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- "Hello, Stephanus and Marcus."
"Hello, Stephanus and Marcus."
Translation:Salvete, Stephane et Marce.
139 Comments
920
Stephanus is the nominative, used when Stephanus is the subject of the sentence, like if Stephanus is doing some action. Stephanus Marcum videt. -> Stephanus sees Marcus.
Stephane is the vocative and is usually used when Stephanus is being addressed directly. Stephane, Marcum video. -> "(Hey) Stephanus, I see Marcus."
All names are nouns.
All nouns decline.
Therefore, all names decline.
- 920
If the name has a Latin form than it would have the endings change (unless if there are any that are indeclinable [i.e. do not change ending]).
I am not quite sure on what the common practice is when it comes to more modern names. I suspect they would most likely would get Latinised, I have seen that done in marriage records written in Latin (I don't know if all records do that however).
There's the Tips and Notes section you can read before you do the lesson, mirrored here:
https://duome.eu/tips/en/la
I read the tips and didn't understand what it meant until now. I only remebered the part that said Stephanus is Stephanus and Marcus is Marcus.
No, definitely not and for me it's still hard work remembering. I don't remember rules well. I just try to get a feel for it. But, if you get into this it's usual to memorize the noun declensions and verb conjugations.People spend long hours on it. I guess if you spend enough time just using the language, like the way people naturally learn, you will absorb it. But students usually do the memorization thing. There are a lot of free resources online. The nice thing about studying ancient languages is that even very old books have what you need. Good luck!
As explained elsewhere on this page:
All names are nouns.
All nouns decline.
Therefore, all names decline.
Here is a plain-English overview of what the cases are and how they work:
Latin cases, in English
Here are the noun and adjective declension charts:
declensions 1-3
declensions 4&5
Adjectives must agree in gender, number, and case with the nouns they modify, but they have their own declensions. Sometimes you get lucky and the adjective just happens to follow the same declension as the noun, but that is not a guarantee.
For good measure, here are the verb conjugation charts:
1st Conjugation
2nd Conjugation
3rd Conjugation
3rd i-stem Conjugation
4th Conjugation
Latin cases, in English: https://forum.duolingo.com/comment/33822673?comment_id=34261475
declensions 1-3: http://dcc.dickinson.edu/sites/default/files/Case_endings_5_decl_1_4.jpg
declensions 4&5: http://dcc.dickinson.edu/sites/default/files/Case_endings_5_decl_2_5.jpg
1st Conjugation: https://bencrowder.net/images/design/LatinConjugations-1st.png
2nd Conjugation: https://bencrowder.net/images/design/LatinConjugations-2nd.png
3rd Conjugation: https://bencrowder.net/images/design/LatinConjugations-3rd.png
3rd i-stem Conjugation: https://bencrowder.net/images/design/LatinConjugations-3rd-i-stem.png
4th Conjugation: https://bencrowder.net/images/design/LatinConjugations-4th.png
each one it for different jobs:
Stephan"us" = if the subject
Stephan"e" = if possessive
Stephan"o" = if inderect object
stephan"um"= if the direct object
No, that's not quite right. Latin does not have a "possessive", it has a genitive, and for second declension nouns that's -i, not -e. The -e ending is the vocative, meaning you're using their name to call out to them. The direct object is called the accusative, and there's more to it than "indirect object".
Here is a plain-English overview of what the cases are and how they work:
Latin cases, in English
Here are the noun and adjective declension charts:
declensions 1-3
declensions 4&5
Adjectives must agree in gender, number, and case with the nouns they modify, but they have their own declensions. Sometimes you get lucky and the adjective just happens to follow the same declension as the noun, but that is not a guarantee.
For good measure, here are the verb conjugation charts:
1st Conjugation
2nd Conjugation
3rd Conjugation
3rd i-stem Conjugation
4th Conjugation
Both are actually commands. The verb salveō, salvēre, ---, --- means 'to be well.
salvē is a command (be well!, but really equal to hello) to one person. "Salvē, Guitarmatt!"--Hello, Guitarmatt.
salvēte is the command to more than one person. Hence in this to Marcus and Stephanus.
