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Improved Norwegian Course: Overview and F.A.Q.
The new version of the Norwegian course is now being A/B tested. It’s been ten long months in the making, and I’m as excited as can be to finally get to share it with some of you!
First things first! I want to take a moment to thank fveldig for holding down the fort in the forum and Regney for tirelessly working through user reports, freeing up time for me to focus on the course. You’re the best!
Thanks also go to our three alpha testers, BafouillCharabia, Tranklements and Trofaste, who have been testing the new course, providing great feedback, and graciously putting up with my moving their skills around at least once a week - and to endless_sleeper for some last-minute feedback on the Tips & Notes.
Last but not least, thank you to my Incubator partner in crime for more than four years, Luke, for tricking me into starting a new tree version and then emigrating to Japan. I love you really. ;)
While the tree now looks quite different (SPOILER ALERT), the philosophy behind it is the same: We want to bring you a course that is fun and engaging, jam-packed with cheesy 80s hits, obscure film references, terrible puns, tongue-twisting alliterations, geeky indulgences, existential dread, trivia galore, and an obscene amount of sentences about Canadians and a certain chicken. If you end up learning some Norwegian in the process, then that’s of course a plus.
I kid, I kid… but only about the last part! We do want to teach you Norwegian, as well as we possibly can within the Duolingo format, and that is the reason why we embarked upon this tree versioning journey to begin with. About a year ago, Crown Levels were introduced, and with them came changes both to how Duo would present the content of our course to you, and, consequently, to how you would use the course. The old course version (Tree 3) was optimized for a format that no longer existed, and so we decided it was time to roll up our sleeves and make some serious changes.
The new course version (Tree 4) has shorter skills, with a maximum of five lessons, so that the higher crown levels won’t feel like such a slog. We have kept the old grammar skills, so that you can easily identify and practice the trickier concepts, but we’ve also added a generous number of new thematic skills, where we reinforce the grammar and sprinkle in some new vocabulary. We’ve also taken care to introduce difficult concepts a little more gently and thoroughly where possible. You should now be presented with a better introduction to the various prepositions and to the different possessive structures, as well as some common, yet confusing, phrases and expressions.
The new course includes over a hundred new image exercises, featuring some new illustrations made specifically for the Norwegian course, such as the snowy cabin, cheese slicer, winter hat, moose, reindeer, and polar lights. All the essentials! I’ve experimented with adding image exercises for more abstract concepts, whereas they were previously reserved mostly for concrete nouns, so I’m interested to see what you think of that approach.
The Tips & Notes have been revised and expanded upon, and now contain word lists for every skill in the new course. If grammar explanations aren’t your cup of tea, you’ll still want to check out the Tips & Notes for the thematic skills, as they tend to contain more cultural context and information about the specific vocabulary introduced.
Course Statistics
| Unit | New Course (Tree 4) | Old Course (Tree 3) |
|---|---|---|
| Skills | 172 | 117 |
| Lessons | 590 | 531 |
| Lexemes* | 3 600 | 3 428 |
| Sentences | 19 400+ | 14 666 |
| Image exercises | 633 | ~480 |
*These don’t necessarily represent lexemes in the linguistic sense, though many of them are. In the Incubator, the words we teach are organized into lexemes. A lexeme could be a single word, a phrase, or a collection of several words and/or phrases. Basically, it’s a chunk of language that we want to teach you.
Lexeme list broken down by skill, generously provided by Fierycat:
Feedback & Changelog
If you’re among the lucky ones who already got the new course, please share any feedback you may have for us in this dedicated feedback thread: https://forum.duolingo.com/comment/32196823
For those interested in the finer details of the new course, we’ve made our internal changelog available to you here: https://forum.duolingo.com/comment/32204363
F.A.Q.
How do I know if I have the new course?
If your first skill is named INTRO, you have the new course. If your first skill is named BASICS, you’re in the control group and still on the old course.
What will happen to my progress?
For unchanged skills, you will keep your progress. For skills that have been renamed or had their vocabulary updated, your crown levels may be reset. However, you will still keep your total crown count, as a reflection of the work you put into the previous tree. Your tree should stay unlocked up until the skill you last completed, and all the knowledge you’ve gained is of course yours to keep. :)
What are those fancy blue dots?
The blue dots mark skills which have had lexemes added to them; they're there to alert you to new content. They'll disappear within a day or two, so take a screenshot or make a list if you want to keep that overview.
I’m an advanced learner, is there anything for me in the early tree?
While you’ll probably want to test out of the first checkpoint or two, there’s actually some new content to be found pretty early. I believe the first brand new word appears in the Chatting skill. We’ve also added more than 5 000(!) new sentences throughout the tree. Yup, you read that right: fem tusen nye setninger.
Can I opt into the tree test?
No, not without creating a new account and having some luck. Note that it's important for us to have a control group, to make sure that the new tree is actually teaching better. Of course, we think that it's better, but we still want to test it so that we can know that we're providing you with a kick-ass course and a definite improvement.
Can I opt out of the tree test?
A/B tests only provide meaningful statistics when the composition of the two test groups is fairly equal. While there is a workaround for opting out, we kindly ask that you help us test the new tree and make it as good as it can be.
How long will the test period be?
Our course has a relatively small user base, so it takes some time to get solid statistics. Unless the early numbers are overwhelmingly positive, it will likely take upward of 6 months. I’ll do my part to make sure you all get the new tree as quickly as possible, but the decision ultimately lies with Duo. I’ll let you know when we know more!
What happens if the new course doesn’t pass the A/B test?
Then I’ll go cry in a corner and then back to the drawing board, while you'll all go back to the old tree. Having said that, I’m not particularly worried that it’ll perform poorly. Actually, I have such high hopes for this new tree that I gave it its own HOPE skill, so it better deliver.
