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  5. "صَديقَتهُ سامْية"

"صَديقَتهُ سامْية"

Translation:his friend Samia

December 10, 2019

44 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/vsandl

Why does it sound like Saadiyaqat oo hoo ?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ShannonSho7

I found a youtube video explaining. The oo after t that Duo never explained is optional. The oo/u facilitates the pronunciation of the two consecutive consonants t and h. Supposedly, you could add any vocalisation (either u, a, or, i). Check out the vid at 3:26mins : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GCsOTt1oSBQ&list=PL0A4EB5D68AF2E67E&index=17&t=0s


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AyyashElmota

im sorry to say that the woman in the video is deadly wrong :) here is the story in short: Arabs today, especially those who teach Arabic in English, do not know Standard Arabic very well. She tried to teach standard Arabic but was deadly wrong. The sound of the last letter depends on the position of the word in the sentence, slang does not have it, so in slang we "silence" everything. And might end up saying "Sadeeqat-hu" or even "Sadeeqat-o" single English "o" instead of the "hu". If you are still picking up Arabic, I suggest you ignore those "u" "a" "i" that change every once in a while. Speak silently first :)

here is a video simplifying those accents to the bare minimum https://youtu.be/nDg3yPSzsEg?t=840


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KatieC993112

I am interested in the use of the word "slang" to refer to the languages spoken in the various Arab countries. Now I don't know Arab culture, and I'd be interested to know whether these "slangs" would be spoken eg to deliver a lecture to students; to discuss a subject (mathematics, philosophy, medicine etc) in a university seminar; at a smart dinner party; in a shop, between educated customers; to discuss politics? Or do they use MSA? I hope a native speaker will answer me.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AyyashElmota

Simply put: we write standard Arabic, we speak slang. The news is also spoken in Standard arabic, highly official meetings, and public announcments, but in a lecture? hardly so. Unless the person chooses to, and some do choose to speak Standard, it is a much prettier language but also harder to keep track of the different endings, so sometimes you will hear standar arabic spoken with silenced endings. If you want to travel to an Arab country, go for slang spoken, if you want to read Arabic literature, Standard is your choice.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KatieC993112

Thank you very much, AyyashElmota. If that is the case, it seems to me incorrect to call the non-standard versions of Arabic "slangs". Slang is a very informal way of speaking, used ,for example, by groups such as jazz musicians, thieves, people in a particular job, etc. It's often a way of excluding those who don't know the particular slang. It's unthinkable for lecturers to deliver their lectures in slang. And if a whole nation speaks it, it can't be slang. It's a dialect, or, probably better, a language, or, in the case of Arabic, the spoken language. To call it slang is demeaning.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KatieC993112

Thank you very much, ShannonSho7. Is it (the u/a/i) really optional? Do real Arabs ever leave it out? And can it really be a or i instead of u? We only hear u in this construction, both in Duolingo and in the video of the very pretty young woman.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ShannonSho7

Well in the video, the woman does say it's optional and that a or i could be used instead. I've also heard on Duolingo, at other instances, a and i, and I have seen native Arabs writing the a and i in comments in such a way that there seems to be a logic behind when you would use the a, i, or u. Haven't figured it out yet. Also, I am pretty such it could be optional in spoken arabic since a lot of the dialects seem to omit the u at the end of 1st person singular verbs, for example!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KatieC993112

Thanks for your thoughtful reply. Very interesting. I think I won't think too hard about it at this early stage, until I'm more familiar with the language. About omitting the u at the end of 1st person singular verbs, I have a feeling that I've read that this isn't the euphony optional thing we were talking about to avoid consonant clusters, but a sort of more relaxed way of talking than MSA would demand. I hope I'll be corrected if I'm wrong.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ShannonSho7

Yes, exact! What you're saying sounds v accurate to me ^^


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Kyogun

Can also mean "His friend IS Samia"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AyyashElmota

yes it can, because "samiah" is a name so it is definite, but in such cases it is more customary to prefix it with "Heya" صديقته هي سامية


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/FaroukZeino

Yes, this should be accepted.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mintchocolate190

Can someone suggest me a good free app to have Arabic keyboard on my phone?

is it possible to get one which can be together with Latin alphabet? because if Latin alphabet suddenly disappeared from my keyboard I would get lost forever XD


