"We write to them in October."
Translation:Scriviamo a loro ad ottobre.
Well two of those depend on context. With time "a" and "in" are pretty interchangeable but genereally speaking "a' = at and "in" = "in a place". "Ad" is simply used for when the words between the "a", "e" and I think "o" ends and begins with a vowel respectively. For instance "la donna ed uomo" would be "The woman and man". But for "ad" it would "L'uomo viene ad aprile" or "The man comes in April".
I wrote Loro scriviamo a ottobre and it said it was wrong because it should be Li scriviamo a ottobre or Scriviamo a loro ad ottobre but I'm certain that loro can be used as an indirect pronoun. Plus li is a direct pronoun so that would mean we write them rather than we write TO them. Anyone care to comment?
As for 'li', yes, there is a difference, e.g. ' li scriviamo una lettera ad ottobre'= we write them a letter in october vs 'scriviamo una lettera a loro ad ottobre'=we write a letter to them in october, but as you can see they are both acceptable (considered correct by native speakers).
This is quite confusing. "li" means "them", but it does not neccecarily mean them as in "people", but is actually refering to the object.
"Li scriviamo" could be used in this way: "Hai finito di scrivere i contratti?" - "Have you finished writing the contracts?". "Li scriviamo adesso" - "We write them now".
If you are writing lettes, that are feminine, you instead use "le": "Hai finito di scrivere le lettere?" - "Have you finished writing the letters?". "Le scriviamo adesso" - "We write them now".
But "li" could also be used for people, as in "Li educhiamo" - "We educate them". Here we say "we write to them", so we need to either use "a loro" or "gli".
Hope this made things more clear
I looked it up and this says that loro and gli can both be used to be to them. http://italian.about.com/library/fare/blfare166a.htm
Yuujen, if you want to use «loro» as an indirect object pronoun, you must put it after the verb. This is the only indirect object pronoun that follows this rule. Note:
Loro scriviamo ad ottobre. = They we write in October. (sounds like a subject-verb agreement error)
Scriviamo loro ad ottobre. = We write them in October.
I wrote the latter, and it was accepted. I will refer you to this link: http://italian.about.com/library/fare/blfare117a.htm.
Hope this helps.
'them' is used as an indirect object pronoun, so either of these is acceptible:
after the verb
.. scriviamo a loro
before the verb
.. gli scriviamo
Here's a chart sorted by pronoun:
Le is to her when it's alone but if you're saying Give her it, you'd say Daglielo. It doesn't give the form li because it's only showing the indirect pronouns, while li is a direct pronoun. Gli is also often used as to them in more informal situations as well. (http://italian.about.com/library/fare/blfare165a.htm) Furthermore, object pronouns in Italian (and French) go before the verb, not after most of the time. So I write a letter = Io scrivo una lettera but I write it = Io la scrivo. I'm still very dubious.
Throwing a monkey wrench into this discussion.
First of all, Duo did not mark me wrong for using in ottobre. Maybe that is because the English sentence is ambiguous as to whether we write this coming October or every October. Or maybe there is a glitch in the software. The correctness of ad/in is not the point of this comment., and I request that any responses do not address this issue. My sole focus is on the proper pronoun usage in this sentence.
Duo's "Tips and Notes" on Object Pronouns in the Clitics-1 module https://www.duolingo.com/skill/it/Clitic-Pronouns-1 says that the [taking a big breath] 3rd person plural indirect before-the-verb object is gli for both masculine and feminine genders. After the verb, it would be a loro.
You have to include the a for after-the-verb indirect objects. This prevents ambiguity, because both direct and indirect object pronouns use the tonic form when positioned after the verb. Tonic Direct Object pronouns don't use a, Tonic Indirect Object pronouns must use the a.
Duo marked me wrong for my answer (given below) on this exercise and gave me two alternative correct answers:
gli scrviamo in ottobre
scriviamo a loro ad ottobre
My wrong answer was: le scriviamo in ottobre. Duo underlined le in my answer and gli in the correct answer to show that that was my error.
gli before the verb here is supposed to mean "them", but gli is ambiguous, because it means both "to him" and "to them" - is both the [taking another really deep breath] 3rd person singular indirect object masculine pronoun and the 3rd person plural indirect object pronoun for both masculine and feminine genders. There's no way of resolving this, unless you write gli scriviamo a loro in/ad Ottobre - or simply scriviamo a loro in/ad ottobre.
So, the only unambiguous correct answer is *scriviamo a loro ad/in ottobre".
