https://www.duolingo.com/Leftymlb

Whose idea was it to limit the XP to 20 points when testing out of a level?

You may think this is a good plan, but it's not. If I have to, I will set my target goal to 5 XP per day, just to stay on the same type of schedule I've been using all along. The decision you made coincides with me reaching Part 7 in the French class, so if you decide to leave it like this, I'll consider other language learning programs when I finish.

Do you really not understand how XP points can motivate learning?

This was a pretty unpleasant surprise today.

March 5, 2019

49 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/OwenMkNelly

yea they punked me I'm just trying to get that lv 25 and 20 xp is such a pain

March 5, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/Flower_power.

This is not cool. Why would they do that?

March 5, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/Alec851453

I agree, this is really stinks. Please change this back, or at least explain why. This is just being plain mean.

March 6, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/Ursulias

@Alec851453. I think the explanation is simple - and disappointing. It is money.

If I just could test out of my current Italian Unit Adj.3, Level 4, which is one of the longest units ever with 45 Lessons (!!!) I would not see the advertisements of 44 lessons.

It is a punishment for those who either already know the language or those who learn faster.

You get a reward in form of 440 XP only if you do those additonal 44 lessons and 44 ads - and click away those 44 ads. I guess it is as simple as that.

Of course everybody is right who says, 'I want to learn the language, I don't do it in order to collect XP, or crowns, or those useless lingots, or to compete with others, all I want is to learn'.
- Well, yes. That's right. I want to learn languages, me too - but it is easier when learning is fun. I have textbooks in Danish, Turkish, Arab, French, English, Italian, Spanish - but it is sometimes difficult to sit down and work with a textbook. It gives a good feeling to get a reward when you learned so well that you can test out of a unit. Even if it is only XP. And it really is a significant motivation to sit down and practice when you have a streak and don't want to lose it.

I was and I still am really enthusiastic about Duolingo and the idea behind it and I am thankful for the great app - but I am sad about the development.

March 8, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/grumpy700875

Bingo! And about more than ads. Clicks, site statistics, profiling individuals and groups and learning about them, learning abilities, reading abilities, fastness, memory, preferences - a goldmine for data miners. It tells how ads can even be more tricky, manipulative and subliminal. The statistics about clicks, page views, time users being online and so forth are increasing the revenues and the value of a site if they plan to sell it. Means the site you and me too were so enthusiastic about prefers now slow and repeating agony instead of motivation and game-like fun. The fun clears the space for money, gamification became monetizing.

I didn't trust it from the beginning, I loved it, but it was too good to be true. Right now disappointment is left. I still hope they roll it back, but I doubt - their vision changed.

March 8, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/CobaltOakTree

Spot on analysis. I give it 10 greedy owls out of 10.

March 14, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/PeterWinkler

but what about duolingo plus? it will be stupid from duolingo to give plus-users who test out 20 XP as well, considering that it will only motivate people to get duolingo plus.

June 24, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/Hyperpolygl0t

It also happened to me and not really cool...Du also robbed me my 20 lingots when i was in tubby league and didnt add to my lingots...

March 5, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/Ros80449

I agree-the fact that you could gain more points for testing out is a psychological boost even if the actual result is the same. Bad move!

March 7, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/acenderasvelas

Terrible idea. Tired of slogging through the same stupidly easy, repetitive lessons to get to the vocab/grammar I need practice on. The German tree is driving me up the wall.

March 6, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/Nanu651750

I came to coment the same, I am very desagree with this New system

March 7, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/lurkscience

This was a major bummer, I wasn't paying attention and I did about 5k worth of XP and got less that 3-400 when all was said and done....cool!

March 7, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/ith2
  • 192

I can see it is not just me I was hoping it was only a bug

March 7, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/CobaltOakTree

Might be a bug called "greed" on part of the one running the website, as now you get the benefit of looking at way more ads as you go through each individual unit.

March 14, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/mosstoe

I am not pleased with being limited to 20 XP for testing out of a level. I am very disappointed with that.

