Duolingo community is less friendly than I was expecting (cue the inevitable dislikes as usual)
When starting a language I wrongly expected that the type of people to want to learn a language are also probably the type to encourage others as learning a language is to essentially open up to new and different people.
Being an extrovert I was hoping that the community would be a big part of my energy to help me carry on my Duolingo efforts on learning Portuguese for my Brazilian wife and new son. Every time though it receives loads of dislikes in minutes and sarcastic smart-arse comments from people who are learning their 15th language and I just delete the effort.
I came, I tried, I failed, and I'm leaving surprised and disappointed. I wont bother clicking on discussion again.
(Update: I am overwhelmed by the comments and I have had my faith in the community restored. I will do my best to be a positive influence on the forum instead of the sulky deleter I was before, and to become fluent in not just Portuguese but the culture of the forum - Thank you so much)
Thanks so much for your reply. I am coming to the conclusion that the forum is a little like a new language to learn. There are ways in which to get the most out of it and enjoy it and I just have to learn those rules. I have been so chuffed with the community'e response to this. Thanks for your kind support.
There are many people, that legitimately SPAM. There are many people, that look a Titles and vote Legitimate posts down. There are people who are ..... well you can report abuse.
Best anybody can do is have a Title that makes it clear you are asking an Educational question, and you post it on the right board.
But this board is not designed for causal chat. May want to look on Facebook.
In some ways the forum is like the student union or whatever equivalent you may have in your respective countries...it is place to take a break from the studying, grab a drink, shoot some pool, relax and hang with fellow students, without leaving the university/site. Then you can go back and study some more.
It doesn't have to be a hostile place for having a little learning-adjacent fun, in order for it to be a learning space.
But having negative interactions certainly affect the actual learning mood, so why can't we all just live and let live, and not be such nitpickers or police others unnecessarily.
No, it does not have to be hostile. There is a minority who seem to consider anything that is not somehow related or ascribed to themselves as being of no substance. They would like to be prominent in every single post, for whatever reason, and they become disparaging and hostile when they are not the centre of attention.
A bit like children. ;)
In my opinion, the most insidious behaviour on this site comes from one regular poster, who I shall not name as I intend to stay on this otherwise excellent site for a long time, and to call them out personally is against the rules.
They are certainly adult. They encourage bad feeling among users, playing the whole community off against itself in what seems to be a very calculating manner, but they are careful to stay technically within the rules. They use a combination of selective flattery and targeted mockery to get people on their side, whilst portraying themselves as direct and honest.
The absolutely baffling thing is their level of support. They have gathered a small army of mesmerized fans, and some long-term, respected users seem to fall over themselves to appease this person.
They have regularly stated their contempt for the general population here, and that they intend to move on soon. I hope that happens soon. I have banned my younger, more impressionable charges from the forum while they remain.
Rant over. At least I feel better now.
Wow clearly this comment is striking a deep chord...Being fairly new, I am of course clueless to the identity of the particular poster you are referring to...
Only that there seems to be vein of unnecessary and very subtle putdowns...one I encountered particularly from a seemingly pompous & full on bloated person...May be the temptation to become a fascist authoritarian is a secret dream of some and they try to achieve it in any environment that allows for it.
hopefully as you say, they leave and we are left with our delight in learning and cultural exchange.
Hi, you posted some good comments and studying a new language must be time consuming for you with a family and a baby. Congratulations on your new son, I am amazed with all forms of media at how there are people who only want to insult others. I like you, thought that people wanting to learn a new language might have some common threads but like the old saying, "the best you can ever expect is 80% with you and 20% will always be against you". This seems to apply no matter how genuine and nice a person is. Please don't think all the duo community is nasty, I have been learning for over a year and I have only posted three of four times on here. Remember, comments can't hurt you, rude people only damage their own soul, they can't damage yours. I am an extrovert too and Iove positive healthy discussions. I don't understand why people are so nasty to people they don't even know. It is a form of bullying by people who probably would not be game to say these things to your face. Don't give up because of nasty people, there are too many good people also studying here who will value your input.
