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"Is there a university in New York?"

Translation:Estne universitas Novi Eboraci?

August 27, 2019

48 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/yvonne550472

What is the difference between Novum Eboracum and Novi Eborici? Is 3Celtic Viking right.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JaJsemAdam

They're declined in different cases. Grammatical case means that a noun (or adjective, or pronoun) changes its form according to its role in the sentence. Latin nouns have six, or sometimes seven cases. "Novum Eboracum" is both the nominative (the case used when a noun is the subject of a sentence) and the accusative (the case used when a noun is the object of a sentence) form. In other words, the two cases are different. "Novi Eboraci" is the locative, the case that is only sometimes used to say that something is in that place. It's translated as "in New York".

Here's a video about cases: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cnF1ycgelUY And specifically Latin cases: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2fhP_fk2wNQ


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/joaquinsan429444

From which declination is New York? I guess there are five, isn't it?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Scian4

2nd declension


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SeanTWilson

I had “Estne Novi Eboraci universitas” – is the word order important here?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DebF26
  • 1043

Because in the word bank, estne is uncapitalised, i tried Novi Eboraci universitas estnse, and was rejected. If it's meant to go first, why doesn't estne have a capital?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Quidam_Homo

No, that's good. You can report that one.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/aadrita__

What's the most natural word order here?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/myrichiehaynes

This is one of those cases where the noun's (i) suffix includes the word "in", correct?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/N1755L

Yes, same as Romae.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Lt_Uhura

Do you not use "in" on cities?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/david_smith_ii

No, the idea of "in" is contained in the locative case ending. Locative is related to location. Since it specifies location, no "in" or "at" is needed. Not that that kind of logic always works with languaged, lol.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/CamillaCSN

Why I can't use the phrase "estne universitas in Novi Eboraci"? Why no "in" here?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/psittacus_ebrius

The city's name is Novum Eboracum, Novi Eboraci is the locative case for it.

The locative means in/at/on the place in question, and comes in two forms. First the true locative case is handled by its own declension, which was non-productive by the classical era, but still hangs around in a few places such as: city names, home(domus, domi), countryside(rus, ruri); or soil(humus, humi). Second is the locative ablative, which is the form in which you use the in+ablative, of which you are obviously familiar.

So saying "estne universitas in Novi Eboraci" is the same as saying "is there a university in in New York".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/3CelticVikings

I thought it is "Novum Eboracum" when New York is the object and "Novi Eboraci" when New York is the subject... Hmmm...


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Quidam_Homo

It is "Novum Eboracum" when it is the subject AND when it is the object.

"Novi Eboraci" means "in New York".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/lokelani_srr

Is it correct to use "in Novi Eboraci" as well? Duo is not accepting it, but I was under the impression it was correct.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/psittacus_ebrius

You have two forms place names one is for cities and one is for things larger than cities: 'Novi Eboraci' is the locative, and it means 'in New York City'; and 'in Novo Eboraco' is the locative ablative, and it means 'in New York State'.

It's usually less confusing because the same name usually does not apply to two different types of places.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JaJsemAdam

I'm pretty sure it's not. "In" would not use the locative, but the ablative, which is "Novo Eboraco", and I think that when a word has a locative (the "Novi Eboraci" form), it would not use the "in" form.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Devonmonkey

Yeah I also put "in Novi Eboraci and I don't know why it was wrong


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Nicholas_Keen

See JaJsemAdam above


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/psittacus_ebrius

The answer "Estne universitas in Novo Eboraco" was not accepted.

Since the question did not specify if it was referring to the city or the state I reported this correction.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AlexandraN660923

So do I use "in" + ablative for country names but just the locative without preposition if it's a city? Because I noticed it's always "In Italia" or "In America", which both are country names, but then "Romae" or like in this question "Novi Eboraci" when the action described by the sentence is located in a city.