Yeeees. Generally the vocative is equal to the nominative (always in the neuter) but there is an exception for the second declination that ends in -e
This is the first language I've ever seen conjugate names and my mind is blown!
I wrote Marcus instead of Marce, and my answer was wrong. Do I always have to write marce always?
In direct address, yes.
First declension names (i.e. those that end in -a like Corinna or Livia) have vocatives that are identical to the nominatives.
Second declension names (i.e. those that end in -us) have a vocative that ends in -e.
So:
"Davus a California venit" means "Davus comes from California."
But if you were to ask him directly, you'd need to use the vocative:
"Dave, venisne a California?"
Marce is the Vocative Case--direct address.
Estne Marcus? Are you Marcus?
Marce, quis est ille? Marcus, who is that man?
I think "estne Marcus" should be "esne Marcus" in this case (2nd person).
You need the vocative case because that's how you're directly addressing them. The names are not the subject of the sentence.
Yes, it is wrong. When they ask for "X and Y", don't flip it to "Y and X".
i am new to learning languages and am struggling a bit with how the names change in different sentences. can anyone give me a link or explain it to me? appreciating your help and Duo's.
In Latin, all nouns decline (change form) depending on their role in the sentence. We have a vestige of that in English with our pronouns:
I like chocolate. (subject = nominative)
The ball hit him. (direct object = accusative)
Latin has several more cases, including the vocative. We used to have that in English, but it's archaic now: O! Captain, my captain. The vocative is for direct address, the person or people you are talking to.
Here is a plain-English overview of what the cases are and how they work:
Latin cases, in English
Here are the noun and adjective declension charts:
declensions 1-3
declensions 4&5
Adjectives must agree in gender, number, and case with the nouns they modify, but they have their own declensions. Sometimes you get lucky and the adjective just happens to follow the same declension as the noun, but that is not a guarantee.
For good measure, here are the verb conjugation charts:
1st Conjugation
2nd Conjugation
3rd Conjugation
3rd i-stem Conjugation
4th Conjugation
I tried "Salvete, Stephane Marceque", and it was accepted. Is that actually correct?
And is there actually a difference in meaning between "et" and "-que" or is it just a style thing?
- 299
On this question, the question says Stephanos and I got the answer right. But, when Duolingo said I was incorrect, it stated so because I did not spell Stephanos's name correct (i.e. I did not spell it "Stephane").
Stephanus is the nominative case. Since you're addressing him directly, you need the vocative case, which is Stephane.
- 605
Pas de traduction des prénoms !! C'est n'importe quoi. Je m'appelle Hélène et si je vais en Espagne je ne veux pas que l'on m'appelle Elena !!
The English people are using to explain why a proper name is changed makes less sense to me than this latin is. How is Latin the only language Ive ever heard of where my name would change? How would you change Zhong Qui's name? Zhong Qui is Zhong Qui.
All nouns decline.
All names are nouns.
Therefore all names decline.
You might remember Carolus Linnaeus from high school biology classes. He was the father of modern taxonomy. His name was actually Carl Linnaeus, but he Latin-ized it.
Let's say you're friends with a family whose last name is Johnson. Collectively, they are the Johnsons. Did the name really change, or are we just marking the plural?
That's how cases work. Is the name really changing, or are we just marking the vocative, accusative, etc?
Please refer to my other comments on this page where I link to a write-up of Latin cases explained in plain English.
The thing is that native Latin names decline like other nouns. That's a part of learning Latin.
You're right that most foreign names probably wouldn't fit into the declination scheme, so they would just remain the same. But learning how names decline and why is a part of learning Latin.
It's best to either just accept that or, if you don't want to, then pick a less rigorous language to learn. I'm not trying to be difficult. The thing is, you might really enjoy learning French or modern Greek or Spanish or any number of other languages more.
I dunno. Now we tend to use names in their "original" form if we meet someone from another language. But it's edifying to know what names are like in latin. It's just more education. You can always choose to not translate. Translation is difficult if you don't know the other language and there are other considerations. Also, the names used in these lessons are originally Latin (right?) and it's interesting to know how to work with them in Latin.