This is not surprising. When I first arrived on the forums a few years ago it was a much pleasanter place. Then things began to go down hill. I notice an ever present obsession with telling people to "search" and "downvote spam" and any "repeat questions" are "spam" and must be "Downvoted" And now I ask you, all of us old members since when did we become so obsessed with this stuff. Why can't we just be fine with answering repeat questions, and being helpful. Since when did the forum become a place for snarky comments and stern lectures. I have noticed this for a long time and something needs to be done. Ps I, WinterSoldier. will be changing my username soon so just remember its me.
@WinterSoldier. My suggestions to use Search only happen when the OP has not received an answer. I do Search and give what help I can and always say, "try Search until someone more able can respond". With the advent of mass spam and rudeness, it is perhaps necessary on occasions to take a firmer stance and offer some sort of guidance. The forum has vastly changed, one has to change with it. The good old days are gone.
@Linda, let me clarify. I am not anti search. But what I am is anti rude, anti obsession anti extreme anti mean. We need to be more tolerant of people. Some new people might come and ask an innocent question. Then they are showered with downvotes and "Use the search button" comments. How would you feel? Hurt, deflated, probably a little sad. Yes I know. Search is a wonderful feature but it has become something of a menace to the forums in that people tend to obsess about it
I agree that time in the forums can be counterproductive. But do please be aware that you can get links to VERY valuable resources from the discussion forums. Do a search for "Portugese Learning Resources". Duo forums introduced me to a ton of great resources for learning Spanish that I would not have been aware of otherwise.
Thanks so much to everyone who has contributed here. It seems that I was maybe not letting my posts reach the true audience of Duolingo. I was so sad that my posts were being poorly received that I would delete them in embarrassment and disappointment. I will take the advice of everyone here, which is to still think about what I am posting, as we can't just start random conversations on the forum as this is not quite Twitter, but also not be afraid to start a community chat about stories, tips, funny comments despite a strange wave of down-votes and comments at the start of some posts. The good thing is that this thread has highlighted I wasn't the only one who felt this way and hopefully it's achieved a decent discussion on the culture of the forum.
Thanks again, my faith has been restored.
I am not going to downvote you on your newly restored faith. But I am a little bit disappointed in one thing. Did you really need a crowd to get your enthusiasm up, after so little time here? I remember (or better yet, I don't remember) the first month of duolingo and the first wave of obsession. I certainly don't remember sleeping much or talking to anybody here much, or generally talking to anybody. The only thing I could think of was how much time I am going to spend doing my course the next day. And it didn't wear off for weeks.
Anyway, you definitely caused some catharsis here and that's good.
Not to make too fine a point, but with a baby, I'd imagine every minute is precious, so I doubt that his concept of how much time he can spend on this is the same as someone who doesn't have a young child... at least that is what i remember the early years with my kids being like...
I couldn't agree more! by my observations I've noticed that the things that get likes are like "500 day streak" or "I completed my language" there is absolutely nothing wrong with posting about your great accomplishments, and I am not yielding you to stop, because I think its great to share your progress. But I do think its odd how beginners when they ask for help or something of the sort, people always down vote...
I get that everyone has their own opinions, but if someone is sincerely asking a question or saying thank you, I don't think it should be necessary to down vote the post even if it doesn't suit you. now I'm not saying to up vote every post, but it can be very discouraging for beginners to feel more behind then they are and sometimes stupid.
Please help make Duolingo a more supportive learning environment for everyone. Good luck on learning Portuguese, and have a wonderful day :)
I see exactly where you are coming from.
When I go on the Duolingo forum opposed to other sites, I feel like I have to really choose my words wisely to get my point across. I often hesitate greatly before posting. I do know the drill of the guidelines and such, but I often think "Is this really a good post? Or will I be bombarded by downvotes?" Nevertheless, I haven't experienced being downvoted so heavily, except perhaps in my earliest posts when I didn't know about such guidelines. But I'm getting off topic. I agree that there are some discouraging, snarky, and plain rude people here. I do think there are some people who are very, very strict when it comes to posts. I hope that you can keep going in your language learning. I hope someday these situations can be changed. Have a nice day :D
I'm in a blitz of down votes right now. I started a reasonable thread about timed practice. It's getting reasonable replies. But it is no longer visible in the main feed.
