https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Steve448292

RUSSIAN THREAD - When to Use What????

I am finding so many times that I come across words or phrases that seem to have different ways of saying them. For example, "We have" - у нас or мы имеем "numbers" - номера or числа

I hope that here, if I write down "options" of what can be used, that people much wiser than I can give the correct usage AND a reason as to why they have chosen their answer

Also, I am hoping that as others come across this idea, that they will also write THEIR puzzles so that this will build into a goto place to compare and contrast different words and phrases.

Even if the answer is "either can be used" this at least is an answer that allows the cloud to be lifted that little bit

cheers

April 19, 2019

26 Comments

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https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Steve448292

This is great and thank you for the input. I hope that others will place their puzzles over words here as well )))

April 20, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/1073946383

Thanks for this hint, which brings me to another, similar problem: In the tinycards, there are some examples, where homonyms are badly dealt with. For example, the word "party" is illustrated with a picture of a celebration, but the translation refers to party as an organized political movement.

April 24, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Dima655559

Yeah i tried tinycards and some of them are very awkward. Probably, they were created by users like us. Same problem on the quizlet.com ... The best user-made flashcard-sets i've ever met are on memrize.

April 26, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Steve448292

Actually, I have made my own, (offline stuff - using something called pen and paper / cardboard ))) ) They fit into a match box. I have between 30 and 50 in a box and I then have control over how many times I see a card. If I miss it, I simply slot it in about 4 cards away and it hits again. But then, if I get it right, I do not give myself a pass, I slot it in again and sometime again. So, I get to repeat it many times. But I am not the most successful language learner so this might be bad info ha ha. I was going quite well with duo up until they stopped being able to do the exact same lesson multiple times. From that day on, months and months ago, I have struggled with Duo. No matter how many times the "experts" tell me how great this new sysytem is, I still miss the old system. But, I am perservering because it is my guide to how long i have been trying to learn this beautiful language. )) Oh, I also made "slightly" larger cards and little boxes for phrases. I still haven't worked out though, where to get mini people to put in a box for listening and speaking practice though ))))

April 26, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Steve448292

Thanks for the comment, I haven't used the tiny cards yet ))I have been struggling to stay on top of keeping new words from my current circle/s in my head while not forgetting everything that I thought that I already knew. So I have slowed down my forward movement to a crawl. ))) But hopefully, my knowledge base will soon catch up to the new words and then I might have a go at the tiny cards )))

April 24, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Steve448292

"he is in a hurry to go to the shop" ----> он спешит в магазин or он спешит пойти в магазин

April 19, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rookspirit

"он спешит в магазин" is basically "he is in a hurry to the store" while "он спешит пойти в магазин" is as you said "he is in a hurry to GO to the store" technically they can be used interchangeably but they can still have their own meanings. For instance if "he is in a hurry to GO to the store" it may mean he is not yet going to the store and rather about to go to the store (but in a hurry). Though as I said, they can be used interchangeably either way.

April 19, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Steve448292

Thanks Rookspirit So subtle )) Isn't it great ))))))

April 20, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Steve448292

"then" ----> потом тогда затем

April 19, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rookspirit

If the sentence structure follows the lines of "if I do this THEN that will happen" you would always use "тогда". If the sentence talks about doing things consecutavly or something like "And then I did this, and then I went here, etc" then you would use either "потом" or "затем" (both can be used interchangeably) but "затем" is saying more of "after that", literally being made up of two words "за" (after) and "тем" (that)

April 19, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Steve448292

And more thanks )))))

April 20, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Steve448292

have (had) tried ----> пробовал
пытался

April 19, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rookspirit

Even as a native speaker I usually use these interchangeably but I'm pretty sure there are circumstances when using one over another is best. What I can say is that if the sentence was to refer to trying food like "I tried ice cream" you would always say "пробовал" (it can also be used as tasted) "я пробовал мороженое" ("I tasted ice cream"/"I tried ice cream") when "пытался" would be used in a sentence like "I tried to open the door", "я пытался открыть дверь" (though "я пробовал открыть дверь" would also be acceptable)

April 19, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Steve448292

Thanks again ))) 2 lingots ---> One for the explanation and one of course for the ice cream )))))

April 20, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Alisa-Zhup

I'd say that у нас is usually used more casually than мы имеем. I hear it a lot more.

April 20, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Steve448292

Thanks Alisa )))

April 20, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Steve448292

Are you going there // do you go there вы туда ходите? или вы идите там?

April 20, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rookspirit

"Do you go there?" would definitely be "вы туда ходите?", I wouldn't use "идите" in this type of context as it just doesn't sound right at all. It would only work as a commanding phrase such as, "You go there." ("вы идите там/туда."). The word "идите" can't be used in a question BUT its other variations such as "идёте" can. An example, "Вы идёте туда?" ("Are you going there?")

