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"The parrot wakes up the cook early."

Translation:Psittacus mane coquum excitat.

August 29, 2019

23 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Magister_Smith

"early" is not a great translation for "mane." It should be "in the morning" or "early in the morning."

My Oxford Latin Dictionary doesn't even list just "early" as one of the definitions.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Payson372807

Likewise, that definition is not in William Whitaker's Words nor the New College Dictionary


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PERCE_NEIGE

Nor in the Gaffiot.

  • EDIT: I think it's because it's used with "wake up", in this context, "early" is more common with the meaning "early in the morning", except if you are drunk soldier who sleep in the afternoon after a good binge.

I also think in "morning" there's normally of idea of "early (in the morning):

  • Mane gave in Spanish Manana, from "maneāna" (Vulgar Latin: early), from "mane", morning.

https://www.etymonline.com/word/manana

In French "heure matinale" means early in the morning (litt. morning hour)

  • Edit2: Another user, stated, in a very useful way, that the expression "sero et mane" means both "late and early" and "evening and morning".

So, I have really no more doubts anymore: it's idiomatic in Latin.

Morning is linked to the word early (whatever the time in the day), and Evening is linked to "late".

  • It's even the other way: "sero" is from "serus" meaning something that is late/belated. There's no really a good existing word in English to describe the meaning of "serus" in Latin, but if would be more like "tardif" in French.

Etymology:

  • Serus (belated/late) -> Sero (evening)

I didn't find an adjective relative to "mane" like "serus" is related to "sero", except "maneāna" (early), but they say it's Vulgar Latin, and I don't know how to say it in Classical Latin.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/gunungFR

Complicated by the fact that in English, early can be an adjective (as in the early bird gets the worm) and an adverb as in the DL sentence. Knowing nothing about Latin I consulted my (wholly inadequate) Collins Gem Latin Dictionary and it gives me 4 different adjectives for 4 different contexts for 'early', 3 adverbs for different contexts (including 'mane') and another for the ablative (which is a mystery to me at this stage) meaning 'early in life'.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/2w51S8uZ

I used "in the morning" in my translation of the sentence from Latin to English and duolingo marked me wrong . Then the next task was "Write the word for morning . " which was "mane" . Go figure .


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/kaet
  • 185

And that's why parrot is on the menu today.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/CassandraA100557

Sequel to "The angry cook hits the drunk parrot"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Elin.7-1

A friendly parrot?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PeterGoess.

psittacus non amicus, sed ebrius est. Coquum non excitate!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Magister_Smith

For a negative command you would want to say: “noli (or nolite in the plural) excitare coquum”


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PeterGoess.

noli me tangere! et nolite coquum excitare! Das Verb ist am Schluss the verb is at the end


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Magister_Smith

It can be, to be sure. It need. It be though.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Magister_Smith

And oh man, the German threw me off for a second. I forgot which course I was in!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PeterGoess.

Sursum corda! We are in the latin course! Wir sind im Latein Kurs! Estamos en el curso de latín! Linguas latinas discimus!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/VictorCand402072

I wrote "psittacus excitat mane coquum" and Duolingo says "incorrect solution", but in latin, the words in the sentence do not have any order


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Payson372807

Yes and no, I don't know anything grammatically wrong with your translation, but (in my opinion) you'd be unlikely to find that in real Latin, it's just kinda awkward. It's typical for the verb to go at the end, and (in my experience) the verb and the object like to stay together. These aren't rules, they are just tendencies, its something you just get a feel for the more Latin you read. So while any permutation of those words means the same thing in Latin, not every permutation would actually occur. Furthermore, the more complicated a sentence becomes in Latin the more word order starts to matter. For example, when if you have a sentence with multiple clauses, words that belong to a particular clause will stick together. One last point is it also depends on whether you are reading poetry or prose. In poetry, many of the tendencies that exist in prose just go out the window.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SteveSwart1

Can 'mane' come after 'coquum' and not before?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Magister_Smith

Word order is extremely flexible. It could indeed come after.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mona208606

This sounds like the 'early parrot' is waking the cook... like its describing the parrot, and not the time of the action (waking).

Could someone expound on this a bit?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Payson372807

Mane can't modify Pscitticus, because it's an adverb. Adjectives modify nouns, and adverbs modify verbs and adjectives. For it to be an 'early parrot', it would have to be something like 'psitticus matutinus'.

edit: picked a more appropriate word for early


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Payson372807

I realize that may not have been helpful.

We can recognize mane as an adverb because adverbs almost always end in -e or -iter. (There are probably acceptions, but I can't think of one).

Adjectives will agree with the noun they modify in case, number, and gender (but not declension). Adjectives belong to either the first/second declention (like matutinus (early), laetus (happy), or clarus (bright, clear), or third declension (like fortis (brave), gravis (heavy, grave), or levis (light)). And use the same endings as nouns of the respective declension.

Even if mane were a declined form of an adjective, it would have to be an ablative, which means it can't agree with psitticus.

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