And then, assuming my reasoning is correct, couldn't it be "In Novum Eboracum" if the state is meant, rather than the city?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/psittacus_ebrius

No, Novum Eboracum is the nominative, but your mistake is very understandable. Most non-city place names tend to be in 1st declension (end with an a) and in 1st declension the nominative and ablative are spelled the same way. Novum Eboracum, an exception to this, is 2nd declension so the ablative is Novo Eboraco.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AlexandraN660923

Ohhh thanks, such a silly mistake! But apart from that was I right? We do use a preposition + ablative for states and such, unless we're talking about cities?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/psittacus_ebrius

Yep. It's called the locative ablative (ablativus locativus).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/david_smith_ii

Why not "Univeritasne Novi Eboraci est?" Is there a preference for VSO in questions?

Now that I think of it, I don't remember seeing many questions in high school Latin.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/psittacus_ebrius

Yes, at least for yes/no questions.

Attaching the -ne to universitas makes it sound (at least to me) more skeptical/incredulous that there is a university in New York.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AfonsoWang

"universitas Novi Eboraci estne" wasn't accpeted


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/psittacus_ebrius

The question word goes first (estne).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PastaPalPasta

Why is "Estne universitas in Novo Eboraco" incorrect? It is the ablative form of "Novum Eboracum"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KCL90024

does "Universitas Novi Eboraci est?" have a different sense? It was not accepted, but I wonder if it means "Is the university in New York?" rather than " Is THERE A university in New York"? Thank you.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/psittacus_ebrius

It's a statement instead of a question. There is a university in New York.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KCL90024

Thank you BryanEdwar5. I just want to be sure, so latin doesn't ever form questions by just appending a question mark to the declarative? I seem to remember (though at this point I could be misremembering) that in other exercises, an alternative answer to the "suntne" construction was just the statement with a question mark? Thank you so much for your comment.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/psittacus_ebrius

The use of a diacritic to indicate a question is a fairly recent creation, late middle ages, if memory serves.

Punctuation across the board was not standardized for most of the life of Latin. In fact, during most of the classical period spaces between words were non-existent, thankfully they're not being purists :-P


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Alan_III

Why can't i say estne universitas in novi eboraci?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Eric733998

What is the difference between novi eboraci and novum eboracum


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/CristopherLira

Why not " estne universitas IN novum eboracum?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/david_smith_ii

That would mean "into" because of the accusative case. If you mean in the state of New York, it would be "in Novo Eboraco" - ablative case.

Cities use a special locative case - only used for cities afaik. Locative already contains the idea of "in" or "at" in the case ending, so in New York City is "Novi Eboraci".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/psittacus_ebrius

Also islands (except very large islands e.g. Sicily), and a handful of other words like domus » domi.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DonoRC96

Instead of "Novi Eboraci", couldn't I put "in Novum Eboracum"? I did and it says I'm wrong.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/psittacus_ebrius

You cannot. Please look at some of the earlier comments for an explanation.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Slaninka_Speck

Someone gave this explenation earlier, i'll paste it in here for you though:

JaJsemAdam 2414122562 They're declined in different cases. Grammatical case means that a noun (or adjective, or pronoun) changes its form according to its role in the sentence. Latin nouns have six, or sometimes seven cases. "Novum Eboracum" is both the nominative (the case used when a noun is the subject of a sentence) and the accusative (the case used when a noun is the object of a sentence) form. In other words, the two cases are different. "Novi Eboraci" is the locative, the case that is only sometimes used to say that something is in that place. It's translated as "in New York".

Here's a video about cases: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cnF1ycgelUY And specifically Latin cases: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2fhP_fk2wNQ


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/foumakound

I had this sentence wrong 3 minutes ago and the corrector gave me this answer: "Estne Novum eboracum universitas est?" does it means that both answers are right?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Nicholas_Keen

Why not Eboraci Novi?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/psittacus_ebrius

Proper nouns, when translated, are transliterated (obviously not in this case) or calqued.

(This is a general translation rule, not specific to Latin)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Slaninka_Speck

Am I the only one that thought that this sentence was translated with an "in" like "Estne universitas in Novum eboracum?" because I think you should be able to do this. Why not?

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