((These are surprisingly fun to answer so sorry for answering each one, I'm sure someone else can give a bit of a better explanation than I can for this one too haha))

April 20, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Steve448292

Please keep answering them ))) Your answers are very useful to me ))) I really appreciate your help. Also I am hoping that if others come across this thread that they too will place stuff here as I am sure there are other people who come aсross words that might have more than one choice. Ah for example возле, рядом, поблизости (sp?), близко. That will be great for me to see their thoughts and maybe even solve problems/puzzles that I didn't even know that I had ))) So, once again a big thank you. (but only one lingot ha ha - there was no ice cream in this one ))) )

April 20, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Dima655559

"Are you going there?" - это еще "Ты туда собираешься?", насколько я понимаю. Steve, if you really want to implove foreign language, you should try to use it more in your posts. Out of the blue: no, this tread will not help to many other people, so you can concentrate on your own goals) At least, when you ask, give more content (like full sentences).

April 20, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Steve448292

Привет Дима )) Спасибо за помошь. Я понемаю ))) Но я всё ещё надеюсь что лиюди писать их вопорсы )))) Sorry for any bad spelling. I am a very very very slow learner )) and these were just words as I thought of them ))) I just ran this through google translate and yes, spelling ))) помощь понимаю )))

April 21, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Dima655559

Force yourself to not make excuses for spelling or "slow learning", especially here. Я тоже испытываю неприятные ощущения когда пишу на иностранном языке и не уверен что правильно формирую предложения или нахожу ошибки позже. Но другие люди относятся к этому гораздо проще, чем нам кажется. А те, кто изучает иностранные языки, сами с удовольствием укажут на ошибки, если ты их попросишь. Nice streak btw

April 21, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Steve448292

Well, here's another group that will be useful for "me" if they are discussed and as always, I hope it might help others. Context? not this time. I am hoping someone will give examples of when to use these and also their reasons for such ))) Thanks in advance ))

рядом, около, возле, близко, поблизости

2things, 1) sorry for spelling mistakes and 2) have I misssed any others ? I guess anything I "have" missed, would be a "near" miss )))

April 21, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Dima655559

I can try to help this time И дать местами очень приблизительный перевод) По мере сил.. It's gonna be very puzzling for both of us, and maybe I will try to dig too deep.

Yes, the words are pretty interchangable, at least in some cases. Да, эти слова достаточно взаимозаменяемые, по крайней мере, в некоторых ситуациях.

I do not think that anyone should try to learn many synonyms at the same time. Maybe, we will approach to each of them separately Я не думаю, что стоит пытаться учить много синонимов сразу. Может, мы рассмотрим каждое из этих слов отдельно.....

When you will have enough practice and when you will be familiar with situations where each of them can be used, your brain will just take the best of these words so say something in a shorter way, or in a flattering way, or more ornately. But I hope that this post will help you some way)) Короче, все придет с опытом, а правила тут мало помогут. Так или иначе, надеюсь, что этот ответ тебе поможет.

And we will take a look at etymology, because sometimes it's easier to understand when to use the word when you know what it means. Еще мы обратимся к этимологии (или нет), потому что иногда проще понять, когда использовать слово, когда знаешь, что оно означает.


Близко - самое распространенное слово, основное для импользования в смысле 'Near', 'Close'. Корень Близ/ Ближ. When you describe the distance between 2+ locations, without a 'degree' it usually means that something is near but not very close. Like there is still a tangible distance between. Let's try to make some examples: 1) Locations. Не подходи близко к обрыву -->> Do not come close to the cliff.. Мой дом стоит близко к морю -->> My house is close to the sea -->> Мой дом стоит недалеко от моря. Все мои друзья живут близко (ко мне) -->> All my friends live close (to me) -->> Мои друзья живут недалеко от меня. А я живу близко к кондитерской. -->> And I live close to the pastry shop.