My recollection from something I read is that originally the only technically correct answer was the one you have given ( i.e. "a loro" after the verb). However "gli" is increasingly used before the verb to the point that it is now considered correct even though it means "to him/it" and the context has to resolve the ambiguity. Interestingly this link shows only the "a loro" version as correct, whereas other links I have seen include the "gli" option: https://www.thoughtco.com/indirect-object-pronouns-in-italian-4057468. So I would say that in modern usage both forms are considered correct with "gli" increasingly preferred.
I typed in the same thing "le scriviamo in ottobre" thinking this was another clitic sentence and found out it should be gli instead of le....if they were using clitics. I am so glad I read the responses here because seeing that you chose to type in the same response doesn't make me feel so bad.
When you have the preposition "a" before a vowel it usually/optionally turns into "ad". This is similar to the rule for a/an in English. The same rule applies to the conjunctions "o" and "e".
- a settembre
- ad ottobre
- ottobre o novembre
- settembre od ottobre
- ottobre e novembre
- settembre ed ottobre
Actually, «loro» is a subject and indirect object pronoun. «Gli» is an indirect object pronoun meaning "to him." Per approfondire, veda: http://italian.about.com/library/fare/blfare117a.htm.
«il loro» does not mean "them." That means "their," so your sentence translates as "We write to their in October." It feels like a noun is missing. If you want to say "We write them in October" instead of "We write to them in October," you can simply say «Scriviamo loro in ottobre.», since «loro» (and only «loro») functions as both a subject pronoun and an indirect object pronoun. If it were not «loro» and if it were «voi», the two sentences above would be, respectively, «Scriviamo a voi in ottobre.» and «Vi scriviamo in ottobre.». Note that only «loro» (when used as an indirect object pronoun in the second sentence) can come after the verb, and «vi», «ci», «mi», «Le», «ti», «le» and «gli» must come before the verb.
«gli» what? Is «gli» an article or a pronoun? There is no «gli» in the sentence. If it is an article, then «lo» is always the singular (e.g. «lo stivalo») and «gli» the plural (e.g. «gli stivali»). If you are talking about indirect object pronoun, then «gli scrivo una lettera» would be "I write him a letter," and «scrivo loro una lettera» would be "I write them a letter."
The correct sentence is without preposition 'a' between verb and subject plural 3rd person (it is a grammatical rule for this person):</br></br>
-- Scriviamo loro a ottobre --</br></br>
And the preposition 'a' (when?) before the month is without 'd' because ottobre starts with a 'o'.</br> If the month was, for example, aprile, then you can write ad aprile because this month starts with the same vowel.
Right, I understand and know that rule. But just like you can say both «Ti scriviamo...» (indirect object pronoun) and «Scriviamo a te...» (stressed object pronoun), so too can you say both «Scriviamo loro...» (indirect object pronoun) and «Scriviamo a loro...» (stressed object pronoun). These stressed object pronouns are also known as disjunctive pronouns or prepositional pronouns and are similar to the French « moi, toi, lui, etc. ».
- When you have a verb tr., you do not put — after the verb —the preposition 'a'.
- While, in this specific case with scrivere, you have a verb intr., BUT the sentence is like "Gli scriviamo (scriviamo a lui) in ottobre" (we write to him in October), so, in this Italian sentence, Gli does not have the preposition a. In the same way, using the plural third person loro, that you cannot put it at the beginning of the sentence, there is not the preposition a
If I understand correctly, the whole adding a «d» to the preposition «a» before a word that starts with a vowel is an optional phenomenon that helps the flow of speech. So if you do it in the right place, it is fine. If you do not do it in the right place, it is okay because it is an optional/extra phenomenon. If you do it in the wrong place, though, it is definitely wrong.
More often than not, you add a "d" to the prepositions "o", "e", "a" when the proceeding sound is similar to the sound the preposition makes. For example:
novembre od ottobre = November or October
Lui ed io arriviamo = He and I arrive
Mangiamo loro ad aprile = We eat them in April
"oppure" should only be used to put emphasis on an option like:
A bomb technician is dismantling a bomb that is counting down and he comes across two wires, he asks "Rosso oppure verde?"
Sure he could say "rosso o verde" and the person he is asking would know what he is talking about but since the bomb is counting down and a wire needs to be cut, the emphasis makes it more poignant so that you choose one or the other.
Another example Say you're hosting a party and you ask your wife/husband "Il vino bianco oppure vino rosso?" She responds "Il vino bianco. Vino rosso è per bistecca. Non mangiamo bistecca stasera"
Hope this helps