I think that should just about cover it, but if you have any questions you’re more than welcome to ask them in the comments below.
Have fun reclaiming your Norwegian owls!
260 Comments
Thank you for all your hard work! I seem to be in the control group, which is partly disappointing and also partly a relief. I look forward to seeing the new course when my turn comes.
2882
Team, you've done a wonderful job! This will undoubtedly be one of the best courses here on Duolingo. #Congratulations!
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Congrats on the first rollout!! Hope your new 'baby' gets lots of enthusiastic response!
Loved the course description!! LOL.
- 1138
Kind of bummed that I am not to be apart of the half that's testing the new tree. Eagerly doing my lessons in anticipation.
If it's any consolation, I'm not in the test group either. Maybe Duo knows I need a break from my own tree. :')
Seems like I started at the same time as the new tree. I can't compare it to the old one but I'm sure it can't be as good as this. It's hilarious, for one (I couldn't help myself and bursted out in laughter at "Bjørner har sykler" and "Bjørnen drikker øl"). And it's teaching language in a fun and easy way. I'm gonna cry in a corner, too, if they decide to drop it and go back to the old one. Don't take those tiny pictures away from me! :'D
The future is Norwegian! And bright - at least during the summer months.
I would really like to be on the new tree as fast as possible. I like this course a lot but the lessons with 18-20 levels with the same sentences over and over again feel like such a drag. I'm really glad to hear you're working on improving the course still. Thank you!
Bare hyggelig!
The last crown levels will still be rather lengthy, as that's how the framework is set up, but they will be shorter than before. Of course, you don't have to take the skills to level 5 if you don't want to or feel like you're getting something out of it. Do what works for you!
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same, i was very disappointed to not be on the new tree. I'm excited to try it out, hopefully it will be rolled out for everyone soon
I dropped out of Duolingo about a year ago with a streak of ~950 days. It seems I returned at the perfect moment - I do not have the new tree yet, but will be checking regularly. New lessons are what I need to get motivated again.
Thank you for making this possible!
Katja! So good to see you here again. I hope life has been treating you well. I just went on a short vacation trip to Lofoten. Returned more tired than before, but many memories and beautiful views richer.
Can you believe we're two tree versions from Tree 2 already? I'll poke you when the test is expanded, so you can check if you managed to sneak in. :)
Thats an interesting comment MR Tattamin. Present thinking about learning languages is that it has to be interesting, in a personal way. So it is one's attitude to learning that is important, rather than the method used. Does that make sense? Duo (isnt for me) the be all and end of learning..rather just a drop-by asset. It might have actually done its job now..and I have moved on rather. Maybe like yourself one does, in the end, get somewhere, and hungry ants, Swedish salesmen and sadly Deliciae, too, can get left behind. Its the pathos of teaching..in the end the pupil goes off into the world and what is left is fond memories. Good luck. (find a penfriend..that worked for me).
good time to start using duolingo again... i keep telling myself to do it but i procrastinate too much and eventually forget... :/
The trick is to use Duolingo to procrastinate other things. Works for me, at least!
I would if I could, but I haven't quite figured out who I need to bribe yet. Maybe if I send some lutefisk to the Duolingo HQ...
Oh, I would if I could, Andy!
Consider yourself put on the list of people who want to be put on the list.
- 690
Oh wow! I just discovered Duolinguo and have started on Norwegian. Looks like I'm on the testing arm of the test. I'm so excited to realise that I'm testing a new course! And I love the platform.
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I just realised that there are course notes on the website version of the course! There's no mention of these at all in the app, but they're a great help! Any idea why the app doesn't link to these?
Duolingo does not wish to port our Tips & Notes to the apps, which is a shame, but you can still access them on your phone using the browser version.
- 690
Thanks; that's what I started doing as soon as I realised notes were available. A bit awkward to have to switch to the browser, but no big deal. Thank you for your work on this tree!
I dont know Paul..you see I've not been put up into the top class. I am going to tell my Mum. Its so unfair!
it took me ages to realise these existed as I mostly use the app! They're very useful, so I am going back to check them on all lessons completed. Would be great to have these on the app, as well as being able to add to - rather than just see - the discussions.
I really liked the shape of the new tree, it looks like a long DNA! Thank you guys, amazing! :D :D :D
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Thank you very much for what you do for us. Your work is highly appreciated! Can't wait to have the new tree as I have started learning Norwegian just a few weeks ago and want to be even better in it from the beginning :)
Tusen takk!
Thanks for your work. I really like this course, no doubts! By the way, with the last Norwegian Constitution Day <3
Gratulerer med den kjempegode jobben :) Dere prøver alltid å forbedre kurset og gir aldri opp, tusen takk :D
This tree looks amazing! Thank you for your dedication and hard work. I've been using this course ever since the first day it was released and your level of engagement and responsiveness to the community is exceptional.
Would you guys happen to have word lists for each skill in the new tree. I have a course on memrise that I'm planning on updating, and the changelog looks a bit chaotic.
Haha, a bit chaotic is a nice way of putting it. I appreciate that. Thank you for your generous compliments as well. :)
The new Tips & Notes contain word lists, and you can find those here:
https://www.duome.eu/tips/en/nb
Just search for "vocabulary" and that should bring you to the header of each list in turn. There are a couple of skills that don't have vocabulary lists because all of the words are mentioned in the tips tables, and the skills that exist in Tree 3 but not in Tree 4 also lack lists.
I can't guarantee that they're all 100% correct at the moment, as I still need to go over them one final time, but they're at a good 99% accuracy at least. If you check your Duo mail, I can report any inconsistencies I might find to you later on.
