In my opinion, "Please have a seat" is "Bitte setzen Sie sich" (without the "doch"). The "doch" at the end makes it something like "But please, have a seat".
It's always difficult picking up on doch and mal when translating a German sentence. Remember, "But please, have a seat" could also be "Aber bitte, setzen Sie sich (doch)".
I know full well that "doch" is tough to translate into English (my mother tongue of Swedish uses "dock" in pretty much the same way). Context is key. My point is that if the "doch" here never figures into the English translation whatsoever, it doesn't need to be there. Words like "doch", "mal" and even "noch" and "schon" in some contexts will only be possible to learn when hearing them used by native Germans in CONTEXT, which Duolingo gives none of. We can't possibly guess that "oh, in this case the "doch" was completely meaningless". It's needless confusion.
I couldn't agree more. the "doch" is needless in this sentence which lacks context.
"Bitte setzen Sie sich." sounds as a friendly command to me.
"Bitte setzen sie sich doch." sounds as a friendly invitation to me, a proposal, a request - but never as a command.
I am a German native speaker.
Hope this helps. :-)
I always understood doch as somewhat of the opposite of nevertheless or in spite . Is there such a thing in English?
I like to think of it as similar to the world "though".
Please, have a seat though
I think this might be correct. English and German are brother languages, so I'm thinking that "doch" and "though" evolved from the same original word.
(If you pronounce the "gh" at the end of "though", like they did before England was invaded by the French, they sound very very similar.)
Of course their meanings have probably drifted apart a bit as well.
I like that translation. I sense that the "doch" almost suggests impatience.
Yes, it's not easy to explain. I am a native dutch speaker and we have the same wordt here as"doch": "toch" . It's being used sometimes to imply a little bit of impatience. (come on, sit down, why are you still standing), sometimes also as a friendly invitation to take a seat (please, feel free to sit down). It all depends upon the tone in your voice, the situation and emphasis in the sentence.
I think that it is good that duolingo keeps using words as 'doch'' also when it never can be properly translated in English. Words as 'doch' and ''mal' are used a lot and it's good to talk about it with each other.
But shouldn't they represent the "doch" in some way, because it does affect what's being said yet right now they punish you for trying to include it in a translation, which makes it very confusing (many thanks to the users here doing Duo's job for them).
Eg. in that "please do have a seat" the 'extraneous' "do" is added to reflect a little impatience/exhortation, which reflects what "doch" is doing in the German phrase. Just completely ignoring it may teach people the wrong thing ("you can ignore doch"/"doch doesn't mean anything") - and it's not like the German particle/adverb/etc. system is especially simple or east in the first place, with such words often having a multitude of (sometimes even contradictory) meanings, sometimes only affecting tone and sometimes included just for flair or whatever.
Confusing this schema even further with inconsistent policy when it comes to translations doesn't really help, imho.
(Eg. here after Duo rejected my translation, in which I tried to include a translation of doch, offering instead a translation which just ignores doch, my reaction was "so doch doesn't mean/do anything here?" - which is wrong and the wrong lesson to take, and a learning tool, if anything, should try to stray away from actively misleading people.)
'Please do have a seat' was not accepted, but it's what I would say in polite situations in Britain, where I'm from.
I put sit down then (maybe I need a comma), but it's an equivalent to "But please, sit down" IMO.
marked wrong of course.
The "doch" implies (to me), "Do please sit", or some similar enhancement of the simple "please sit". I'll plead my case with DL.
At the start of World War 1, the Emperor of Austria-Hungary is reported to have remarked "Also doch!" An Austrian friend said he was saying "Therefore let it be!"
Yeah, what is "doch" actually meaning? I saw in German film someone said "Water doch" (if I was not mistaken in listening) and the subs only "wait" or "wait for me", I forgot.
And also heard in a song "doch bei dir ist Endstation"
Sometimes not sure either when I make a sentence, when I should add "doch" or not
Could anyone explain, what is the difference between "bitte setzen Sie sich" and "bitte setzen Sie sich doch" ? Are they absolutely identical or is the doch adding something to the sentence?
"Bitte setzen Sie sich." and "Bitte setzen Sie sich doch." have very similar meanings in German. In any case "doch" does here not express something opposite as in the sentence: "Sie ist materiell arm, doch emotional sehr reich." (Letzteres "doch" ist wohl ein adversatives Konjunktionaladverb: http://www.canoo.net/services/OnlineGrammar/Wort/Adverb/Klasse/Konjunktional.html Bei "Bitte setzen Sie sich doch." geht es aber wohl um ein Abtönungspartikel: http://www.canoo.net/services/OnlineGrammar/Wort/Adverb/Partikel/Modalpartikel.html )
For me the "doch" in "Bitte setzen Sie sich doch." may express some kind of excuse: "Ach, es ist doch nicht nötig, dass Sie hier herumstehen! Hat Ihnen denn noch niemand einen Stuhl angeboten? Bitte setzen Sie sich doch und machen Sie es sich gemütlich." It may also express an affirmation of the offer to sit down. It sounds more polite. "Bitte setzen Sie sich." may be understood as a command, whereas "Bitte setzen Sie sich doch." is a kind proposal, an offer, an invitation.
If you use "doch" it may be that you want to convince someone: "Das ist nicht wahr." is just a statement. But "Das ist doch nicht wahr." is also a request for agreement. The contexts may be: "Das ist nicht wahr. Und ich weiß, dass mir niemand glaubt!" and on the other hand "Das ist doch alles gar nicht wahr! Wenn du dir die Fakten nochmal anschaust, wirst du selbst feststellen, dass es gar nicht wahr sein kann. Es gibt nämlich einen Widerspruch zwischen .... und ...."
Thanks again for a clear answer! Based on your explanation the translation suggested by fuzzy889 "but please, have a seat" is the best translation to "bitte setzen Sie sich doch".
"I have them seated on the seats next to your seat." = "Ich habe sie auf die Plätze neben deinem Platz gesetzt."
"He seated himself." = "Er setzte sich."
"He is seated next to the door." = "Er sitzt neben der Tür."
"Please have seats." = "Bitte setzen Sie sich doch." + "Bitte setzt euch doch." (The former is the formal version using "Sie" instead of "du". Both translations are plural.)
Ob die englischen Sätze ok sind, kann ich nicht beurteilen: Meine Muttersprache ist Deutsch.
Und habe ich überhaupt deine Frage richtig verstanden?
I was suffering from understanding the difference of setzen and sitzen, therefore it was very helpful! Vielen Dank!
I don't know, but it's a long stretch from the literal translation. Idiomatically, it fits.