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"Ille paterfamilias est benignus."

Translation:That head of the house is kind.

August 28, 2019

55 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Julia_Raven

Wouldn't it translate into something like "patriarch"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Danielconcasco

That's a possible translations, but it loses something. In my own classroom I leave it as paterfamilias.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LiamTown

Perhaps it would be better to add "head of the household" as a selectable option since "paterfamilias" will be an unfamiliar term for most English speakers. While the term "paterfamilias" may be more nuanced, "head of the household" or something similar will build better foundational intuition for new learners.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PERCE_NEIGE

I had the suggested correction "head of the house", so I guess they added it, it seems close of your "head of the household".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PolyglotyrixRex

Although it loses a bit in translation, if you're translating it as head of the house, it could easily be the mother, as my mother was the head of the house growing up. Paterfamilias translates as "father of the family" and I find it funny that my mother was the father of the house. Aah, the joys of language!

Mater paterfamilias est.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BrettWettlaufer

In my opinion, "That head of the family is kind" should also be accepted


[deactivated user]

    Yes, especially as the word literally means “father of the family”. “familias” uses the old genitive, where the Classical genitive is “familiae”. “familia” in this expression would most naturally mean the extended family.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Dim-ond-dysgwr

    Extended, in fact, to the degree that it included not only kinsfolk but also serfs and slaves. That is why "head of the household" is a better translation than "head of the family".


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Edd_zava94

    Well, in ancient Rome the concept of "Family" as we know it today was quite different. Family was a broader concept, so I think "head of the house" comprises it


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/palmiramar_

    In Spanish there is an expression for paterfamilias which can be used for the father (most common) or the mother (usually when the father is dead) It is: "cabeza de familia" (head of the family)
    I think it's very appropriate for translating this sentence.


    [deactivated user]

      cabeza derives eventually from caput, “head”. It’s less sexist than pater or mater, although of course still very “archal” (just not patriarchal or matriarchal). Paterfamilias, however, refers specifically to a male, and is a great help to those attempting to understand the ancient Romans and classical texts. Those just learning to communicate with fellow moderns in Latin may not find this distinction so necessary. It’s up to each individual to decide how to use this Latin course, which hasn’t made it clear what sort of Latin we are supposed to be learning.


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Limeila

      We have the same in French, "chef de famille"


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SeanMeaneyPL

      People will have many different reasons for learning Latin. Understanding the dynamics of Roman relationships may not be one of them, but if you do want to understand the dynamics of a roman household, then leaving the maleness in the title is valid. Just leave it as paterfamilias in English. I don't hold with the view that "most English speakers don't understand the (English) word paterfamilias". That's what dictionaries are for. How else can the little blisters expand their vocabulary?


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/HarperNico

      Although it might just be the English coming out of me, this sentence doesn't sound right. It doesn't sound like it would ever be said. Instead, you might say, "The head of the house is kind." And the specific head of the house you are talking about would be implied. But, I can not imagine anyone ever saying, "That head of the house is kind." Am I completely and helplessly English, or does this make sense?


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/leesiepieces

      It does sound unnatural, but when you're learning languages you often learn unusual and awkward phrases. It helps because it stands out from what you know. You have to make sense of it, which makes a memory. Good fun.


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/paysrouges

      I have suggested that 'The head of that house is kind' would be a better English translation.


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SGuthrie0

      Benignus.
      Cognate: benign


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Andres.Campe

      I got this sentence as a listen and write exercise so I didn't do any translation and the word order was given.

      Why "est benignus" rather than "benignus est"? Do these two emphasize two different things even though word order is flexible and both could be just OK?


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
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      • 2620

      The kind head of the household is...

      This is why stative verbs are often SVC (subject verb complement), because it gets ambiguous when everything is in the nominative on one side of the verb.


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LilRed76

      Wouldn't "Ille paterfamilias benignus est" also be correct?


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
      Mod
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      • 2620

      The kind head of the household is...

      This is why stative verbs are often SVC (subject verb complement), because it gets ambiguous when everything is in the nominative on one side of the verb.