WOW, I wanted to try out the course for a while and now I'm seeing really how amazing the team is and how dedicated they are, your work is incredible, I am definitely going to give this course a proper go!
Are there new lessons on talking knowledgeably on Cross country skiing? Or "Click the microphone, and breath in, whilst saying Huff da"? Important Skills for us learners to master.
We considered releasing a standalone crash course in skiing, but there was just too much crashing and not enough skiing going on in the alpha version. In hindsight, I think we should have involved a qualified skiing instructor.
I believe that every Norwegian feels themselves a ski-running expert at certain times a year, not that they do it themselves.
Thank you for your hard work on the course! I just started studying Norwegian a couple days ago after learning I will be visiting Norway next spring! It seems I'm in the old course...which is fine because it means I'll have to review a lot once the new course is released. It's kind of amazing how much you can learn in just a few days of studying an entirely new foreign language. Cheers!
So excited for this! So close to finishing the current tree, and because I’m not in the testing group, I’ll try to gold the most as I can before the new tree comes out for everyone. :) Tusen takk Norwegian team for all the dedication to this wonderful course!
(P.S. also excited for all the new pop culture references. Those always add so much charm and fun to the course!)
I'm guessing all the best students are on the old course structure - I'm only a few weeks into it but it is a lot of fun :)
Since most of the updates wee from a couple of months ago, I was just checking to see how the testing is going?! Any news?
I am fine with being patient and working through the old tree, but am also very excited to see the expanded vocabulary and new structure once it rolls out to us all.
Hei!
I can tell you what I know, which is that the numbers I've been shown thus far have been positive. Given that the positive trend continues, we may expect to see the test expanded to 50% of all users in early September and to 100% of all users in mid December.
Ultimately, I'm neither the one making the decisions or flipping the switch, so I'll be impatiently waiting with the rest of you.
Thank you for the response. i'm sorry I didn't see it a bit earlier. I'm glad to hear the response is so positive. I have liked the old tree a lot but think breaking up some of the longer tasks sounds really good.
Much luck with it!
Aww, damn. I started Duolingo Norwegian on the 24/5 and ended up in the control group. :(:( First time visiting the forums and find out there is a new course! I'm enjoying learning Norwegian on Tree 3. I've found it relatively easy to learn though I feel as though going from Def. Plur. to Present skill has stepped it up from low gear into high. Really struggling to remember any of the new words so just have to keep at it till it sticks. Looking forward to seeing the new course. :)
Velkommen!
You're not wrong: In the skills leading up to the Present skill you're often learning new forms of the same noun; it's a more gentle introduction to the vocabulary itself, allowing you to focus on all the new grammar. In the Present skill (old tree), however, it's all new verbs you haven't seen before.
The new tree makes that transition a little smoother, so I hope you get to compare the approaches later on, but I still think additional tools and learning techniques like the ones mentioned by your fellow learners here can be very helpful.
Lykke til videre! :)
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I've found that a good flashcard app is a great addition to Duolingo in order to help drill vocabulary. Duolingo themselves have a little app for this, with a matching website:
https://tinycards.duolingo.com/
I've found that's it's quite limited, though. Another option is Quizlet, which is slightly more flexible. Personally, I think there's a big gap here, and since I'm a Software Engineer, I'm planning my own app :)
It depends for everyone, but I personally write everything on paper, and it really helps me. It is forcing me to slow down, to take my time, and to look at the words carefully. It’s also useful because I often go to places where I can’t rely on technology, but where I have time to review my notebooks.
I'm a big fan of pen and paper as well! The process of writing things down is proven to aid your memory, even if you never look at that page again.
Yes, at least for some people! When I had a test at school, I was reviewing by making a cheat-sheet (that I was never actually using during the tests). Forcing myself to put the whole lesson on a tiny paper meant choosing a few keywords that would be enough to remember the rest. And then I just had to remember those few.
Update! The A/B test was just expanded, so half of you should now have the new tree.
Thanks for the update. Missed out again :| so I'll be eagerly awaiting the full release.
Too bad. We're probably looking at 3-4 more months of testing.
I'm looking forward to the full release as well! Maintaining two course versions is more work for us too, and of course we want you all to have what we think is the better tree. :)
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I got it this time! :D There are 172 skills now, 121 have blue dot which I guess means they have new content and I need to complete 15 skills to regain my golden owl.
How long blue dots will stay in the tree and do you have some tip how to redo my tree?
Tusen takk alle sammen :D
When mine switched I think the dots only stayed for a day or two.
I'd start around the Cafe skill or a little later if that feels too easy. Test out if you prefer, or do the lessons one by one; there should be new sentences pretty much everywhere.
Lykke til! :)
And does the new course include grammar on the phone version? It's incredibly frustrating getting to a stage when you need grammar and you can't get it on the phone.
You can access the Tips & Notes through your mobile browser, but they're not available in the app.
Hello, does anyone know when the new tree is going to be rolled out for everyone, if this is happening? I started Norwegian recently and have the old tree (I think this is because I had previously started the tree like a year ago and had deleted it). Some people have said that they thought the new tree went a bit fast for beginners I have read so was wondering how long I have to work on this old tree, before I go onto the new one! Other than that I am so excited to go onto it!
Ostehøvel :D I hope I will see the new content quite soon, it will be very interesting. You said it might take around six months? Then maybe I will challenge myself to finish the old tree before :) Thank you for your hard work! It’s always a pleasure to learn from this course.
Bare hyggelig!
That's my guesstimate for it being released to all users, yes, but testing on 50% of all users will start before that (I hope!). You never really know in Duoland. :)
I protest! My course(s) are the best! :p
Although I am responsible for a few of the sentences (if anyone wonders where on earth the contributors got the ideas for the weirdest sentences, they're probably my fault), so maybe I will allow it the title after all. Having skills such as Dessert, Bugs, Music, and Language certainly deserves a good deal of credit.
