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"Absolutely don't believe that!"

Translation:Nepre ne kredu tion!

September 4, 2018

9 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/VirgilSchmidt

I wrote "absolute ne kredu tiun"

And was denied. Why?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/salivanto

I blame the usual suspects. New-ish tree. Alternatives not added yet. Report using report-a-problem.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/gmoaltos

Good to know. I prefer this alternative with "neeviteble" and "senmanke". In "nepre" I feel a negative aspect like if it was already meaning "absolutely not"... Maybe because it looks like "never".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/salivanto

Does "He will undoubtedly be here" mean that he won't be here because the adverb starts with "un"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/gmoaltos

I don't get your question. In undoubtedly there is a negative aspect "no doubt". I like "nedubeble" too. It's just that (correct me if I'm wrong) nepre is not the negation of anything, just a form for itself. By putting "ne" at the beginning, they created a disturbing word for me. Those things exist in other languages, mine too (French).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/salivanto

It wasn't really a question, since the answer is clearly - no: undoubtedly implies "certainty." If I could go back and do it over again, I would have said "invariably" instead.

If you want to learn Esperanto, you have to learn the word nepre. It's a rather common word. I learned it to mean "without fail."

You're right that there is no Esperanto word "pre" which is the opposite of nepre - but we also don't say "variably" or "with fail" as the opposite of "invariably" or "without fail" - even though these sound like negative words. In the deep, dark, pre-Esperantan etymology, the "ne" in "nepre" really was a negation. (непременно)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/gmoaltos

... for undoubtedly or invariably the roots are respectively the one of doubt and variation. Invariably means the opposite of its roots even if people don't say variably.

"If you want to learn a language, learn this by heart, everyone use it, it's common, just do it". This is the kind of sentences without justifications that made me hate French and other languages when I was young.

I think nepre has been built like network without thinking negating a word like twork. This is what I would like to know if possible. Thank you anyway.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/salivanto

I think nepre has been built like network without thinking negating a word like twork. This is what I would like to know if possible.

If you could start out with what you'd like to know, it would make answering a lot less frustrating.

Nepre comes from the Russian word непременно - which, as I understand it, literally means "invariably." The "ne" prefix in Russian literally means "not" - and переменная is "variable."

Zamenhof took a word like "nepremenno", chopped it off after the 5th letter and said - hey, that would be a cool word in Esperanto. It even ends in E like a good adverb should so it's no coincidence that it starts with "ne" and that makes you think of "not" - but it doesn't mean "not" any more than "without fail" means "without".

"If you want to learn a language, learn this by heart, everyone use it, it's common, just do it". This is the kind of sentences without justifications that made me hate French and other languages when I was young.

Quite honestly, it sounds like you hate learning Esperanto too. If you don't hate it, you could start by saying things like:

  • I want to understand....

instead of

  • I prefer ...

Esperanto doesn't care what you or I prefer.


Edit: in your reply below, you proved my point by saying that you don't care about Esperanto, specifically:

it's not Esperanto doesn't care, it's people don't care about languages

If you are constantly questioning and rejecting Esperanto as it's spoken by it's speech community, then it's difficult to believe your claim that you're "learning Esperanto". You say at the end that you love it, but it's hard to see how what you love is really Esperanto if you're not interested in how Esperanto is actually spoken.

But we've discussed this in other threads.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/gmoaltos

I didn't ask a question a the beginning, then I wanted one with your comments : and you gave it to me ! Thank you ! It's better to understand and learn a word from its roots for me (for me and others, not everyone). Now I know why I don't like Nepre and I'll not use it, there are other logical choices I like.

Like I said I hated languages for more than 20 years. Since I had to help foreigners to learn French I got interested by the two languages when looking deep, in the history. Languages are living. You're wrong, it's not Esperanto doesn't care, it's people don't care about languages : they make them, they change them, they hate or love them. There are rules that people know and don't care or don't apply because of how the brain works. It's why is better to teach with reasons than make people learn by heart. Please don't teach. Thank you. (I love Esperanto)

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