It is also Saturday night. Something tells me the bored trollish persons with little to do are more active around this time....
I remember one of your posts, and it was a good lighthearted post. I think it was only downvoted because it was hijacked by others. I was enjoying that post, and even while I was preparing to comment it was taken over by a regular double-act and then downvoted.
I think they were being downvoted, not you. It happens sometimes, but don't let it put you off the forum forever. Good luck with your Portuguese.
Noticing a wrongdoing is one thing. Sticking up for it is another. And you did that! Awesome! But lots of people can be very rude online and take advantage of that. Don't take it personally. Now, those people are probably trying to get this topic as far down as it goes, but are failing to do so. Ignore what they're doing. If you can't, notify someone so something can be changed. (You can always block people too.)
There seems to be much more down voting recently. I think Duolingo's discussion pages should be positive and welcoming. I down vote only when someone has been negative. We all can give an up or a down vote. If I see a well intentioned comment getting down votes, I give my up vote.
The value that the post contributes to the overall forum is important. High value is a good question, insightful comment, or even something especially entertaining, funny or interesting (if it is relevant to language learning or DL). Low value is a vapid “hi” comment or a simple question where the answer is already easily available with a quick google search. Announcing a streak or the like tends to fall at the low end I think.
I put up a couple of nice posts when I first came on and got down voted. Couldn't understand it as, like you, I thought people would be supportive of one another for good "topics". I just decided to just comment on other posts that were put up and that helped a lot! However, I recently found a couple new languages that I wanted to learn and so I made post of them and was pleasantly surprised how many were interested in the languages. :) I thought for sure I would get down voted for the "difficulty" of the languages not to mention "obscurity", however, quite the opposite and I was happy to know that others found these languages just as interesting. :) It just depends who you have see the post. Some will just down vote to down vote, but then again, some very well may be interested in what you have to share. Don't be discouraged. There are just some that are nasty but there are plenty of good people too! :) You'll see. :) Hang in there and good luck on learning Portuguese! :)
“No fear! No distractions! The ability to let that which does not matter truly slide!” Own this my friend and you will remember why you came here in the first place. Let your family be your encouragement as well as your energy, hone in on this and peace will be your counterpart. Godspeed EuSouPai and as another soul once said "A different language is a different vision of life ".
Hm, that is not my overall experience. And I have posted to the majority of language course forums in the past years. I am not trying to be friendly or rude, rather neutral and focus on the merit of posted questions. Maybe you were just unlucky. Of course, trolls are everywhere, but in comparison to other webs, DuoLingo is quite clean. I would really like if you didn't give up DuoLingo, yet.
Yeah, that's happened to me too. I've tried to do posts a ton, and usually, i'm the only one who upvotes my post. I'm sorry for you. there was this one guy who replied to one of my posts, which was about me being upset that I had accidentally deleted my main course and I had to start over at level 1. He replied: "Did you ask anything be before you did this.
People would have told you the placement test only unlocks to crown 1
You need to test out on individual skills to get to higher crowns" The kind of gist I got from this was, "You are so dumb that you didn't know what everyone in Duolingo should." It was just really upsetting.
There may be mean people, but there are nice ones, too, if that helps. You learn mainly for yourself with your goals in mind, and while some have nothing better to do, others are more are more than willing to help you. I hope I didn't come across as preachy, I just wanted to write a positive comment.
Hello there, it's nice that you're learning Portuguese for your wife and son! Just filter out those comments and people, step through them. Focus on the language you study and the comments that give you feedback. As the internet gained popularity and a lot of different people stalks on these sites we have to strengthen our defenses against them. Don't give up just because they are trying to disorientate you. There are still a couple of language learners who try to help each other. Be determined and consistent.