March 7, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/MorganR2D2

I also feel incredibly robbed. I am a fast learner, I can and do go into a skill, and on the 4th/5th level am able to test out. This level also happens to have the most number of lessons in it. I feel I deserve the XP that I earned by paying attention and learning the material well! Very uncool.

March 8, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/AnnaGuaGua

I came here to say the same thing! I just did one test with 21 lessons with the hopes of getting 210 XP. Instead I got robbed and only got 20.

Uncool Duolingo, uncool.

March 5, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/Bastien_M

Yeah, don't know who came with that terrible idea.

Probably the same guy who implemented the fact that now you have to pay on the mobile version to do the test for passing a level of a skill with lingots...

March 7, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/grumpy700875

They are about to completely demolish their own idea. Other sites tried that and lost 80 - 90% of their users. It happens when greed kicks in.

March 7, 2019

[deactivated user]

    I think it is time for me to leave DL.

    March 7, 2019

    https://www.duolingo.com/Bastien_M

    I guess it would give them a nice electroshock if something like this happens.

    March 7, 2019

    https://www.duolingo.com/grumpy700875

    Seems it did happen!

    March 14, 2019

    https://www.duolingo.com/grumpy700875

    they should at least allow us to put those brave [deaktivierter User]'s on our friendslist, all be it in a kind of in memory function. In the end, they show DL and us that it IS possible.

    March 14, 2019

    https://www.duolingo.com/CobaltOakTree

    You have to pay lingots to test out!? Wew lad. I never used the mobile app and doesn't sound like I'll start any time soon.

    March 14, 2019

    https://www.duolingo.com/Bastien_M

    The mobile app is a nice way to kill some time while waiting.

    Though, they really wanted to kill the testing out feature, paying for possibly 20xp hehe, lovely.

    March 14, 2019

    https://www.duolingo.com/grumpy700875

    "Do you really not understand how XP points can motivate learning?"

    Oh they do, that's why they chose to introduce their service with "gaming experience" and bling bling in the first place. They just entered the next phase. They don't have to hook up new users anymore since they hooked up millions already by now. Now we entered a phase where all is about milking clicks from hooked up users.

    In this phase they are on step three right now. Step one was remodeling the UI with the nice side effect of loosing golden owls and getting leveled down by at least 2.5 levels on the users side. In return we got crappy icons instead of photos (I call that dumb down 3.0).

    Step two was - in my case - losing a 520 days streak because a language teaching international entrepreneur with a gazillion user isn't able to figure the different time zones and summer/winter time change? In return we got the generous offer to buy our streak back, no not with tokens, with real money. For a better understanding I'll repeat that: we got the offer to buy our streak back , once more: yes, to buy it back. More about that issue is to find in these two excellent threads: https://forum.duolingo.com/comment/15214047 https://forum.duolingo.com/comment/15196374

    Instead of buying back a feature that I already payed for with daily appearance on the site and in the stats I decided to vent a bit and tossing my 2300+ tokens into the crowd in order to not visit the site for bling bling anymore, not to fall for that crap anymore (could have known better in the first place). I have right now 650 tokens left - for now, in a few minutes it will be less.

    We reached step three now, after leveling users down by taking away levels en masse during "renewing the site" and after taking streaks away en masse we get leveled down by being slowed down. You got to work your way through every tiny lesson level, no matter if it's your mothers language or a language you already learned partially. Means you will need about 5 times as much clicks and sentences in order to reach your general level of the language - like I said before, even if it is your native language.

    After loosing my streak I made sure that there will be nothing to lose anymore and kept the streak on maximum 1 day. It's about quart of a year now that I log in only sporadically on DL. By not working the streak anymore I found time to discover 50languages and it's pretty relaxed to learn with this site. I just need my smartphone and my aftershokz while walking the dogs and I don't even realize anymore that I am learning. There is just a voice babbling into my ear and after a while I learned quite easily quite a lot. No bling, no pressure.

    Now I came back to DL to go on with another language and what a surprise, they changed to getting 20 xp for 20 lessons instead of 200 and in one case I ended up with ten xp minus instead of 20 plus. It becomes entertaining.

