However Duolingo wants you to write correct English grammar, not Indonesian and therefore you get wrong until you write “where are you from”, which honestly slows down your learning of Indonesian grammar.

August 31, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/PeterAusti2

I try not to use "should" and "shouldn't" in English, as they are absolute words without reason nor flexibility.

"It might be an idea to allow acceptance of both the answers because..." is likely to sway more your way.

Ask any UN negotiator about fluidity of language and how to leave 100 people hearing 100 different things from the same speech - they'll say the same.

October 18, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/kenurremot

Should be "me and you". I and you is not correct english.

October 7, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/jocy941869

Im pretty sure its supposed to be "me and you" if its with "i" it should be "you and i" just an fwi

October 16, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/jeppetarp

Shouldn’t it Be “me and you” ?

August 31, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/shayb90

I ended up translating back in english as

'I. and You'...

December 12, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/Shmo141998

If the goal of this question is to make sure that the learner understands Aku= Me/I and Kamu=You, the answer "me and you" should be accepted. because Aku is written first in the prompt...

January 17, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/jake64246

It's: me and you

January 27, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/hankerface

Seems like "me and you" should be accepted

February 5, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/PeterAusti2

"Another correct solution: I and you" needs to be updated to reflect previous corrections to "You and I" in earlier lessons.

The discussions there led to the substitution of "I and you" due to non-contextual sentence and proper Inggris translation using preposition (eg, "only") before objective [(i)t/(s)he(y)] and I.

Aku/Saya = I / Me, so it is acceptable for "me and you", but improper english for "I and you" - the alternate translation order puts "I" first - therefore syntax must be corrected for English grammar in this [alternate] translation.

I did not check if "you and me" would be acceptable - this would also be, as it is interchangeable with "me and you".

October 18, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/theSardonyx

"You and me" isn't accepted by Duolingo

November 28, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/Reuben

How is "me and you" incorrect?

November 8, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/Lobi16

When do you use Aku rather than Saya?

November 9, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/Tassilo6

"Aku" is the personal form, whereas "Saya" is the more formal version.

If you speak with an elder person or someone in a higher hierarchy level, you use "Bapak/Pak" or "Ibu/Bu" (Father, Mother) instead of "Kamu", and "Saya" for I/Me instead of "Aku". When talking to a very close friend, you can use "Aku" and "Kamu". If some person is in your age and hierarchy level, but not so close, you call him/her sister or brother (Mbak or Mas) or elder sibling (Kakak) and yourself "Saya".

Indonesian is a little complicated for Europeans in that respekt. Sorry if there are any mistakes (especially in writing), I just learned these things orally from my Indonesian girlfriend in Indonesia.

November 25, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/LachlanWoo7

Me and you???

December 6, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/marthe393053

Me and you seems like a correct translation

January 17, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/MagdaCamac7

I don’t get it, first you write kamu Dan aku you and I Then you say Aku Dan kamu means the same

January 24, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/Ferrydust

Why is Me and You wrong?

February 13, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/rita825831

i am confused as aku means I or me and kamu means you. why is me and you for that one incorrect when the order of the words is correct?

February 18, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/JarrodMain

Same as other comments; "me and you" should stand as a correct answer. To only accept "You and I" is over-zealous prescriptivism and in fact is not always the correct syntax.

February 19, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/JeanMarcPa5

It's wrong

February 24, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/BertScholten

It is literally me and you

April 1, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/pete_the_dude

"Me and you" should not be wrong

April 1, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/JimCraney

Aku dan kamu surely means "Me and you" not "You and I" even though the latter is grammatically correct in English.

April 2, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/Bierdame_Bo

My grandmother told me there are several pronouns to use depending on your status and your relationship towards the other, more than just saya and aku, is that correct? I thought saya was the most formal, aku the most informal and that there are some inbetween?

April 12, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/PeterHilto3

No, we are not learning English, but the question was to translate from another laguage to English, so the result should be correct English

December 31, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/PeterHilto3

You and I is by far more correct than I and you...

December 31, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/JarrodMain

But 'me and you' is also grammatically correct.

February 25, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/PeterHilto3

Not in English, it isn't. It should be 'you and me' or 'you and I'. For example, take this sentence: 'Me and you are going to the pictures.' Now test it by removing the 'and you'. 'Me are going to the pictures' - not good grammar! In fact, terrible! But when it is 'you and me' and you remove the 'and me', it becomes 'You are going to the pictures' and correct grammar.

February 25, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/JarrodMain

It's certainly ungrammatical in the example you gave, but that doesn't make it universally ungrammatical. e.g. 'They want me and you to clean up' is grammatical. 'You and I' would be ungrammatical in this instance for the reason you just gave: 'They want I to clean up.'

February 25, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/PeterHilto3

In the context of my example above, your example would then be: "They want you to clean up." The test involves removing the 'and I'. Rather than jump back and forth with examples and such, I am remembering the genesis of all this discussion: translate from one language to English, which means the result must align within correct grammatical constraints of English.

February 25, 2019
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