- 920
Salve for one person. Salvete for more than one person.
Salve, Marce
Salvete, Corinna et Livia
As explained on this page before, salvere is the verb "to be well".
salve is the imperative form for the singular "tu".
salvete is the imperative form for the plural "vos".
- 920
It is explained several times in this discussion.
Salve for one person. Salvete for more than one person.
Salve, Marce
Salvete, Corinna et Livia
The vocative case differs from the nominative only in the masculine singular. So you won't see a change in the feminine or the neuter or in plurals.
It varies from language to language. If you don't see the tips in the mobile app, you'll need to use the website.
- 920
Names are nouns, and (almost all) Latin nouns decline (change based on their use in the sentence).
Here, Stephanus and Marcus, both second declension nouns, are being directly addressed so we use the vocative form of each. Normally the vocative is the same as nominative except with the second declension vocative singular for nouns that end in -us in the nominative.
Please read the other comments on this page where this has been explained a few times already.
:( i should have looked at the rules but i didnt want to, but now i know
How come you'd say " Salve Livia" and " Salve Livia et Corinna" yet you have to change Marcus and Stephanus' names? is it dependant on wheather it's masculin of feminin? thanks!
- 920
Names are nouns and their endings depend on which declension the noun is from. The second declension with a nominative ending in -us is the only one where the ending is different in the vocative, which is used when we are directly addressing someone.
There are also several other explanations on this page if you need further assistance.
Also, it should be Salvete Livia et Corinna since it is being said to multiple people. Salve is only used for one person.
- 920
The names really don't change. Stephanus and Stephane, and Marcus and Marce are two forms of the same name.
What is the difference between salve and salvete? I understand salvete is the response to salve, but they both translate to hello. Why would "Salve Stephane et Marce" be incorrect here?
- 920
Salvete does not need to be a response to salve.
Salve is the singular form (used when talking to one person) and salvete is the plural (used when talking to more than one person). Salvete is used here because the hello is directed at two people, Marcus and Stephanus.
- 920
Please read through discussions, they may have answers to your questions.
Marcus is used if he is the subject of the sentence, the doer of the action.
Marce if he is being talked at directly.
- 920
It is explained several times in this discussion. Please read through the discussion before posting a question.
Salve for one person. Salvete (only one t) for more than one person.
Salve, Marce
Salvete, Corinna et Livia
Why don't you take that up with the Romans? :-)
Seriously, though, one of the biggest impediments to learning languages that I have observed over decades is learners' refusal to accept how things work in foreign languages. If you want to be successful, just accept the fact that not every language does everything the same way. Over time, you'll start to see that there are good reasons why things differ between languages.
Why "Marcus" is wrong in this sentence and in others is good? Why can't I say Marcus but Marce?
- 920
Please read through discussions, they may already have answers to your questions. The reason names like Marcus and Stephanus have an ending change has been addressed several times.
Marcus is used if he is the subject of the sentence, the doer of the action, the nominative case.
Marce if he is being talked at directly, the vocative case. This is what is happening in this sentence, 'hello' is directed at Marcus.
Note that this only occurs for nouns of the second declension in the singular.
- 920
It is explained several times in this discussion. Please read through the discussion before posting a question.
Salve for one person. Salvete for more than one person.
Salve, Marce
Salvete, Corinna et Livia
Why is it sometime Stephane and Marce, and sometimes Stephanus and Marcus? I know it changes if it is the subject, but in this course it doesn't change like that
- 920
Please read through discussions before asking question as they may already have an answer to your question.
When people are being talked to, we use the vocative case, which normally looks the same as the nominative ('subject') case, except for the second declension singular for nouns with a nominative ending in -us.
If a statement or question is directed at someone directly it is put into the vocative.
Salve, Marce! ('Hello, Marcus!')
Ubi es Stephane? ('Where are you Stephanus?')
Quomodo te habes, Stephane? ('How are you doing, Stephanus')
If a statement or question is about someone but not directly said or asked to that person then we just use the nominative (to name who or what we are talking about).
Quomodo se habet Marcus? ('How is Marcus doing?')
Marcus se bene habet ('Marcus is doing well')
Ubi est Stephanus? ('Where is Stephanus?')