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KatieC993112

I've got English, French, Russian and Arabic on my Android phone. You won't get lost forever! I can't quite remember how I got them, but google it, I'm sure it's quite simple. And you just toggle them when you want to change from one to another. It couldn't be simpler.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mintchocolate190

thanks for helping me ✿


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AyyashElmota

Android? simple, just go to settings, search "keyboard" and add language, you would not get lost forever :)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mintchocolate190

thanks (◍•ᴗ•◍)✧*。


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KatieC993112

Yes, good for AyyashElmota, for explaining exactly how simple it is. And now I've added Chinese! I thought that might pose a problem, but it doesn't. Either the Android or the computer. Isn't life good!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mintchocolate190

sorry I have another question :) I just went to add Arabic to my keyboard and I see a lot of options (I think they are the dialects). can you tell me which is the best one to learn for a beginner? which is the most widely understood? here are the options: 1) Algeria, 2) Saudi Arabia, 3) Bahrain, 4) Ciad, 5) Egypt, 6) Gulf, 7) Iraq, 8) Levantine, 9) Libya, 10) Morocco, 11) Mauritania, 12) Oman, 13) Sudan, 14) Tunisia, 15) Yemen. sorry for writing such a long comment ✿ ♡


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AyyashElmota

yes they are dialects but honestly I never experienced any difference between them, I think it's about the dictionary associated which is never good enough anyway, so I guess the most norm would be Saudi Arabia.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mintchocolate190

I saw some apps on the android appstore but I didn't dare to install anything yet lol


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mintchocolate190

@AyyashElmota thanks, I will set the Saudi Arabian dialect. I really needed to start using a keyboard because even if I can read (more or less, not perfectly) I noticed that when I try to remember how to write, many times I can't. so it will be good to have a tool to help me with letters connection :)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KatieC993112

I'm glad you're OK with the Arabic keyboard now, mintchocolate190. But may I ask you, out of interest, which English keyboard is your basic one? Becasue when I added Arabic to mine, I don't rememebr having to choose between dialects. Mind is the Google one. Is yours not?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mintchocolate190

I tried adding Arabic keyboard both to an old phone and to a recent one, both have Android as their OS and I had to choose among all the dialects each time. they have Gboard multilingual keyboard so I can add many languages. so yes it's Google keyboard :)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KatieC993112

Thanks for replying to my stupid remark. I must have forgotten. After all, it was all of seven months ago :)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mintchocolate190

@KatieC993112 don't worry, it wasn't a stupid remark :) just think that I've been using my last phone for a long time without even knowing that I could have added the Arabic keyboard and before I knew how to do it I had to ask you all XD I just didn't know it. sorry for replying so late but I had lost the email in my overcrowded inbox and I just found it right now while tidying it ^^


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KatieC993112

Yes, mintchocolate, isn't reading and writing hard! I find, to my surprise, that I understand better just listening, than reading. And as for writing... A big impediment to writing is that I don't sufficiently distinguish long from short vowels; and emphatic from ordinary consonants, eg ص from س and ط from ت etc. Do you have that problem too?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mintchocolate190

I started studying in July 2020 so for now I'm just a beginner. about writing, I find it really relaxing and it looks like an artistic practice to me. the letter which give me more problems is "Haa", many times I can't recognise it. for other ones I can spot them more easily, like "seen" and "sheen", because of their characteristic ending trait, which make them beautiful in my eyes. I can read simple words, more or less, but I need harakat otherwise I feel lost. but for example right now if I see some short words written without any vowel I can read it, my brain got used yeee =) about listening, I have watched a video on YouTube, a short story, I did it just out of curiosity, and I could follow the speaker most of the times, because I was able to understand where a word ended and another one started. and practice is really useful, I've had some busy days so I didn't practice and I know I need to write. but tomorrow afternoon will be free so I will practice again :) I wish I will become as good as more experienced learners like you (◍•ᴗ•◍)✧*。


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KatieC993112

Ah! I'm rubbish. It seems you can read better than I can. And I started in January, so though I think of myself as a beginner, I'm an old hand compared to you. You must be cleverer than me. Yes, I love the sight of س and ش . I remember, at the beginning, being bowled over by the beauty of the letter combination سوس. Yes, the alphabet abjad is an additional pleasure, isn't? My trouble is that, just as my handwriting in English etc is untidy and ugly, it's the same with Arabic. I don't seem to have an artistic writing hand. Tell me about the short stories, please. And I don't know which letter you mean when you say "Haa". That looks like two letters to me... oh, you mean ح ? Or have I got that wrong? I'm writing Arabic letters because I'm trying to teach myself to touch-type in Arabic.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mintchocolate190

nooo why do you call yourself rubbish? T___T I'm not cleverer, I just had tons of free time in these months so I could fully focus on that. I think I enjoy writing so much because even in latin alphabet I like having nice handwriting. that's why I enjoy it so much. the short story was by the channel Arabic Blooms, when I looked for a short story it was among the first results. when I say letter "Haa" I mean this one " ه " . I like letters combination too :) have you been studying on apps only or did you buy some books too? can you give me some advice? so I can have my path all set and can improve :)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KatieC993112

