https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KaptianKaos8

Is this a Tree extension?!

Hello all,

So I logged into Duolingo as usual today and have noticed there are some level 0 skills in the French tree.

Is this a tree extension?

If so, thanks Team Duo!

September 4, 2019

17 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/9owls

I checked my french tree now. I also have some new purple skills (level 0) after the Checkpoint 5.

September 4, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SciuroRato

Not so sure it can be called an extension when the tree is actually shorter and some important grammar sections have been removed from the course.

September 4, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Thomas.Heiss

@SciuroRato

Not so sure it can be called an extension

Better call their new A/B test "restructering" for their current content.
Just a different "tree design" while it was not - like Spanish - completely finished.

Their ultimate goal of staff/contractors seems to be to have (only) theme-oriented skills, where NOBODY from their userbase has any clue (given by their "skill names"):

  • a) what they want to formally teach (grammar)
  • b) let you practice by randomly throwing this or that grammar thing or verb tense into it
  • c) to find again a specific (grammar) skill and practice that within a defined spaced repetition (SR) interval

Their current step seems to be logical to me, to continue driving that one-way highway where there is no possibility of a turn or taking the next exit.

I am sure we will see another bunch "tree designs" with new A/B tests from their contractors rolled out in the next years.

In this thread staff (=admins with blue circle) have stated that they want to get to a B1 level:

https://forum.duolingo.com/comment/31573948/New-CEFR-aligned-courses

I still have no idea why CEFR means for staff/contractors to kill formal "grammar skills".

I am more a fan of supporting both sides and offering a mixture to learners depending on choosable FILTER / setting criterias.

September 4, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SciuroRato

Totally agreed. Different people learn in different ways and have different goals and needs. Giving users choice is surely better for everyone.

I too don't understand why CEFR alignment means removing grammar skills from near the end of the course. People who just want to do the new CERF aligned material could just stop before doing the advanced grammar stuff if they wanted.

I'm pretty sure the main purpose of this latest version has been testing new types of questions rather than introducing new content, which is fine, just... don't remove really good stuff that was already there for no reason.

September 4, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jeff_Grundman

Not only new content, but new question structures as well. In the new material there are questions where you just get a handful of French words and are asked to arrange them into a coherent sentence. I find it a bit more challenging than translating from English.

September 4, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RichardWallace0

I have also encountered several of these "Arrange All The Words" exercises even though I'm still on French Tree 12 (741 lessons).

EDIT (5th Sept 2019) - now on updated Tree with 671 lessons!

Within this update the new and colourful exercise additions ("Arrange All The Words" and "Fill In The Blank(s)") can appear on Levels 1-3 (Blue/Green/Red).

September 4, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Shawn943390

How do you guys get updated trees?I am in Tree 12 for the past few months

September 4, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Thomas.Heiss

@Shawn

You are automatically enrolled into them (A/B tests) or not (control group).

September 4, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Roteme2

So basically if I'm stuck at tree 12 that means I'm part of a Duo experiment where there are 3 different French trees categorised by A, B and control group? If so, I guess I'm in the A group

If so, that also means that if I open a new account I could be part of a more advanced course?

September 7, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Thomas.Heiss

@Roteme2

where there are 3 different French trees categorised by A, B and control group?

No, two.
Either A (or B) as experiment and the other as control group.

However there are often multiple experiments.

When I was on French contributor tree 3 (A/B) people were either on the stable tree2 (control), slowly enrolled into the new staff/contractor tree8...some people got switched in 2018 from tree2-> tree8 or tree3->tree8 and suddenly new users were enrolled into tree12 were others were on tree8.

Personally I "skipped" tree8 but I was forced from tree3 (A/B) into tree12 at the end.
I guess it was made stable as others from classrooms were also enrolled into it.

A big mess... :-)

Quote: I could be part of a more advanced course?

French tree12 is currently the latest / longest one.
There are no B1 advanced courses available yet.

However there is a newer (shorter) French A/B tree13 in testing:

https://forum.duolingo.com/comment/33138041

It adds some theme-oriented skills (with new challenges) but removes several other skills.

Actually I think that you do not want THAT tree right now which removes the dedicated Subjunctive and several other verb tense "grammar skills".

Comparison:

My EN->PT tree offers four dedicated Subjunctive skills.
And multiple verb tense skills.
And teaches grammar (prepositions, demonstratives, contractions,...) with several splitted sub grammar 1-n skills: http://www.duome.eu/en/pt

Quote: If so, that also means that if I open a new account

You can try to catch this new French tree13 by using the "private browsing (no activity tracking)" method in a new browser window.

I explained it in the "French trees explained" thread: https://forum.duolingo.com/comment/29069435$comment_id=29810695

As you can see, it is not really required to logout or to first create a new user account without knowing:
If you really get tree13 or not or any other version (hypotetically spoken).

With the above method you can freely catch new A/B tests and play around with it by "testing out" / taking the initial placement test.

September 7, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Roteme2

Great explanation! Thanks!

September 8, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sue.Kelly

I also got a new tree yesterday. I don't know it's name; duome used to say I was on tree 12 but I can't find anything that says its tree 13, I just assume it must be. - I have the new feature where some words need to be rearranged into a sentence - On some of my old circles there's a blue dot indicating that there's new content and I think that is largely to do with rearranging words into sentences - Two days ago I had 702 skills out of 782. Now I have 636 out of 712.

September 5, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Thomas.Heiss

I also got a new tree yesterday. I don't know it's name;

https://forum.duolingo.com/comment/33138041

  • Skills: 142+2
  • Lessons: 599/671+0/6

Two days ago I had 702 skills out of 782. Now I have 636 out of 712.

Crowns, not lessons or skills!!

  • Crowns: 636/712

Your new French tree has 671 lessons (reduced).

September 5, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sparrow626727

My gold owl in French disappeared overnight and I have a large number of zero purple skills now.

September 6, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Thomas.Heiss

@Sparrow626727

My gold owl in French disappeared overnight and I have a large number of zero purple skills now.

There are 4 L0 skills which you need to recomplete to regain your golden owl.

Further there are:

  • L2 crowns: 6 skills with missing lessons (does not affect your owl)
  • L1 crowns: 3 skills with missing lessons (does not affect your owl)

https://www.duome.eu/Sparrow626727/progress

You see your resetted progress much better if you sort "by crowns" (default: by skill strength)

September 6, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/rejsegal

I "received" the new tree a few days ago and lost my golden owl. I have been tracking my word count, I was at 4800 and dropped to 4400. It's a little annoying, but the new skills like Bistro and and Let's Fly are useful for traveling. They're pretty easy and I'm having fun with the fill in the blanks/re-arrange the words. I'll get my Golden Duo back in no time! Ça roule ma poule ;-)

September 6, 2019
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