2) Relatoinships (тут, разумеется, 'рядом, около, возле' и прочее - не подходит) ** Они близко знали друг друга -->> They were close to each other... They knew each other well. (Они были близки)

And in compare to words 'около', 'возле', you can add a 'degree' or apply a 'degree' to 'Близко' (so it will become Ближе - Closer and the other words are unchangeable): Не очень близко (not very close) --- Ближе (еще ближе, чем раньше)(closer) --- Совсем близко (совсем рядом)(just near) Самый близкий ко мне продуктовый магазин (the closest to me grocery store) --- Кот откусил ближний (самый близкий) к нему край пирога (emm... the cat bit off the closest edge of the pie) (like superlative degree)


Рядом - 'Near', 'Next', 'Nearby'. Имеет корень Ряд (Ряд сидений - A row of seats. Ряд правил - A set of rules) (В ряде 1,2,3,4,5 цифры 3 и 4 находятся рядом друг с другом) То же самое, но более редкий разговорный slang: Рядышком (a "caressing" form, if it's possible to use 'caressing' this way) Рядом - это обычно ближе, чем просто 'близко', иногда это непосредственная близость. When to use: 1) When someone or you are so close that physical or at least eye contact is possible. In this case 'рядом' и 'около' и 'возле' have the same meanings, but 'около' и 'возле' can be even physically closer (as I feel it) Я стою рядом с тобой -->> I am standing near / NEXT to you -->> Я стою около тебя Книга лежит рядом с твоим локтем -->> The book is lying near your elbow -->> Книга лежит около твоего локтя Рядом с нами прошли девушки -->> The girls went by (near) us... -->> Около нас прошли девушки Рядом со мной стоял высокий жираф -->> A tall giraffe was standing near me -->> Около меня стоял высокий жираф

But if you dont have an object in your sentence, or if you want to use just one word, only 'Рядом' will be an option: ** - Ты где? - Рядом - Я рядом (I am near)(Я около/возле тебя). - Я почти рядом (I am almost near)(Я почти около/возле тебя). - Я совсем рядом (I am just near). - Я где-то рядом (I am somewhere near)(Я где-то около тебя).

2) Geographical proximity. The words 'около' и 'возле' are also good to use here and I feel like 'возле' has even closer proximity Мой дом - рядом с городской библиотекой -->> My house is near the city library -->> Мой дом - около/возле городской библиотеки Франция на карте находится рядом с Германией -->> France on the map is near Germany -->> Франция на карте находится возле/ около Германии ** Франция и Германия на карте находятся рядом (no object here. So when you need to say that 2+ places are near/next to each other - use Рядом)

3) Spiritual affinity.. (духовная близость).. kinda. Readiness to support (готовность поддержать) Я всегда буду рядом с тобой -->> We will always be with you Мои друзья были рядом со мной в трудные минуты -->> My friends were with me in difficult moments In fact, U can use these phrases even without 'Рядом'.

4) In one row. In this case Рядом is a completely different word, because now we are dealing with the form of the word Ряд. Мы спрятались за последним рядом сидений -->> We hid behind the last row of seats Фасад дома с рядом колонн. ** Машины ехали одним рядом.


I feel like i want to make an intermission here... maybe we can be ok just with more examples and less explanations:

Oколо - the root is 'около', originates from Circum ('Near', 'Circa', 'Around'). Мы сидели около костра (рядом с костром, возле костра) -->> We were sitting near the fire Дорога проходит около болота (рядом с болотом, поблизости от болота, вблизи болота, возле болота) -->> The road goes near the marsh ** Я пришел домой около часа назад -->> I came home about an hour ago

Возле - just a word as it is. ('Near', '...By the') Maybe I use it because it's easyer/faster to pronounce Я буду ждать тебя возле моста (около моста, рядом с мостом, вблизи моста, у моста) -->> I will wait you by the bridge Возле моего дома растет дуб (под моим домом, около моего дома, вблизи, рядом..) -->> An oak grows near my house

Поблизости - is a derivative of the Близко. Maybe, the best usage is as 'Not far' (Недалеко от) ** Поблизости от нашего лагеря расположилась стая оленей -->> A flock of deer located near our camp.....

April 21, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Steve448292

ого! большое спасибо за такая отличто ответь. Так много (столько???) узнать ))) я буду больше reply после я конец понимать ))

Wow many thanks for such an excellent answer. So much to study. I will reply more after I have finished learning/understanding it ))

Oh, and a lingot for such a wonderful reply and one for the pastry shop )))

April 22, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Dima655559

'You're welcome'. And I still think that you shouldn't try to memorize all the things (rules, that I made up) above in my post. Also one of my motivations is that i am trying to improve my english, so enough lingotes, but thank you. Btw you can find many of such Q&A on stackexchange forum https://russian.stackexchange.com . At least there are no such dumb line breaks.

What i should really do at the moment, is giving a good translation for your post:

** Ого! Большое спасибо (Many thanks also can be translated as Тысяча благодарностей) за такой замечательный (отличный) ответ!

Так много всего предстоит выучить (узнать и запомнить). Я напишу еще, когда закончу изучать (разбираться).

Да, и лингот за такой чудесный ответ и еще один за кондитерскую ))) **

April 22, 2019
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