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  5. "Frater studet."

"Frater studet."

Translation:The brother studies.

August 27, 2019

46 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Talos_the_Cat

['fraː.tɛr 'stʊ.dɛt] would be correct


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/WeStWo0D

Could this also be translated as "The brother does study" or "The brother is studying"? Or is it strictly "studies"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Katja-z

@WeStWo0D

"The brother is studying" would work. It accepted it for me. It is also correct English.

But "The brother does study" would only be correct if you are doing something like a comparison as in "The sister is not studying but the brother does study. It is more of an emphasis that he is indeed studying.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SGuthrie0

"The brother does study" is used in questions? "Does the brother study? I don't know about the Latin.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/princezzla1

It is the brother studies


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SanDigital

Why is "Brother studies" wrong?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Katja-z

Because in English either a "the" or an "a" is required before "brother".

Similar to "I drive car" not being correct. It needs to be " I drive a/the car."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SanDigital

For family relationships, you can drop the articles to imply that it is your relative.

For example, I can say "Father studies" or "Mother studies". It sounds a bit old fashioned and formal, but the implication is that it is the speaker's mother/father.

Similarly, I can say "Brother studies" or "Sister studies" with the implication that it is my brother or sister. Again, it sounds formal and old fashioned, but it is grammatical.

This construction is used extensively in the Berenstain Bears books: https://www.putmeinthestory.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/t/h/the-berenstain-bears-pet-show-6.1561153748.jpg


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PERCE_NEIGE

As you said, the implication is the speaker's mother or father, but here, it's "the brother", we don't know whose brother it is.

I can't find nowhere in English grammar books this "zero article" used to replace a possessive. I think it's not official grammar, and the example you gave is maybe related to something a little babyish (?).

But if you find something about that, I'd be curious and interested by the reading.

Now: "Brother studies" is accepted, but I'm not very sure it's good English grammar (but I'm not a native)

Edit: I've found that this zero-article was used for "titles", like "mother" considered as a title for instance.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/doc642670

in these contexts, though, the relation is being used as a proper noun, rather than a common noun.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Isaac3972

I'm confused as well. Are definite articles mandatory regardless of context? Because as I understand it, in this context it could go either way in English. It is stilted to say "brother studies," but not only is it still grammatically correct, the course has accepted things like "Sister is in the city and Mother is at home."

Granted, it is in Beta still, so either way this appears to be a bug of some kind.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/benton.1

In English, "nouns" require articles while "proper nouns" (the name of a person, place, or thing) do not. Update: Right you are Perce. Thanks for adding that!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PERCE_NEIGE

Except if it's indefinite plural, or a generality:

Cats don't like water. Girls are playing (some girls).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PERCE_NEIGE

No, it's not proper English grammar.

Have a look here about the use of the "Zero article" in English:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Article_(grammar)#Zero_article


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/gsp732649

duo accepted "a sister studies" but only " the brother studies".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PERCE_NEIGE

Please, report it, with the "report" button, on the exercise page.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Basicpract

The reason is because they do not yet have all the right possible answers, and are looking for the most mainstream.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SGuthrie0

Latin derivations: Fraternity, fratricide, fraternal, fraternal. Student, study.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sasha71526

In Russian - another language without articles - if someone said брат учится, without further explanation, I would assume that it was THEIR brother that they were talking about. Does "Frater studet" in Latin carry the same implication?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Basicpract

Yes, the main way of understanding family members is that without clarification, it is the speaker's family member.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MamaSmed

Studeō, studēre actually means "to be eager." It is probably not a good word to use in a beginning Latin lesson. It only occasionally means "to study." Of course, it is an inside joke that most "students" are not "eager."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Tor3o

I confuse frater and pater. What can I do


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Basicpract

It you think about English words: - A paternity test is to determine if someone if the father of a child. - Joining a frat is becoming part of a brotherhood.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Katja-z

@ Tor3o

Other than memorizing, and repeating it, if your first language is English, it may help to remember that words like fraternity, fraternize... and such are related to "frater"/brother, and paternity to "pater"/father. "Papa" a form of "dad/father" also sounds sort of close to "pater". Or at least it starts with "pa"

Personally, I tend to just try to learn by memorizing and repetition since relying on similarity can end up being really misleading. But quite a few people seem to like doing it. (So it may help a bit if you are careful.)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/UsmaanSidd

Ohhhh, frère in French means brother and frater in Latin means brother (see the connection!)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/UsmaanSidd

Same with sister (soror = soeur)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

frater is "brother"

filius is "son"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Basicpract

Without any context, it is assumed that "frater" is my brother, not a random person who happens to be a brother. "My brother studies" should be correct.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/doccat

I gave them the answer they want, but it is something I would never say. " The brother studies." No. Never. "Brother studies." would be a stretch, but more natural. In a regional way, a person would say, "Bubby is studying." or "Bro is studying." Basically, Brother is being uses as a name.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PERCE_NEIGE

If Brother is used as a name, it's not the case here. "Brother" without an article, it's probably too slangish.

Edit: some sites call it "titles", and say it can be used as titles, without an article.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sarah334848

Does a way exist, in latin, to point the difference between "he studies", and "he is studying" ?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KandaceStar17

is "the" mandatory here ? "Brother studies" seems ok.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/rays_787

Frater should be marked as a new word.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/YoteCai

Could I say, 'the bro studies' and use slang


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sasha71526

No, because "Frater" is not slang. When translating, you should preserve register as well as meaning. The Romans had their slang terms too, they just are not taught in this course.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SimonPF92

The translation "My brother studies" is not accepted, and while I know, that it only says "brother" I'd understand it as "my brother" without further context. Can someone explain to me, why that solution is incorrect?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Basicpract

It is only because they have not included all the right answers. "My brother" is the meaning that makes the most sense.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SophieFaur4

the brother are studying


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DeadAccount.

"Fratres student" i think.

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