https://www.duolingo.com/brandon376

"La donna non vuole che si conosca il suo nome."

April 14, 2013

13 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/brandon376

I think this translation works better: "The woman does not want you to know her name."

April 14, 2013

https://www.duolingo.com/Chris123456

Correct me if I am wrong but wouldn't your sentence be "La donna non vuole che ti conosca il suo nome" ?

There is, however, a major problem with Duolingo on this page in that the given translation is clearly wrong - currently reading "The woman does not know her name to be known"

April 14, 2013

https://www.duolingo.com/brandon376

Yes, your sentence is clearer but I was translating "si conosca" as "you know" because sometimes in duologo if I recall correctly, the third person "si" translates as "you". I generally translate "si" in this construction as "one", so the sentence would translate, "The woman does not want one to know her name," or more freely, "The woman does not want her name known." stay loose,

April 14, 2013

https://www.duolingo.com/f.formica
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  • 2097

In this case rather than 'you' I think the closer English gets is 'people', i.e. "The woman doesn't want people to know her name"; perhaps it's me, but in this context 'you' doesn't sound as generic as when you say 'you do it like this' to mean 'it's done like this'. In the 'you do it like this' example it doesn't really matter if I'm talking to you or stating a generic fact, but "she doesn't want you to know her name" and "she doesn't want anyone to know her name" are pretty different.

April 14, 2013

https://www.duolingo.com/ferynn

Is "La donna non vuole che tu conosci il suo nome" also possible? Because I really don't see why "si" is necessary here, except if as you said, it's translated by "people".

April 15, 2013

https://www.duolingo.com/ferynn

:) don't worry. To be honest, I totally did not see the difference with "conosce", shame on me. But I won't be caught again :) : che => congiuntivo ! :D

April 15, 2013

https://www.duolingo.com/f.formica
Mod
  • 2097

"Si" is impersonal here, it expresses the generality of the subject (the same way you'd use 'on' in French); if you use "tu" you're forcing it to refer to a single a single person whom she wants to keep in the dark, so I prefer "people" because it gives as much generality. Would it be "La femme ne veut pas qu'on connait son nom" in French?

April 15, 2013

https://www.duolingo.com/ferynn

All right, I get it. It's true that if I say "tu" I alter a lot the sentence. I never considered using an equvalent to "on" in italian, but now you mention it, it makes perfectly sense.

In french, it would be "La femme ne veut pas qu'on connaisse son nom", subjonctive present because of the "que". Another possibility would be "La femme ne veut pas que son nom soit connu", passive form (so we get rid of the "on"), subjonctive past.

As always, thanks for the insight !

April 15, 2013

https://www.duolingo.com/f.formica
Mod
  • 2097

Thanks to you for fixing my French ^^ 'Conosca' in the original sentence is in congiuntivo as well for the same reason, I thought it'd need something like that in French too but I had forgot the right conjugation :)

April 15, 2013

https://www.duolingo.com/peter2108

In BE 'you' is now used where 'one' would have been: The woman does not want one to know her name is correct but perhaps becoming archaic and/or confined to elevated registers (ie posh speak)

July 15, 2013

https://www.duolingo.com/Thoughtdiva

As far as I know, it is not correct modern English to say "I want that (he/ you etc).../ he wants that (he/you etc)..." - unless it is correct in other English-speaking countries?

May 17, 2013

https://www.duolingo.com/Blomeley

It is still correct, but it is also becoming archaic. It's a 'common' way of indicating that you are about to use the subjunctive tense, although that tense as a whole is rarely used at all these days. "I want/need that you/he/she be well behaved tonight" is a typical example in the now rarely used subjunctive tense. It is remarkable how similar to the italian construction it is!

July 3, 2013

https://www.duolingo.com/Chris123456

Nice post Blomeley. As Thoughtdiva implies, the subjunctive is not really used in modern English. The similarity between what is Old English, perhaps Shakespearian English, and modern Italian is not only remarkable but a really useful tool to understand how the subjunctive is used very frequently in modern Italian. As an aid to constructing sentences I often wonder how Shakespeare would have said it and then turn it into Italian and there you are!

July 3, 2013
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