"This is not taro."

Translation:ʻAʻole kēia he kalo.

December 28, 2018

22 Comments
This discussion is locked.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jdmcowan

'A'ole he kalo keia (with proper 'okina and macron) was rejected. Is it not possible to switch them?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KarinLynn1

"'A'ole ke kalo kēia" should be accepted, in my opinion (not that opinion counts, I guess!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RobertGay7

Why is kēia before kalo here when other instances of kēia or kēlā come at the end?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jdmcowan

Notice that in most equivalence sentences, you can put the nouns in either order, but the sentence needs to be introduced by one of the particles that indicates an equivalence sentence:
'O ko'u makua kāne ke kumu. ("My father is the teacher.")
'O ke kumu ko'u makua kāne. ("The teacher is my father.")

"He" can also indicate an equivalence sentence and so in positive sentences it seems that it might be most common to put the "he" term first:
He kalo kēia. ("This is a taro.")

However, I believe it might be possible to use 'O instead and put the "he" term second:
'O kēia he kalo. ("A kalo is this.")
As indicated by the English translation I gave, I believe this order is technically correct, but is just an odd order to put it in. But I'm not completely sure that it is as odd in Hawaiian as it is in English, so hopefully someone more advanced than me will be able to come along and give a more definite answer.

I admit that I'm not really sure how the negative "'a'ole" effects this. In some sentences, it does effect the order of the words. Maybe it does not sound good in front of "he" so this reversed order of the two terms is preferred with "'a'ole". Or maybe it is just that with "'a'ole" there is not such a strong preference and by pure chance, you found a sentence where they put the "he" term second. Again, I hope a more advanced speaker can clarify this for us.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KarinLynn1

I thought "he" was only ever at the beginning of a sentence?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Eliza727459

Here it's the idea of "not" so the negation comes first, and the "what is" comes after the negation in typical style. [This not] [be taro]. So in a sense, the "he" is at the beginning - the beginning of the "be/is" statement. But negation gets tacked onnto the front of the sentence. Does that work as an explanation?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KarinLynn1

Yes - I guess 'a'ole (and 'a'ohe?) are the Big Exception for a lot of stuff! Mahalo. (I still feel like the meaning is "not taro" instead of "not this," but I concede ;) !)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/rabelon

https://forum.duolingo.com/comment/29862817 The position of the subject in a negative sentence follows the verb, EXCEPT when the subject is a pronoun. In that case, the subject moves forward to immediately follow the negation.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/lynneo

Mahalo! After some intense thought (LOL), your comment makes perfect sense. "taro/kalo" is NOT the subject; rather, "This/kēia" is the subject. It is a demonstrative pronoun. So "kēia" (subject) must come directly after " 'a'ole" (the negation "not"), according to your explanation of the correct answer. 'A'ole (negation) kēia (subject) he (verb) kalo (object). Now if I can only remember this...


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KarinLynn1

I'm back to trying to figure out which thing is being negated, which IMO here is "kalo" ("not taro," not "not this"). But moving the kēia up because its a pronoun is a whole different rule / concept, which I guess is good enough to explain it!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jdmcowan

Note that this is an equivalence sentence. Or rather a "not equivalence" sentence. It's not saying "not taro" or "not this". It's saying, these two things ("this" and "a taro") are not the same.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Eliza727459

"This" is a more specific indicator than "a" or "the." There's an implied direction of attention. So the negation addresses the kēia "up front" and "le kalo" clarifies what kēia is referencing. When it's not a negation, the kēia can often, but not always, go at either end of the sentence. Does that help?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/rianna7

I'm not sure I understand why "he" is used here? Any guesses/explanations/other resources I can check out?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Pohaikealoha

It seems to work for my phone (android).

For ‘okina, hold down the apostrophe key and after a second or so there should be an expansion of similar characters. Select the one that curves to the right.

For kahakō, hold down the corresponsing letter until an expansion appears. Select the ā, ē, ī, ō or ū.

Alternatively there is a hawaiian keyboard that can be downloaded from the play store :)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Eliza727459

Which keyboard download do you trust? They all seem sketchy to me, but definitely want the o macron!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/OulonoFola

The " ' " and the " - " cannot be written but I appreciate the typos.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/CATipton

They can if your keyboard has an option for the Hawaiian language. SwiftKey does, for example.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Aerin41424

Why wouldn't "'a'ole kēia he ke kalo" be accepted? Is it just that that translates to "this isn't THE taro" and that's different enough, or is there another reason?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jdmcowan

The simplest answer is that it seems each noun can only have one determiner. You have to choose either "he" or "ke" and I don't think you cannot use both on the same noun.

If the English says "a" then pick the Hawaiian determiner "he". If the English says "the", then use the Hawaiian determiner "ka/ke". When the English has no article, I'm not always clear, myself, on how to choose a determiner for the Hawaiian - I think most times either is accepted, but I'm not sure

There does seem to be at least one exception to the "one determiner" rule. When you are doing an equivalences sentence ("this is that") and neither noun has the "he" determiner, then you have to put 'O before the first determiner.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KarinLynn1

Aloha e Jdmccowan - I see that you have a gold border on your avatar that says "Trailblazer Host Moderator." (I also just discovered GaryKaHaumana has a green border and it says "Host.") Do you know what either of those means???


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jdmcowan

A Host is someone who hosts Duolingo Events for people to participate in. I don't think you can find the events page in the app, but check out events.duolingo.com. I think Hosts normally get a green ring, but I'm not sure. They are usually a host for one particular language and it may not be the one for which they are posting in the forums.

Moderator means that they have responsibility for keeping some particular forums clear of clutter. I believe there are two types of host. One type is limited to just one or just a few forums and their ring is normally green. The other has moderator powers across the forums and they usually get gold rings. Again Moderators might also post in forums where they have no responsibilities or powers.

A Trailblazer is a special recognition from Duolingo staff that the person has been a big help on Duolingo. Staff can give them out for any reason, but I believe they normally don't give them out very often. Recently Duolingo ended its volunteer contributor program and I think they gave Trailblazer status to most of the former contributors. I think most of the Trailblazers you see will be former contributors. Contributors had two levels with green and gold rings like the Moderators and I think Trailblazers have kept the color of the ring.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KarinLynn1

WOW! Mahalo for all the intel! I love Duo but it is definitely a black box! I will keep this description for future reference (and seek out "events"!). Pls reply if you have any idea what those little bouncing yellow arrows are on the leaderboards - that seems to have everyone in that forum stymied!! ;) ).
Again Mahalo Nui Loa!! (And ho'omaika'i (congrats??) on being a Trailblazer!)

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