Well, I think I will just keep doing my other Latin course, which is much better than this one
It's the imperative of "salvere": Be well. So it's "salve" in the 2nd person singular and "salvete" in the 2nd person plural.
Pretty sure I didn't run across the vocative of either Stephanus or Marcus the first time I did this section, only when I went back to restore it. Since the lesson initially used names like Corinna and Livia where the vocative doesn't change, i didn't know there was a difference until now. Maybe that could be addressed in laying out the lessons.
If a course contributor just happens to wander in here and notice your comment, they might think about it.
Here is a plain-English overview of what the cases are and how they work:
Latin cases, in English
Here are the noun and adjective declension charts:
declensions 1-3
declensions 4&5
Adjectives must agree in gender, number, and case with the nouns they modify, but they have their own declensions. Sometimes you get lucky and the adjective just happens to follow the same declension as the noun, but that is not a guarantee.
For good measure, here are the verb conjugation charts:
1st Conjugation
2nd Conjugation
3rd Conjugation
3rd i-stem Conjugation
4th Conjugation
- 920
salve for when talking to one person (singular imperative). Salve, Marce.
salvete for when taking to more than one person (plural imparative). Salvete, Marce et Livia.
It's actually a verb: salvere, "to be well". And verbs always conjugate to the subject of the sentence, whether the subject is explicitly stated or not.
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salve is 2nd person singular imperative, for greeting exactly one person.
"You! Be well!" -
salvete is 2nd person plural imperative, for greeting more than one person.
"Y'all! Be well!"
- 308
Sometimes you want us to translate Stephanus into Stephane and sometimes not. How do we know?
If he's the subject of the sentence, you need the nominative.
If you're addressing him directly, you need the vocative.
Here is a plain-English overview of what the cases are and how they work:
Latin cases, in English
Here are the noun and adjective declension charts:
declensions 1-3
declensions 4&5
Adjectives must agree in gender, number, and case with the nouns they modify, but they have their own declensions. Sometimes you get lucky and the adjective just happens to follow the same declension as the noun, but that is not a guarantee.
For good measure, here are the verb conjugation charts:
1st Conjugation
2nd Conjugation
3rd Conjugation
3rd i-stem Conjugation
4th Conjugation
Every time I write Marcus, it tells me it is Marce, and every time I write Marce it tells me it is Marcus. These are only names and they shouldn't be the reason why my answers are wrong.
Marcus vs Marce is nominative vs vocative. For more details, please read the other comments on this page.
Part of learning Latin is learning how names decline like nouns. You don't have to do this in most other languages, though, so maybe you want to just think about learning a different language. I'm not trying to be sarcastic here, I mean that as a serious suggestion. Hawaiian, French, German, Spanish. Maybe even Esperanto. One of those might be a better choice for you.
It is confusing, because sometimes you translate the names, and sometimes you don't
- 920
In the English, the names will always be Marcus, Livia, Corinna, and Stephanus. Never change.
In the Latin, they decline like most other nouns in Latin. Here, since Marcus and Stephanus are being addressed directly, we have to change there names into the vocative form.
No. The convention on Duolingo is to never translate names.
Translation of Names
A little convention: we will not accept translations of names as alternatives in this course. Marcus's name is Marcus, not Mark, and Stephanus is not Stephen or Steven.
https://www.duolingo.com/skill/la/Introduction/tips-and-notes
But all names are nouns, and all nouns decline in Latin. Please read the other comments on this page for more details.
Why can't we write salve instead if salvete in this ssntence: Hello, Stephanus and Marcus. I wrote salve instead of salvete but it was wrong.
It's the imperative form of the verb "salvere", which means "be well", and so you need the 2nd person singular "salve" when you're addressing one person and the 2nd person plural "salvete" when you're addressing more than one person.
still confused about what to use between the two "stephane and stepanus" and "marce and marcus"
- 920
If the person is being talked to, directly addressed, then the vocative case is used. This is only different from the nominative with -us 2nd declension nouns.
That is why we use Marce and Stephane here. We are greeting Marcus and Stephanus directly, talking to them.