- 2073
I really think that both the Swedish and Norwegian courses should have a skill near the beginning dedicated to the use of cheese-slicers, just to get all those sentences over with, else people will get the impression that all Scandinavians are monomaniacally obsessed with them...
You're implying that we're not? A cheese slicing skill would be a fine addition to the course, though. Definitely taking that under consideration for Tree 5.
Did you know that there's a different technique to slicing round blocks of brunost? You have to be careful not to make them crumble at the edges, especially if dealing with one of the darker varieties of brunost.
Not quite sure how to work that into the course yet, but I'm sure I'll figure something out.
I got hauled over the coals in Tønsberg for not cutting my boiled egg 'correctly'. And then 'leaving my bacon-rinds', made it worse!
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Learning how to use that thing was a pivotal moment in my life. I never felt more like a stupid American than when I was stabbing a block of cheese in front of my GFs parents during my first day in Sweden.
Yes, Americans have trouble with the cheese slicer. I have seen that many times, don't feel bad.
- 510
What? I've used a cheese slicer practically my entire life. Maybe it's a regional thing?
Hi, these are good news for me because i'm a beginner student of bokmal and this could improve a lot the way that I talk and don't sound weird in conversations with norsk people. Thank you very much.
What level does the Norsk Bokmål course take us to on the CEFR scale approximately?
Quoting myself from this thread:
While we have a redesigned course more or less ready to launch, it's not structured to correspond to CEFR levels as such. Of course, it does progress in a similar way, as it makes sense to learn the basics first and then build on those.
Our goal is to teach Norwegian as well as possible within the Duolingo format, and it is with that in mind that we've structured the course. The current tree should cover the grammar and vocabulary required for B1. Actually, it covers most of the B2 and C1 grammar as well.
However, that doesn't mean that you'll be able to pass a CEFR test at any of those levels, because Duolingo is better at teaching you to process language than to produce it. Without plenty of outside practice, you just wouldn't pass the oral exam, and you'd struggle with the listening part as well, as there's only one voice used for the audio here and a wealth of dialects in Norway. No amount of restructuring is going to fix that; you'll need good old conversation and listening practice. :)
Since you're already familiar with the course, you can compare it yourself: https://www.examenglish.com/CEFR/cefr_grammar.htm
Awesome thank you! Would you guys please make the notes and tips available on the Duolingo Android application? I use the application more often.
If it were up to me, they'd already be there. Unfortunately, Duolingo has deemed our Tips & Notes unfit for the apps.
The good news is that you can still access the tips by using the browser version of Duolingo on your mobile.
That is such a shame. I often refer to your notes and tips and they are extremely well written and invaluable.
I have two questions, if it doesn't pass the AB testing, will it be removed from the users that did get it in the first place? And the second is, if I wasn't picked to participate in the new tree and the AB test turns to be positive and it is accepted, will everyone, including old users who did not get it in the first place like me, get it?
Yes on both accounts; once the A/B test is completed, all "old" users will be moved to the victorious tree version.
If the A/B test is inconclusive, as it often can be for smaller courses, then the new tree usually gets the benefit of the doubt.
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I am really looking forward to the new tree. I always welcome the chance to revisit Norwegian. I was almost sorry when I recaught my owl the last time he strayed. By the time it is released I should have recaptured my chouette and be ready and waiting.
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Will the "Tips & Notes" section be available on the app as well? That's one thing I really miss.
No, I'm afraid you'll have to access them through your mobile browser like before. They are only made available on the web version of Duo.
The third party site duome also cashes the Tips & Notes and makes them available as a single scrollable document, though it shows the notes from both trees, making for a lot of duplicate entries: https://www.duome.eu/tips/en/nb
I would like little more than for the notes to appear in the apps, but that's out of my hands. I just write them. :)
Thank you so much for the course, it is really fun and a bit crazy a lot of the time lol
I just wanted to suggest that it would be really helpful if the progress tests pointed us in a more specific direction of what we needed to work on out of the already unlocked skills.
I am going to do the Bergens test next week (because I need it to begin University education here) and it would have been cool to be able to get down to the more complicated Norwegian near the bottom without working my way through every unit as I am doing - although it is educational! but specific things to practice for the Bergens test would be great. Both of these things could be part of the plus membership (which I have).
I really think that by giving feedback and pointing us in the right direction of what we need to practice will only enhance our learning. There is a lot of content per bubble to practice and get it right which is awesome :)
Thanks again!
Bare hyggelig!
I agree that it would be helpful to get more feedback from the progress tests, but that's not something I can influence. You could suggest it in the general Duolingo forum, where the staff might read it.
Lykke til på Bergenstesten! Dette klarer du! :)
tusen takk! Jeg håper jeg klarer det. Har ikke lært grammatikken før nå og det er kjempe slitsomt lol må stå på!
Also I am having problems with the hearing tasks in the progress tests on the mac...no sound comes out XD
I suggest trying Google Chrome instead of Safari. The sound from Safari is known to be buggy.
From the F.A.Q. section:
What will happen to my progress?
For unchanged skills, you will keep your progress. For skills that have been renamed or had their vocabulary updated, your crown levels may be reset. However, you will still keep your total crown count, as a reflection of the work you put into the previous tree. Your tree should stay unlocked up until the skill you last completed, and all the knowledge you’ve gained is of course yours to keep. :)
Hello everyone! my mother languaje is Spanish and i am confused about the trees. I would like to get the new course but i dont know how it works and im afraid of loosing my lessons. Is there someone that could explain it in spanish, please? Alguien podría explicarlo en español, por favor? i dont want to screw up it. Tanks!!