Hey, thanks for telling me about Arabic Blooms! I look forward to investigating them. You are lucky, being able to write properly. Every since childhood, my writing has been a scrawl. I think it's genetic - one brother is like that, and the other writes beautifully, like my father. Never mind, if I type, it'll be beautiful. But what's the problem with ? I have an insane problem with reading: I 'm bad at distinguishing dots above from dots below, so I muddle ن with ب , and ت with ي, not in final position of course, but anywheer else. It feels like being 5 years old! I'm afraid I haven't been following any books - I started the BBC course for beginners, but I've lost it. But the marvellous thing about Duolingo, is that you need no willpower, it manipulates you into learning. And I love that. Lazy nature!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sue982688

I have noticed that the 'emphatic' consonants change the quality of the following vowel. Sometimes for me it is easier to recognize the difference in the س and ص by paying attention to the vowels.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KatieC993112

Yes, Sue982688! And there's a similar thing in Russian. Russian "emphatic" consonants (called "hard" consonants" aren't as extreme as in Arabic, and another difference is that this hard/soft dichotomy applies to every consonant, not just a chosen handful as in Arabic. And in Russian, it's the following vowel that indicates whether the consonant is pronounced hard or soft. But the principle is the same. With some exceptions.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mintchocolate190

@KatieC993112 same here. many times when I try to read faster than usual I easily make the same kind of mistakes, especially when those dots are in the middle of the word. I read ي as it was ت or ب as it was ن and other nice things XD letters in final positions are the easiest to spot I think, as the form they have is meant to be recognised as the end of a word, they stand out a lot comparing to the middle forms. what do you mean by saying you lost the BBC course? was it too confusing? and yes, Duolingo gets you into learning a lot. that's the nicest thing of apps, they can't be complete because they are not books, but as they have a simple structure and a colorful appearance they get you into practicing :)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KatieC993112

Oh good, I thought I must be the only one to confuse above and below. But no, hahaha, the BBC course was not too confusing. I meant it literally. I am so untidy, that the BBC book is lost among all my books and papers. Luckily the library had an amnesty because of The Virus, but I'll have to find it in the end. Incidentally, in the little time I had to read the BBC book, I noticed that it agrees with Duolingo about -ak and -ik endings (as opposed too -uka and -uki) for masculine and feminine respectively. My impression is that it's only purists who say that's wrong; I think it's probably used in the spoken language. I suppose you must live in America, as you spell practising as practicing?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mintchocolate190

I'm not American, I'm from Europe. I'm Italian :) I know there are some differences between British and American English, like in "summarise/ summarize" and "colour/color" or "lifter/ elevator" but I didn't notice it about the verb "to practise". I think it's because the most part of the English sources I have, pages and channels, are written or created by American people so I ended up learning it that way. thanks for making me notice ^^ now I will remember it. oooh Arabic books from the library? good. I have to check in some libraries here :)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KatieC993112

Wow, your English is good. Yes, library - good. Losing the book - not so good. In UK English, "practise" is the verb, and "practice", the noun. Also, it may have been a mistype, but the UK for elevator is "lift". Aren't the emphatic consonants eg ص , difficult to pronounce!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mintchocolate190

thanks, I like English a lot. and I attended languages high school :) thanks I will remember that, I always write those words wrong. I thought it was "lifter" but it's because I never use that word. the wrong logic behind my mistake was "it's an object which takes people to other floors so it must have -er suffix" :D because when I hear "lift" I always think about a verb. I didn't know they were called empathic consonants, yes it's difficult to pronounce. sorry for replying late but I had busy week and too many things to do so I didn't even practise this week. you have new follower on Duolingo hhh (◍•ᴗ•◍)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KatieC993112

You have a new follower too. And I don't think it was "wrong logic" on your part. "Lifter" makes good sense, but language is often illogical, isn't it! I only learned that those consonants are called emphatic from linguistic texts. I've come across Arab speakers who'd never heard the term. I wonder what word they use, if they want to group ط ظ etc... And it was good to hear from you again.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KatieC993112

Hello again, Mintchocolate! It's been a long time. And I've only just now got round to looking at Arabic Blooms, and I'm ashamed to say that I find it too difficult, this easy video with cartoon characters! Do you know the one about the duck who was persuaded to work (make clothes with a sewing machine) and was happy because then he could buy food to eat? Surely that's not the first story? It had far too many new words for me, and I've been studying with Duolingo for just over a year now! If this duck story isn't the very first story, could you guide me to find which is?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KatieC993112

Incidentally, I thought it was excellent of you to tell me that you were following me (and I reciprocated). I do that too if i decide to follow someone. I find it quite disconcerting to learn I have a new follower when I haven't the faintest idea who it is and why they're following me. There should be an etiquette about this.

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