    I am very curious and look forwards to what else they have up their sleeves to surprise us. Maybe they start with the old and loyal users who all build up several language skills on highest levels to "test" on a small group of users to make DL fully paid? No wait, DL promised that it will be always free. So they cant do that. But I am sure they will find a clever way around in order to "keep their promise".

    So do I really need the bling? And if not so, what's left that really makes DL a fun or good site for learning languages?

    March 7, 2019

    https://www.duolingo.com/Torniojaws

    Youtube used to be free of ads. Now you got free ads with your ads. Right about when Google discarded their corporate motto "Don't be evil" :)

    June 10, 2019

    https://www.duolingo.com/Hyperpolygl0t

    You know fellas, it'll be ok if they also reduce the xp amount needed for changing levels i mean it must be reduced unless about 30000 xp is neede for leve 25. tell me how much time is need to rech that level with 20 xp?

    March 14, 2019

    https://www.duolingo.com/Bastien_M

    Yeah they're funny.

    But if they do so, they would have to harmonise that with the previous users...

    And anyway, pretending to make that for the leaderboard, it just makes impossible to be able to go to the top of it 20 xp by 20 xp.

    March 14, 2019

    https://www.duolingo.com/grumpy700875

    It's particularly funny for people with arthritis in wrists or fingers, for people who are bad typists, for those with crappy keyboards and those without touchscreens. Even more funny it is for older people who have - according to the average life expectancy of their country - about 10 years left to say their last words in a foreign language. It's even more more funny to those who belong to several of those categories.

    March 14, 2019

    https://www.duolingo.com/Fabricius_Victor

    I'm leaving because of that. That is no way to treat long term customers.

    https://forum.duolingo.com/comment/31557239

    April 2, 2019

    https://www.duolingo.com/Nshedia

    I was going to write the same. I firstly thought that it was a bug or something. However apparently it is not. Duolingo made that on choice and I didn't like it either.

    March 5, 2019

    https://www.duolingo.com/Correcamino4ever

    Agreed! I only just got the unpleasantness this morning after I woke up to find out that I would have lost my streak yesterday had I not been saved by Duolingo Plus. Without warning, jumping a level went down to 20 points?! That is ridiculous. And without telling members of the change. Even more lame. Shame on you, Duolingo.

    March 6, 2019

    [deactivated user]

      Yes I agree completely. This is the stupidest thing they have invented. It is also not a competition. I want to learn a language, not to compete with others.

      March 7, 2019

      https://www.duolingo.com/mosstoe

      I must agree.

      March 7, 2019

      https://www.duolingo.com/Robgprice

      I totally agree. I think a compromise would be much better. A maximum of a 80 - 100 is much better than just 20.

      March 11, 2019

      https://www.duolingo.com/CobaltOakTree

      But why compromise, though? They are punishing users who test out by giving them LESS experience than they would have earned had they done each individual unit in the module. Doesn't make sense from the gamification perspective Duolingo uses. It does make sense from the point of view that now we either choose between losing XP or doing lots of units, watching ads a lot more than we used to.

      March 14, 2019

      https://www.duolingo.com/HexManiacMarie

      It is incredibly frustrating. Especially with the reasoning being that the leaderboards were being abused. I don't care about the leaderboards. Why are we pushing duolingo to be some giant group competition? I just want to use the program to learn in the way that works best for me. I didn't know that was going out of vogue.

      April 14, 2019

      https://www.duolingo.com/Reut835545

      Exactly! I'm also not motivated anymore, when I test out a crown it means that I already learned this topic and want to skip it and focus the topics that I'm not strong enough in, why I deserve to get less points than someone who learned the same topic but wasted more time on this? It really decreased my motivation. And unfortunately duolingo always do something stupid that makes me leave them for long times.. In the beginning it was the lessons that I had to repeat all the time in order to make all the lessons in gold and now this? Why to be such annoying all the time?? Also the same reason why I stopped use their flash cards... Impossible to repeat the words that I know perfectly all the time instead of moving forward.