Cuando reciba el nuevo curso, el nivel de coronas de las unidades modificadas pueden restablecerse. Aún conservará las coronas que ya ganó, y todas las unidades que ya ha alcanzado permanecerán abiertas.
No tienes que preocuparte por hacer nada en particular; Un día, el curso estará allí y luego podrá comenzar a aprender el nuevo contenido.
Por favor corrige mi español. ¡Estoy aprendiendo también! :)
Muchas gracias por la explicación, Deliciae, me ha quedad muy claro. Esperaré al nuevo curso entonces.
Tu español es estupendo, enhorabuena! Sólo podría señalar el detalle de que has mezclado los pronombres personales, has empezado hablándome de usted, que gramaticalmente es la tercera persona del singular, pero semánticamente es segunda persona porque te diriges a mí (cuando [usted] reciba el nuevo curso, Aún conservará [usted] las coronas, las unidades que [usted] ya ha alcanzado), y después has pasado a hablarme de tú (se lle llama "tutear"), segunda persona del sigular ([tú] no tienes que preocuparte, por favor corrige [tú] mi español). Puede resultar confuso porque en españa usamos "usted" como respeto y cortesía (a un desconocido, a un superior), y tuteamos para crear un ambiente cercano, familiar y de confianza (sería lo correcto para usar en un foro como este), sin embargo en sudamérica usan siempre "usted" incluso con los familiares. Cualquier forma que elijas, formal o cercana, es correcta mientras no se mezclen en el mismo mensaje.
Tu mensaje escrito de manera formal quedaría así: Cuando reciba el nuevo curso, el nivel de coronas de las unidades modificadas pueden restablecerse. Aún conservará las coronas que ya ganó, y todas las unidades que ya ha alcanzado permanecerán abiertas. No tiene que preocuparse por hacer nada en particular; Un día, el curso estará allí y luego podrá comenzar a aprender el nuevo contenido. Por favor corrija mi español. ¡Estoy aprendiendo también! :)
Si escoges usar el tuteo, sería así: Cuando recibas el nuevo curso, el nivel de coronas de las unidades modificadas pueden restablecerse. Aún conservarás las coronas que ya ganaste, y todas las unidades que ya has alcanzado permanecerán abiertas. No tienes que preocuparte por hacer nada en particular; Un día, el curso estará allí y luego podrás comenzar a aprender el nuevo contenido. Por favor corrige mi español. ¡Estoy aprendiendo también! :)
https://www.livinglanguage.com/community/discussion/81/tu-o-usted-usted-o-tu
Espero que la explicación te haya ayudado. Me alegro mucho de ser hispanohablante, porque es un idioma muy complicado! Un abrazo! :-)
Huh, a few insignificant comments and I am mentioned in dispatches? Are you trying to rope me in, Linn? O:)
Thanks anyway! ^_^
Kudos to you and the whole NO team! <3
Trying? Don't pretend I haven't already succeeded. ;)
And don't sell yourself short either, the error you caught in the notes for the Objective Pronouns skill was anything but insignificant.
As always: Bare hyggelig!
If I reset or remove my progress on the Norwegian course, do I have the chance to get the new update? Or do I have to create a new account? I'm very excited to try it and have been reading all of your posts in anticipation since I started.
Hmm, I'm pretty sure resetting the progress won't do it, but removing and readding might. Since I've never heard of that used as a method I'm leaning toward a no for that as well, but I can do a quick test on my own account and get back to you.
Nope, 4/4 for the old course. Unless I just had terrible luck, a new account is the way to go if you can't wait.
Alright, thanks so much! Looks like I'm getting a new account. I really appreciate all the hard work and effort you put into this! I'm really enjoying learning Norwegian.
I was about 3200 XP into the old version. I zeroed out for the new tree--because it had been a long time--and now, about 2000 XP in, I understand way more than I did before. The bite-sized chunks, the tips and notes that really apply to the unit at hand, all help make this an absolute model for how to construct/revise a language course here. Tusen takk!
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How did you manage to "zero out" and restart the course, dave.pretty? I am about 4300XP into the old course, but this new one looks like so much fun that I'm really tempted to start over just to try it! Not that Norwegian Tree3 isn't a great course already, because it is. :) I'd really prefer not to have to create a whole new account just to try to win the Great Norwegian Test Course Lottery, though ....
Also: interestingly, I've noticed that all of my Tips and Notes sections have the header "Tree4" on the vocab lists, even though the first skill on my tree being Basic would certainly seem to indicate that I have the old course. Does anyone have any idea why this would be? Or is this unrelated to the tree version?
The Tips & Notes are, unfortunately, shared between trees for skills that have the same name/ID. This means that we'll have an awkward phase where they're not 100% optimized for either tree, but I'll do another overhaul once (fingers crossed!) Tree 4 passes.
I'm not sure if this guy is trolling. I tried it (deleting the course and re-adding it). No matter how many times I try, I still get the old tree. Now all my crowns, 14000 exp and course level 14 are gone for nothing. Well at least now I get to revise everything.
I had to create a brand new account, with a different email address, to get the new course.
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Well.. I'm still in the control group. How could I get to the new course? Looking forward to keeping learning Norsk!
This course is really well organized and fluid and way more practical than the Danish tree ( krabben overvejer det! hvor er dine seriøse sakse? come on!!) it is great thank you all the way from Iran :))
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Guys! I love this Norwegian course, it is sometimes scary though. :) I practice every single day to have some progress. I just wanted to ask you if it’s possible to make stories in Norwegian like they exist in Spanish, Portuguese, French and German? I think users would appreciate it. It’s a really interesting activity! Thank you! :)
Got to watch out for the trolls! And the man behind the curtain.
