As a native English speaker I would say "I would like so much for her to decide", but that wasn't accepted either! Duolingo doesn't accept 'so much', just 'very much'.
Although the meaning of "really" and "very much" is more or less the same, I think DL wants a closer translation to the original, so "really" would have had "davvero" in the original sentence
The past subjunctive is used because of "vorrei", "I would like", this is the conditional form of the verb therefore the verb that comes after "che" needs to be in the past subjunctive form. If we were to translate "I want her to decide" then we would use the present subjunctive, i.e "voglio che lei decida"
On my next return here on strengthening, plan to try the following: "I would like it very much if she were to decide". Formal and a bit stiff - but it uses the English subjunctive past where the Italian is subjunctive past.
Didn't work for me :( Not accepted, but I think it should be, strictly speaking.
Then what I might try next would be "I would like it very much if she were deciding" - that should be accepted.
Duo's treatment of the subjunctive is, IMO (In My Opinion), rather cramped and overly restrained. Yet, at the same time, Duo freely uses present tense for past tense subjunctive and marks as incorrect certain English subjunctive past constructions. At times, it almost seems to me that whoever is developing a particular sentence just doesn't know enough about English subjunctive to formulate something that approximates the subjunctive in English - because English present tense certainly does not do that.
It's true the the subjunctive is very much falling into disuse or non-use in English, but that's a shame, and I wish Duo wouldn't assist in its demise by using Present Tense so much. That habit also does a disservice to the Italian, because it so inaccurately gets across the idea of the subjunctive in Italian.
Bottom line here, though, is that, if Duo is go to play so fast-and-loose with linguistic structures as to transform verbs from subjunctive past to present tense, then Duo should be much more accepting of creative ways to express the actual subjunctive past tense, even if it involves the use of an infinitive where there is none in the original language.
Good luck with that one! I almost hope it isn't accepted :) I agree with you re the English use of the subjunctive, but just because it isn't used much nowadays doesn't mean that its correct use should be marked wrong. I'm always aware, however, that Duo is a free programme and as such delivers a great service. Still, no harm in trying to improve things.
:-)) And no harm in letting other users know that there are much more nuanced forms of English which in fact more accurately translated the meaning of subjunctive in Foreign languages, and that Duo is failing us in this regard.
I was amazed at how simplistic the module on subjective was. It almost seemed like the developers had just decided it was too hard, so they didn't do it.
Shouldn't the Italian be translated as "I would very much like her to make her mind up", rather than simply "decide"?
Seems the same to me as Duo's translation - In think you've just run into a situation where Duo doesn't have your specific answer in their database.
Because it doesn't make sense in English. Generally speaking, "indeed" is added to a response for emphasis, eg "Would you like her to decide?" "I would indeed". There are a couple of other ways to use this word, but it never means "very much".
mcortel: "Indeed, I would like her to decide" may not be accepted by DL in this instance but this sentence is otherwise correct in making use of "indeed" for emphasis rather than "very much".
DL gives us the word "vorrei", which in English is translated as "I would like". You have written "I want", which in Italian is "voglio". "Tanto" does mean "so much" but in this sentence "tanto" modifies "vorrei", that means that we need to express the fact that I would like it so much. In your sentence you have written "so much" after "decide", this suggests that she needs to decide so much i.e a lot of things, therefore the way you have written it is ambiguous, so the only way to translate DL's sentence correctly, is to say "I would very much like her to decide".
So "tanto" now can mean "VERY much." Not the message I got from another exercise.
My question is the same as Philbinrap, why the imperf subj and not the present subj? thesoph33 explains that vorrei requires the imperf subj whereas voglio would take the present subj. I do not understand this distinction. Can it be explained further?
"Vorrei" means "I would like". The verb "would like" is in the conditional form, the second conditional which is used to express something that has not happened and is unlikely to happen. The second part of the sentence, "che lei si decidesse" means "that she decided". The verb in the past form tells us that something hasn't happened, and it is most likely that it won't, i.e that she won't decide. Another example to show this point: "I would like that he were here now". The fact is that he is not here, therefore we use the verb in the past form, ie the past subjunctive, to show this. This form using "I would like that .." is not used in spoken English, instead we use the infinitive, like this: "I would like HIM TO BE here now". So, back to the sentence in question, "Vorrei che lei si decidesse", using the construction with "that", we would say: "I would like that she decided" but to put it in a more modern way of speaking, we use the infinitive and say: "I would like HER TO DECIDE". It implies that although I would like her to decide, I know that she won't.
If we were using the present tense "voglio", then the present subjunctive would be used: "Voglio che lei si decida". This would be translated as: "I want that she decides, or I want her to decide". This tells us that the likelihood of her deciding is much more possible, whereas "vorrei che lei si decidesse" is very unlikely that she will make any decision.
Whether we use "voglio" and "si decida" or "vorrei" and "si decidesse" has to do with the likelihood of it happening. Eg "I want her to be rich", "Voglio che lei sia ricca" seems a more likely possibility than "I would like her to be rich", "Vorrei che lei fosse ricca". Likewise, "Vorrei che lei si decidesse" seems very unlikely.
Edoah2, I hope this explanation makes it clearer.
A native English speaker writes: While what you say about the implied relative likelihood of what is desired coming about in each of the two cases may be true of the Italian sentences ("Vorrei... si decidesse" and "Voglio.. si decida"), it is not at all true of the English versions.
Neither of "I would like her to decide" and "I want her to decide" gives any indication at all of whether she is in fact likely to decide. The only difference is that the former sounds more polite and less insistent than does the latter.
"Vorrei che loro decidessero." and "Vorrei tanto che le si decidesse..." Why does one of these DL sentences require "si" and the other does not?
According to my OUP dictionary, and online sources, it seems that the non-reflexive form "decidere" means "to decide", and the reflexive form "decidersi" can mean either "to make one's mind up" or "to decide", so it seems there may be a subtle difference. It would be great if a native Italian would explain, please.
Se tu voglia usare "a lot", dovresti scrivere "I would like IT a lot if she decided" oppure "I would like IT a lot for her to decide". Però queste frasi suonano un po' maldestre.
your screen version says 'she decide' not she decides which is correct in english
"I would like" is what English-speakers tend to say where speakers of Romance languages (and maybe others) say the literal equivalent of "I would want". Translation is about usage as well as formal equivalence.
This whole imperfect subjunctive chapter is just simply annoying from a point and on. The examples simply don't work in English (being such a broken language as it is)
This lesson is driving me crazy. All of the sentences have the same number of syllables. They all sound the same, they all use permutations of the same small sets of words. The tone of the voice is so monotonic. Many of the sentences are repeated over and over. This is a never ending nightmare. Guys we are freaking humans, not robots.