      [deactivated user]

        Think of the ambiguities in Classical Latin - ILLEPATERFAMILIASESTBENIGNVSPSITTACUSCANTAT That man is a paterfamilias. The kind parrot sings. ILLEPATERFAMILIASBENIGNVSESTPSITTACUSCANTAT That paterfamilias is kind. The parrot sings. In Mediaeval Latin the position of the verb is more flexible since word spacing and punctuation reduce the potential for ambiguity.


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/maddox996594

        Wouldnt it be "head of the house hold"


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
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        • 2620

        "Household" is one word.


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Arne2485

        "Family head" should also be accepted as correct?


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Anas276

        Doesn't "Ille" mean "he"?


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
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        • 2620

        Latin doesn't technically have 3rd person pronouns. It just uses demonstratives to fill the role.


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Danielconcasco

        Is, ea, and id are the third person pronouns. Very often demonstratives are used in their place.


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
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        • 2620

        I thought those were "weak" demonstratives.


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Danielconcasco

        They are pronouns used as demonstratives, as opposed to demonstratives used as pronouns ;)

        Edit: they come from Protoitalic pronouns, so they are the real ones.


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
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        • 2620

        Well then! :-P


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Will759239

        Couldn't it be translated as Father of The Family? I have always been taught it that way.


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/sataysauce5

        Google translate confused me further, telling me paterfamilias is father...


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
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        • 2620

        Google Translate is not a good resource, especially for Latin.


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/neijak1

        It's highly unreliable, often coming back with jargon or nonsense.


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/anchovy.paste

        Rather than using Google Translate, a good website to use for finding word definitions is www.latin-english.com . It's helped me through Latin class. Hope this helps!


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Xuu37

        I wrote "this" instead of "that". It was marked wrong. If "ille" is "that" what would have been "this"?


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Macropicid

        I am not certain that, "head of the home" should have been marked as incorrect when "head of the house" is considered correct. Can somebody please lay the smackdown upon my ignorant head?


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
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        • 2620

        "Head of home" is not a phrase. It's "head of house". In the USA, qualifying taxpayers can file as head of household.


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MrMacSinusMonkey

        I had to write down this sentence in Latin after hearing it, and I typed "illae paterfamilias est benignus", which, if I'm not mistaken, would be translated as "her head of the house is kind". It did not mark it as wrong, but the translation given was "That head of the house is kind", which does not apply to the Latin spelling I chose after hearing the phrase. Could this be sorted out?


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
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        • 2620

        No, "illae" is not a genitive form. And like all modifiers, it agrees with the thing, not whose it is.

        The correction algorithm allows one wrong letter per word, and "illae" is one letter off from "ille".

        http://latindictionary.wikidot.com/adjective:suus

        http://latindictionary.wikidot.com/pronoun:ille

        http://latindictionary.wikidot.com/pronoun:illud

        https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/ille#Determiner


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/-Copernicus-

        The Latin sentence here is "Ille paterfamilias ("That head of the house"). Duo must have accepted your "illae" as a typo, but usually it will tell you you have a typo and show you the correct answer with the corrected part underlined. So you may have missed that, or Duo just isn't doing a good job of informing you. Either way, you can see the Latin sentence at the top of this page, which has "Ille."


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Fridjunge

        My Language has "Húsbóndi" which if taken literally translates "The farmer of the house" but means the head family in actuality.


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Speakordie

        This family man is kind ? would it be correct ?


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Danielconcasco

        I don't think family man is a good translation of paterfamilias.


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SteveSwart1

        I've seen this written as pater familias. Is this ok?


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/webgenie

        The audio says illa which doesn't make sense, when it should say ille


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Danielconcasco

        I just listened. The one audio is ille with a long e, the other ille with a short e. Both are distinctly not an a sound.

        Part of learning a new language is learning to hear the new sounds. The e in Latin can often sounds like the English letter A to English speakers.

        (Edited for clarity)


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/teaselcardere

        Since "ille" also means "he," is this translation also correct? "He is a kind paterfamilias."

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