Unfortunately, the story infrastructure has not been made available to us volunteers. I would love to play around with it. :)
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As others have asked, is there any more recent news on the progress of the testing of the new tree? Thank you for your efforts.
TRANSLATE: new. is. course. The. fine. and. written. has. over. all. it. the. sweat. and. blood. Deliciae. of
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Thank you very much!
Looking at the tree in "Spoiler Alert", it seems there are 172 skills, each one containing 5 levels. That means 860 crowns in total, isn't it?
That means it is the Duolingo course with more crowns :O
http://ardslot.com/duolingocrowns.html
"Allí la tortuga, nua, fa un agut rot a l'illa"
Bare hyggelig! I wouldn't get too caught up in the numbers, but yes, we're practically royalty. :)
The first Norwegian tree (Tree 1) was actually modeled on the Swedish tree. With ample modifications, of course, but you can still see similarities in the first couple of checkpoints in particular. Sibling languages with sibling courses. :)
Any updates on when the new tree will be going live for all users? Has it been pushed back by the platform-wide changes to skill levels/spaced repetition etc?
No rush, just wondered if there was any updates. Rushing to fully finish the old tree before the new one launches!
It's still on track for the second half of December, so you should have time.
The beginning of the test was pushed back, though for somewhat different reasons. Now, we're just running down the time a test is supposed to take, and then it's hopefully just a matter of Duo staff pushing the right buttons.
So once the new tree gets approved everyone will automatically switch to that one?
Any idea when this will occur? I’ve pretty much worked the old tree to death (186,000 points) and feel the work has reached the point of diminishing returns ... but I don’t want to give up my almost 800 day streak, so I’ve hesitated to create a new account.
Tree 4 has passed the A/B test with flying colours, but someone at Duo HQ still has to initiate and oversee the roll-out to all users. Staff are on holiday atm, so it'll be January 8th at the earliest.
It really is out of my hands at this point. :)
Thanks for any update at all, Deliciae. I know many of us are extremely excited to see the new version and all the hard work you put into it. I'm keeping all appendages crossed that I get the new version soon. Curiosity will truly be the death of me! :)
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Please don't keep any lower appendages crossed while walking on streets with a lot of traffic!
I see this post is now 6 months old and I still had the old tree, trying to get the new one. I made a new account to see if its "live" for new users already and I got it right away. But for some reasons I won't get it on my main account. I reset the progress and even deleted the language. It will always get me back to the old tree. Is it still in testing? I couldnt find any other way.
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If you want to get the new Norwegian tree on your main account soon (and to support the A/B testing) it may be best to continue to use the new account in the meantime, see also the following info from "New German from English course in testing":
Important: If you are one the old users creating a new account to get the new tree: Please don't stop using it after a skill or so. This will mess with the stats, making the system believe that more learners are abandoning the new tree than the old. So best to just wait until existing learners get it. If you do make a new account (or test the new tree without an account), don't abandon it, keep going :)
Excellent. Looking forward to the update. Is it still planned for mid December?
I learned with the old course a couple of years ago. Now I started learning norsk again, and I like the new versio so much! My favorites are the cute art accompanying the words
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Did you already get some feedback on how the A/B testing is going? And do you know how they measure if a course is "better"?
Hmm, it's a bit sad that after you took the pain of slicing up skills into smaller parts, they changed the system to have the same amount of lessons to go from level 4 to 5 as from 0 to 1. I recently got my "polite forms" skill golden in the Italian tree after finishing a single lesson, which felt a bit ridiculous. Hope they'll settle for a nice compromise. Your idea of having ~5 lessons per skill seems good, it would combine nicely with a sensible increase in the amount of lessons for reaching the higher levels.
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I too and impatient for updates. I understood it was to be late in December! I hoped in vain that it would be a Christmas present. I am beginning to give up hope.
Just finished, with a sigh of relief. 860 crowns. I think that was the second revisjon since I started it? I did buy Complete Norwegian and found it easy after doing your course, for which I am grateful.
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I came back to Norwegian after a long time away. (I dabble in a lot of languages and this past year focused on Danish since I was seeing friends who live in Copenhagen.) I was pleasantly surprised to see the course much expanded. I think it is bigger than any of the other languages I'm playing with. (172 skills vs. 70 for Danish and 66 for Swedish. Even Spanish, which is quite big, has only 159. It will take me some time to get to the end of skill tree. Tusen takk!
three questions:
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I started the course again yesterday, I deleted what I did before and started again. How do I know whether I have the old or the new tree?
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I did the next lesson in the tree and the previous one got also an upgrade the more I did in the newer lesson, should it be like that?
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Where on Tinycards can I train the trees vocab?
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If your first skill is named Intro, you have the new course.
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I'm assuming by lessons you mean skills. No, it should not be like that. You can report it as a bug here: https://support.duolingo.com/hc/en-us/requests/new
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There is no official companion course on Tinycards, but I believe there are some user-made decks for Tree 3 at least. You could always make your own for the new Tree 4 vocabulary.
This is all so amazing, but will grammar notes ever be available on mobile? That would revolutionize my ability to study.
You can access them through your mobile browser, but not in the apps.
It doesn't look like the current notes will ever be made available as an in-app feature, unfortunately.
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I love the Norwegian course (but not sure about the early obsession with elephants). I must be on the old course, but something changed in the formatting recently. I can no longer see the entire word bank when it's a bigger word bank. This has been really frustrating. I can't scroll to see it, it's simple too far down. I have a wide screen on my MacBook, but it might be shorter from top to bottom. I can't make the screen big enough on my computer to see the whole word bank on those items. I wish there was a scroll option OR that the bottom chunk (that says "skip" and "check") could be shortened. Not sure why this changed on me?
