"Él ni siquiera quería saber mi nombre."

Translation:He did not even want to know my name.

May 24, 2014

21 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Machupichoo

I realize my mistake now, but in researching it, I found something interesting. From a source on verbs - 501 Spanish Verbs - by C Kendris, it says that "some verbs that express a mental state have a different meaning when used in the preterit." These verbs are conocer, poder, querer, saber, and tener. For example, querer when used in the negative in the preterit, means refused (No quise hacerlo. - I refused to do it.). Another example, saber, to know, means found out in the preterit (Supe la verdad. = I found out the truth. Conocer means met in preterit, poder means failed or did not succeed in negative preterit, and tener means received in the preterit. I just found this interesting and thought I would post it here.

May 30, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AurosHarman

All of these examples are actually great illustrations of the difference between preterite and imperfect -- between something that happens over a period of time, versus something that happens at a particular instant. The preterite forms describe a moment in time in which either a condition changes or is asserted as particularly relevant.

With conocer, you have the moment at which you go from not knowing somebody, to knowing them: Yo lo conozco. I know him. I am familiar with him. Yo lo conocí. I became familiar with him. I met him. Similarly, with saber, you came-to-know something: you learned it, or found out about it. With tener, you go from not-having to having: you received something.

In each of these cases, if the condition obtained continuously -- if you're discussing a story in the past, in which you knew somebody or something, or had something -- you'd use imperfect.

A negative poder implies that in that particular moment, in that attempt, you were unable to do something. By asserting an inability in that moment, you're saying that you failed. Similarly, using a negative querer preterite says that the not-wanting in that moment was highly salient; that the not-wanting was asserted, as a refusal or rejection.

Again, if you wanted to say that in the past-tense period of your story, you were able to do something, or you wanted to do something, and that condition obtained continuously; then you'd use imperfect.

July 1, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/rmcgwn

This explanation of the use in the negative is excellent. I am struggling with deber in the negative. Deber to mean should we use the conditional. What I have seen is these two sentences (from memory)

He should never have read my diary - Duo used debió - but that isn't conditional - so I am assuming if in the negative now it means should.

I was not suppose to say anything - Duo used debía - now its imperfect. ( I used debía because this was all fresh in my mind)

I am not sure I really understand - is it that we need to think of modal verbs in the negative as having different meanings? Rules?

July 25, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AurosHarman

I think the reason the deber conjugation is preterite there is that the most natural interpretation of the English sentence is that we're talking about a specific instance / moment in which he read your diary, and at that instant he ought not to have read it. "Nunca" / "never" is simply for emphasis. If you use imperfect, you're suggesting that over a period of time, he owed a duty to not read your diary. I'm not sure whether this works to imply that he was reading it habitually, like an abusive boyfriend secretly keeping tabs on his victim?

I struggle with sophisticated uses of deber. I find it helps somewhat to remember that it has more to do with duty than necessity. Deber derives from the same Latinate root as English "debt" and "duty". The English words "ought" and "owe" derive from the Germanic root that shares the most similar semantics.

The situation that most throws me for a loop is figuring out how to construct sentences that convey the difference between lacking a duty to do something (so it's optional); and having a positive duty to not do something. Like, is, "Él no debía hacer eso," ambiguous, or is it clearly, "He had no duty to do that."? And is it legal to say, "Él debía no hacer eso," to convey, "He had a duty to not do that."? This is complicated by the fact that in general, in Spanish, negation is applied to a whole clause; there's no such thing as a "double negative", as in English.

The "he never should have read my diary" thing is an instance of exactly this "positive duty to not do" construction. And like I said, I've never understood how to express that with complete clarity. I think for this case, I would go with, "¡Él no debió leer mi diario nunca!" I'm intentionally doing the "double negative" thing for emphasis.

Anyways, maybe eventually a truly bilingual speaker will stop by and enlighten us. :-)

July 25, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Talca

Brillante

September 17, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/omnjj

Story of my life

August 5, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jenny2perros

Funny! I love the funny replies especially in this lesson which is my least favorite, or the one lesson I hate.

May 3, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Talca

Le entraron ganas de reir.

September 17, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/eshewan

I've been having trouble figuring out when to use the preterite or imperfect of 'querer' but this one really seems to me like a particular event that would require the use of the preterite, not the imperfect. What am I missing?

May 29, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AurosHarman

If you're talking about wanting as an ongoing state, it's going to end up imperfect.

Using preterite conveys something more emphatic. "Él no quiso saber mi nombre," is almost like, "He rejected knowing my name. He refused to know my name." I tried to tell it to him, but he didn't want to hear it.

See Machupichoo's comment above.

June 30, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/eshewan

Thanks! and thanks for pointing me to his/her comment above--very interesting!

July 1, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Machupichoo

1) I equate "saber" with "to know how to"; would it be alright to use conocer here? 2) My answer was He not even wanted to know my name, which was marked as incorrect, but it seems to be the same as the correct answer in meaning, tense, etc.

May 29, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/paradoxmo

2) When negating past tense verbs in English, "VERBed" it becomes "did not VERB", this is just one of those weird rules that you have to know. So you have to phrase it: "He did not even want"

June 12, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AurosHarman

Huh. The connotations of conocer and saber are slightly different here, I guess, and it does seem like conocer might actually be the more likely translation of the most likely interpretation of the English sentence. "He didn't care enough to become familiar with my name." With saber, it's like, "He didn't care to memorize the dry fact that my name is [whatever]."

July 25, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MichaPau

Is there a strong difference of pronunciation between the two forms of:

queria (imperfect)

and querria (conditional)

???

the only difference is the double r in the later..

January 26, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/anm54475

Yes. The double R in querría gets a strong rolled sound. Check out the difference in sound on Forvo.

https://forvo.com/word/quería/#es

https://forvo.com/word/querría/#es

April 11, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Carol870492

Ni siquiera messed me up, especially when it had contradictory meanings: not even, even, at least; most confusing.

July 26, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KathleenMa495217

I wrote exactly what was written above but was marked wrong. Why?

June 21, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JeffAnders694718

"He was not even wanting to know my name" was not accepted. Why?

July 4, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/elizadeux

I've seen this same sentence so many times, I don't think that I would want to know either.

May 12, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/EleanorFar3

Why is it not "he would not even want to know my name"

November 3, 2018
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