"Persaingan ini diyakini membuat dia senang."

Translation:This competition is believed to make him happy.

January 22, 2019

6 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/joeldipops

I know that yakin means certain, so is menyakini a little bit stronger than "believes", or not really? I can't quite make out what kbbi is trying to say:

meyakini/me·ya·kini/ v yakin (percaya dan sebagainya) benar (akan): benarkah engkau ~ nasihatku ini?;

January 22, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/Rick392366

Yes, it's stronger than just "to believe".
My own translation would be "truly/really believe".

The KBBi definiton of "meyakini" refers back to the base word, so it may be better to look at the base word first.

yakin/ya·kin/ a
1 percaya (tahu, mengerti) sungguh-sungguh; (merasa) pasti (tentu, tidak salah lagi):
hakim -- akan kesalahan terdakwa itu;
ia berkata dengan -- nya, berkata dengan pasti;
pada -- ku, pada pendapatku;
2 sungguh; sungguh-sungguh:
-- bukan saya yang mengambil, kalau perlu saya berani bersumpah; dengan -- belajar, belajar sungguh-sungguh;

The first definition translated :
"really/truly believe (know, understand)", "(feeling) sure (certain, definitely)".

The example sentences :
The judge is sure/certain about the mistake of that defendant.
He says confidently/with certainty.
To my confince / In my opinion.

The KBBi definition of "meyakini" does not provide another synonym or new info, except for the example sentence.
"Benarkah engkau meyakini nasihatku ini?"
"Is it true that you (truly/really) believe my advice?"

As you can see in the KBBI definitions and example sentences, it's all about the word "sungguh" (really/truly) and "pasti" (certainly).
That's the reason that I would translate this verb with "truly/really believe".
So, I would be using an additional adverb for the translation.
I don't know if there is an equivalent English verb (without the use of an adverb).
I have not seen any suggestions yet.

January 22, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/joeldipops

Thanks for the extended explanation. However I'm still curious how this text should be translated. yakin (percaya dan sebagainya) benar (akan)

From your explanation, I think that if menyakini was used in an active sense, "is confident that" would be a good translation.
"She is confident that the rivalry will make her happy"

I don't think there's any good way to make that work in a passive sense though. Maybe "truly believed" is one of the best translations.

January 22, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/Rick392366

However I'm still curious how this text should be translated.
yakin (percaya dan sebagainya) benar (akan)

My translation would be something like this:
truly believe (believe etc) truly (in/about)
'yakin' is translated as 'truly believe'.
'benar' is also translated as 'truly'.
That makes it 'truly truly believe'.
That's the same as the definition for the base word : 'yakin' = 'percaya sungguh-sungguh'.

There is no difference in meaning.
The difference is the transitiivity.
The 'me-i' affix converts 'yakin' (intransitive verb) into 'meyakini' (active transitive verb, needing an object).
'me-i' has a locative function: the action occurs at the location of the object.
That's why the word 'akan' (in/about) appears in the definition.
'akan' is the implied/included preposition in this 'me-i' verb.
It introduces the object (and the location of the action).

BTW, it's not the same 'akan' that is used to indicate the future tense.
It's another 'akan', synonymous with "kepada", "tentang", "untuk":
https://kbbi.web.id/akan-2

Let's have another look at the KBBI example sentence and a simplified version:
"Benarkah engkau meyakini nasihatku ini?"
"Is it true that you truly believe in my advice?"

"Kamu meyakini nasihatku"
"You truly believe in my advice."
"You are confident about my advice."

The second sentence is a simplified version, a declarative sentence.
The sentence uses an active transitive verb.
This can be transformed into a passive sentence, like this:
"Nasihatku diyakini olehmu."
"My advice is truly believed by you."
"My advice is confident about you."
<==this is not good.

The sentence in passive mood doesn't sound good, but it's only to show that 'meyakini' is an active transitive verb that can be transformed into the passive counterpart 'diyakini'.
Another point is, "is confident that" cannot be converted into in a passive mood.

From your explanation, I think that if menyakini was used in an active sense, "is confident that" would be a good translation.
"She is confident that the rivalry will make her happy"

'is confident that' would be a good translation in the active mood and if the verb is 'yakin'.
(See the three KBBI example sentences of 'yakin').
'is confident that' is a structure that cannot have an object as far as I know.
'is confident that' cannot be converted into a passive mood (see example above).
That's why I think that this translation does not work well if the verb is 'meyakini'.

My translation, from EN to ID, would be something like this:
"She is confident (that) the rivalry will make her happy."
"Dia yakin (bahwa) persaingan itu akan membuat dia senang."

"yakin" is used here (intransitive verb).
I wouldn't use 'meyakini' here.
I wouldn't know what the object would be and how to make it passive.
So, to me this is an active sentence with an intransitive verb.
Because of this intransitive verb, the sentence cannot be transformed into a passive mood.
This sentence consists of a main clause ('Dia yakin') followed by a 'bahwa' clause.
The agent/actor of the main clause is "dia".
That's a different agent/actor than the original sentence.

Compare this with the original sentence:
"Persaingan ini diyakini membuat dia senang."
Please note that this is also an active sentence.
"persaingan ini" is the agent/actor in this sentence.
"membuat" is the main verb of the predicate.
"diyakini" functions as a sort of a modifier for the main verb in the predicate.

"diyakini" can be dropped and the sentence would still be grammatically correct.
The sentence would of course have a different meaning.
"Persaingan ini membuat dia senang."
"This rivalry makes her happy."

I think the sentence decomposition would be something like this (active & passive):
"Persaingan ini [S] diyakini membuat [P] dia [O] senang [Pel]."
"Dia [S] diyakini dibuat [P] senang [Pel] oleh persaingan ini [Ket]."

"Persaingan ini [S] membuat [P] dia [O] senang [Pel]."
"Dia [S] dibuat [P] senang [Pel] oleh persaingan ini [Ket]."

The passive mood doesn't sound good here, but it's only show the active versus passive.
"persaingan ini" is the agent/actor.
"membuat" is transformed into 'dibuat', this is the main verb in the predicate.
"diyakini" remains the same, both in active & passive mood.
"diyakini" functions as a modifier for the main verb in the predicate.
"diyakini" can be dropped (although it changes the meaning of the sentence).

To make a long story a little bit longer :
"Penjelasan ini diyakini memusingkan semua orang."
"Saya yakin bahwa penjelasan ini akan memusingkan semua orang."

January 23, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/joeldipops

Thankyou very much for that.

January 24, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/Jake929031

I would say this is the most relevant bit from above.

The 'me-i' affix converts 'yakin' (intransitive verb) into 'meyakini' (active transitive verb, needing an object).

In that I would think it is mostly a grammatical change. As to meaning I thought yakin was more certainty, surety and percaya belief. I guess there is similarities but in english they are definitely used differently.

May 9, 2019
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