That's an interesting problem. But entirely confirmatory with my adage that #Technology will always, sometime, let you down#. Changes in technology..and they are sadly usually arbitrary changes, are frequently a backward step. As Powerpoint, Word, Google, Windows10..and arguably Boeing Airplane users are all finding out. Duo works. They really need not mess with it at all. Maybe a parallel, slightly harder, version exactly the same in use and format. Call it 'Duo Medium'. And then even 'Full Strength Duo'
You can take a screenshot and report this as a bug:
https://support.duolingo.com/hc/en-us/requests/new
Duo is always testing and changing things about the UI, with various degrees of success across platforms, browsers, screen resolutions, etc.
While waiting for a fix, you can try zooming out. That seems to do the trick.
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You could try zooming out the page in your browser. If you can't see a button for this, try the key combination ⌘ and - (minus), or Ctrl and -.
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I do have a request/feedback regarding this course. I am on the old course, so hopefully this has been fixed in the new upcoming course. If not, please consider making the changes I'm suggesting.
I think you spend entirely too much time on words that do not see daily use (turtle, elephant, apple, strawberry) and then dump too many new words on learners at once--2 dozen in the present tense lessons and I haven't counted how many in the location lessons. I think it would help learners of the language to see new words in smaller numbers earlier on in the lessons than to load them down with new words after dozens of the same rote memorization sentences using words that don't see daily use.
For instance, you have the words meat and chicken but not beef or pork, only the general word vegetables, and IMO way too many sentences about vegetarians and strawberries.
I'm not a language newbie. I studied Russian for 2 years in school, and I've dabbled in other languages here on Duo and elsewhere, so it's not an issue of me being unable to learn a language. I just think your rate of feeding new words and words that see daily use could use adjustment.
Thanks for reading.
Hei!
I missed this somehow, and you've already had good answers, but I'll add that - especially at a beginner level - it's not just about picking vocabulary you think is useful.
We need to pick vocabulary that illustrates the grammatical concepts we're teaching and that plays well with the rest of the words, so that we can actually create sentences.
It's also a big plus if we can use concrete nouns (animals and food are good in that respect), as those are easier to remember, especially with the addition of image exercises.
Another thing to keep in mind is that cognates are easier to learn, and free up some brain power to think about the grammar. So "bok" is a good early noun because it so closely resembles "book". On the food side there are "egg", "salt", "pepper" - even better.
You also want to avoid irregular words when possible. Unfortunately, it rarely is, given how many common verbs and nouns are irregular, but it's a trade-off and something we keep in mind.
On the topic of words that play well together:
We start with introducing subject pronouns and words like "jente", "gutt", "kvinne", and "mann" together with the most important verbs like "er" and "har". Then there are verbs like "spiser" and "drikker", that of course work with the food group of concrete nouns. The animals fit very well into that framework, as animals can be and eat and drink, and people can have animals, and so we work our way toward a basic vocabulary that is easy to create sentences with.
Once we're past the second checkpoint, we have enough of the basics covered to be able to choose the rest of the vocabulary a little more freely.
Just to say that, where I am in Norway, being able to speak about strawberries is vital. Like, really.
I could not agree more..One does not know when they will come in handy. I heard 'turtle' one time and it jumped out at me. And another time 'telephone salesman' and suddenly burst out laughing...."Hva hendte Andy... Hvorfor ler du??" they asked "Jeg kan ikke begynne å forklare" I said back.
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I'm on the new course. I think they must have improved this considerably: turtles and elephants have not appeared at all, strawberries appear only very rarely after the first couple of lessons, and apples appear at a frequency that seems justifiable to me. There are also very few lessons that introduce enough words to make me feel overwhelmed. But I have started to use a flashcard app to help me keep vocabulary fresh and drill words that I struggle with.
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turtle, elephant, apple, strawberry
I like to learn the words for common animals or fruit :)
Hopefully they will still appear in the new tree, though maybe not as frequent as before.
The present tense skill was the hardest one for me, with all the new vocabulary. But this should be improved in the new tree (which I don't have yet) - comment from Deliciae:
... In the Present skill (old tree), however, it's all new verbs you haven't seen before.
The new tree makes that transition a little smoother ...
I think they’ve tried to solve this by having shorter (fewer sentences/words) and way more lessons. I’m on the old course too but I’ve read through this entire thread.
Learning a new language isn't like making a Porche ..Carefully machining perfection everywhere...it's more like walking to Moscow. Sometimes you are going to go up the wrong road. Sometimes you wonder why you don't just take the plane. The first month's view looks almost like the third month's view. ..trees everywhere. But you keep going trusting the sign posts and those who walked before and who help you. Sometimes for fun one walks backwards, or goes on a detour to see the mountain view. But its all part of the journey. Some run all the way and do it in record times..others enjoy the walk and even make a holiday of it. Seems to me that Duolingo watch you walking from space. They try to keep it fun..but in the end you are the one doing it. And if you just keep going, whatever comes your way..however many strange words that you might not always need, you will get there. And that's OK for me.
Hi Deliciae, I am not sure where the best place to report typos is? In the module 'Education', 'et eksempel' is spelled 'et eksemple'. Thanks for all you do :)
Thank you, Sara! Consider it fixed. :)
You can use this thread in the future: https://forum.duolingo.com/comment/32196823
I've been going back and improving the levels on my old skills as I had reached the end and was kinda sad that there was no new content left for me... and then bam! Loving the new skills, and think the shorter number of lessons is definitely more motivating. Excited to continue learning, tusen takk!
I'm in the new group, and while I appreciate the update I would have preferred having the new words presented in a separate format, or as a side nodule to complete. I'll only occasionally get the new words to try to learn while doing reviews; it's actually pretty annoying.