      June 1, 2019

      https://www.duolingo.com/Zeppah_

      It's called xp for a reason, it's experience points. If you are only doing 17-20 questions, you're only experiencing 17-20 questions, and hence you only get the same amount of xp as a normal class. This has been too long abused by certain players to easy grab heaps of xp (I assume a lot of the whingers in this thread), where they delete the language and do it again and again. There's no reason to give test outs 450xp. Even if you don't do this, I also see complaining about how they deserve the same xp as someone who did all the lessons, that's not how xp works. If you want to earn xp, sure, test out and get to the level you're up to, then study like everybody else and learn to earn your xp. ;)

      July 1, 2019

      https://www.duolingo.com/Bastien_M

      Okay, so doing 20 questions from the first level all the time, again and again, completely deserves 15 xp if I follow you. Awesome, what a great "experience".

      July 1, 2019

      https://www.duolingo.com/Zeppah_

      Well, sure, if people are abusing that merely for points, perhaps they should implement diminishing returns as other platforms do for their applications. However I feel your looking at this the wrong way, everyone learns at a different rate and style, for some people repetition is key. The experience is learning a new language, Duolingo is but one of many tools you should be using. Personally, learning a new alphabet and language structure is quiet daunting, so I repeated my "ABC"'s and basics over and over until I felt confident in them, if you think that should be docked, fair enough, but remember it is literally spending the time to cement fundamental new knowledge into my head.

      July 1, 2019

      https://www.duolingo.com/Bastien_M

      I don't really take xp as a good indicator. Even back then they didn't represent much. And now, it's even worse.

      I think people should use this app as they want. If they want a quick refresh they should keep testing out, even if they have the full golden tree and a small level. And if they want to learn from stratch, use a combination of both. If you need to go back to the previous lessons, I also have nothing against it, if this really helps you, you should definitely go back to it.

      It just makes me laugh when I see "we cut testing out to have a fair leaderboard", or "xp has to be earned" ==> and then people farming lvl 1.

      But again, at least the learning content is still the same so we can still play it as usual. And forget those leagues and stuff.

      July 1, 2019

      https://www.duolingo.com/Nicki878983

      Oh that explains it. That left me feeling pretty annoyed this morning too. But maybe it's not a bad thing after all? It can be tempting to try to test out before you should in order to gain the XPs. Maybe it's a better learning strategy this way.

      March 5, 2019

      https://www.duolingo.com/Correcamino4ever

      I hear you and I love your positive attitude about the sudden change. And... it seems like one should be able to test out if they have the skills. Why should I slog through each level at 20 points, feeling bored by the material, when I can jump a level and enjoy the lesson? I still think it was a poor choice by Duolingo to make that change.

      March 6, 2019

      https://www.duolingo.com/Nicki878983

      You can still test out can't you? You just don't get the same number of XPs. I can see that the extra XPs can be a great incentive for some learners.

      March 6, 2019

      https://www.duolingo.com/grumpy700875

      I have (had) two reasons two test out. In a language that I already speak rather well it's to test my skills and find the spots where I have to work on. In a rather new language it's exactly the incentive you mention because I actually learn by failing and stay way more focused. So if I lose my hearts I will memorize better. When I learn at home in a distracting environment I can easily make the same mistake over and over again or will use the hints too much and that makes it kind of superficial learning process. This doesn't happen so much when I only go through one or two lessons of a skill and test out of the other.

      March 7, 2019

      https://www.duolingo.com/Alicia.J.P

      That is exactly my point. It is still possible to test out !! However, Duo was rewarding the users with hundreds and hundreds of points and some people with the aid of Google Translate were cheating. I saw it every week in my Club and those people could barely put together two words of Spanish.

      March 10, 2019

      https://www.duolingo.com/grumpy700875

      "But maybe it's not a bad thing after all?"

      May be or not be, this thread helps better to understand what it means for many:

      https://forum.duolingo.com/comment/31131743

      March 7, 2019
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