That's unfortunately not something the contributor team has any control over.
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Probably best to contact the app developers, or you could try the general "Troubleshooting" discussion board?
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I'm a mouse in the control group, and I already love the "old" course. It's so well crafted and I've learned a ton already - so a HUGE thank you for all the work you are putting in - tusen takk! And I am also looking forward to trying the new couse at some point and learning even more.
I returned after a long time. My first skill is BASICS. So I guess I am on the old tree. However, I see that many skills have a Vocabulary table that is marked "(Tree 4)". What does this mean?
It means that the vocabulary lists reflect Tree 4 content, and will not be entirely accurate for Tree 3.
I think I'm on the new course and I'm loving it. Thank you for the hard work.
Just wanted to say thank you as I am enjoying the Norwegian course so much! I have the new one as mine started with Intro, but this is my first time on Duolingo so I can't comment on the difference - but I'm finding this such a good way to learn a language. Learning sentences in context and building up vocab and grammar gradually, especially with the focus on listening and speaking, is really working for me. Thanks!
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I am so grateful for the developers and those behind the scenes in developing the Norwegian course! It is so awesome! Even though some of the lessons are really weird like how the ducks will be eating some books and what not, I have learned so much and could start to have basic conversation with my Norwegian friends, which is good! The illustration helps a lot with learning as well. Because it is not as boring as it was! Having a background of German helps a lot in learning Norwegian as well. Overall, thank you so much for your contribution to this course!
I love this course because of the funny and absurd sentences that sometimes come up
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This is all very nice to hear about, but I am not one of the lucky people to be able to try it. Please, please, please let me have it before Christmas. Thank you
Hey! I was just wondering when will we all get the new tree. Cuz it looks awesome but I still don't have it ): anyways, thanks for the hard work!!
It should be rolling out to all users right about now. The process may take a few hours, but I wouldn't be surprised if you already have it. :)
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Indeed, it happened just when I wanted to start a new lesson .... thanks a lot (again) for all the effort !
I have got the much-improved course..the trouble is that my Norwegian is still the same as before!
I actually like Nynorsk and the songs more and more nowadays. And full comprehension of the Ole Jakob series and Ibsens samlede verker must come before further distractions.
I just popped back into Norwegian after a couple weeks of working on Swedish, and was surprised to find I was now in the V4 tree. I guess the testing period is over, and everyone is on the new tree?
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I don't want the new course. I didn't click on it, didn't choose it, and it changed me to the new tree anyway. It threw a huge monkey wrench into my Norwegian studies, and I'd prefer to have my old tree back. How do I get it? I don't want to go over courses I've already completed. Please help!
There's no way to go back to the old one, the new one has passed extensive testing to ensure it's better and is now rolled out to everyone.
That said, you're free to ignore the updated skills if you want, you don't have to do them. But it is new content which you may not have learned all of before, so it may be worthwhile doing them, and if you're advanced it shouldn't take you that long.
This is excellent. I used the app for some time so had no idea there were tips or other goodies. Will you be adding stories and time quizzes? I love the lessons, they're very entertaining. Of course, I always wanted to say "Jeg er faren din" in Norwegian!
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Unfortunately a lot of the goodies such as stories are only available for the language courses that are developed in-house at Duolingo. The Norwegian course is created by volunteers, and Duolingo currently doesn't offer the ability for contributors to add those features to their courses. At the London conference in July 2019, they promised that it was coming soon, probably "by the end of the year", but that hasn't materialised yet, and I haven't heard anything more since the conference.
The volunteers deserve endless credit (Yayyyy!!!). I, too, would welcome stories in Norwegian like the ones I enjoy in German, but I recognize that the audience for Norwegian is much smaller. Duolingo is wonderful, but of course it does have limitations. I have great difficulty understanding spoken Norwegian other than what I hear repeatedly on Duolingo ... too bad all TV programs and conversations don't come with subtitles. I also need to read more Norwegian, but it's very hard to find books in Norwegian ... e.g., Book Depository and Amazon are great sources for books in German, but have virtually nothing in Norwegian. Still, I can't thank the contributors enough for their great work on the delightful, funny, and clever Norwegian Duolingo program.
Takk, Annette!
This book store ships abroad: https://www.haugenbok.no/Kundeservice/Informasjon/Kunder-i-utlandet
This site requires a Norwegian IP address, but has lots of free digitized books, newspapers and more: https://www.nb.no/en/the-national-library-of-norway/
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Thanks for the tip for the store that ships books abroad! I've been trying to get hold of some original Jo Nesbø in a while! I will try this :)
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One thing I have started to do about nine months ago and helped me greatly were podcasts. There are quite a few which are accessible on Spotify also from abroad (I live in Austria) or you can use NRK's (=Norsk rikskringkasting, i.e. national broadcasting) podcast app to stream radio channels and podcasts. I really like EKKO samfunnspodden (all sorts of topics), Hele Historien (extremely well made documentaries) and Radiodok (also documentaries) but there are also other topics that NRK has podcasts for. A non NRK podcast is Historiepodden, which I find quite funny and easy to follow. Lacking a somebody to practise with, I found listening extremely helpful :)
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I've tried several podcasts, but was so happy to recently come across Norslærer Karense:
https://podtail.com/no/podcast/norsklaerer-karense/
Her podcast is specifically aimed at learners, so she keeps vocabulary simple, and often repeats difficult concepts using different words, so it's much easier to follow. I'm absolutely loving it :)
Soon™
(Which is to say we still don't know when we'll have access - if ever.)
I had no idea the norwegian creators volunteered. I am so grateful! This is a wonderful course adn they have worked so hard to give this to us. As for stories, I shall try to create my own and get feedback from the forums.