I completely agree with you! I came on here completely new to languages to learn Spanish (I've experimented and tried others but Spanish is the language I am actually learning). I had a bad experience learning French at school where I was not encouraged and my entire family only speaks English, so even attempting a language was a big deal for me. There are a lot of really supportive and friendly people part of this online community, but much like you, I have experienced a lot of negativity.
A few of my posts have gotten just a load of downvotes within minutes which led to me just deleting them. I understand this if someone was trolling or discussing something other than languages or Duo, but my posts were not. I either had a question about the app or a language or language family/similarities and differences etc. So I do not understand why I was downvoted and to be honest, it has actually prevented me from posting any thoughtful languages observations or questions as I don't want the unnecessary negative backlash. I have also had a lot of people hit back at me making out I know nothing about languages and that Duo won't take me to fluency. I am already completely aware of that and have grammar books and plans for when I finish the tree. But right now I am at the stage I am at. Looks like a lot have agreed with you - perhaps this will put an end to some of the negative and unsupportive downvotes/comments on here! There are some lovely people too.
This is a wonderful comment, and one I feel I can relate to, so thank you for your reply. You seem to be doing fantastically on your journey and I completely agree that Duolingo is a fantastic part of that journey but not all of it. I have just started on Brazilian cartoons to support my Duolingo learning :)
Hi. Why not post and tell us about your learning. Also why not leave out the negative comment in your title which is a magnet for downvotes and does not help your cause. Most of us here are kind, humour varies from culture to culture and sometimes comes across as unkind, so it's best to stay positive and ignore what might upset you. (Edit: Incidentally, if I took notice of all the dvs and threats I've received along the way, I would have crept away a long time ago. Learn to ignore and move on). Looking forward to an upbeat post, we have sunshine for the first time in days, Duo is a good place to be, so it's not all bad. Enjoy your learning :-)
You don't seem to have read his post closely. His point is that he has indeed been posting about his learning. His negative comment in brackets expresses his feelings of frustration at receiving unkind comments about his learning.
It's legitimate to call out bad behaviour and to express disappointment about it.
You advise him to stay positive, to ignore and move on like you do. Not everyone can be like you. You imply weakness when you refer to creeping away. That's not encouraging.
You say that you're looking forward to an upbeat post from him. How authoritarian. Maybe you should learn to accept people's feelings and not scold when you feel they fall short of your standards.
I don't think that you meant to be unkind, but from where I'm looking, your attitude is superior.
First time I posted Linda and a moderator friend of hers bullied the hell out of me. She is so condescending but every time I would post anything or ask how to report it my comment would get deleted. Every single time I post something or a newcomer posts something she pops up and condescendingly (she thinks she words things cleverly) tells them what to do. Or tells someone to delete a post that she herself has posted in the past. She needs to stop, her apologist longtime friends who come to her aid are not doing anything good for those whod like to make this forum a safe space for them also.
Just a little reminder to everyone that it can be a little difficult to not get upset even if you know it was meant to be funny. In a very clever post recently, some of the humor was a little bit sharp and pointed. I try to not let it bother me, but I keep thinking about it and of course it's fueled by my own insecurities. Still, I doubt this person intended to be unkind and may be just slightly insensitive.
Community is a big part of language learning, you just need to find the right one! Spammers are definitely big contributor to the down votes. I have found a group at my local library that practices Spanish once a week, with a native Spanish speaker coming as well, helping tell us what we're doing wrong. Maybe check your local library. If you want something online, someone else recommended Facebook, which sounds like a great idea!
Nice helpful ideas! But rather than Facebook, I'd recommend conversationexchange.com. That's partly because I don't like facebook, but also because I used conversationexchange a while ago and it was great. You can be as anonymous and careful as you wish when using it, and you can use its own messaging system.
That's a great suggestion. I should put a little more effort into finding communities, and again it's more the surprise of how unsuccessful I was in interacting with other like minded people that got me so frustrated, this posts has resolved that :) Thanks for taking the time to reply.
A lot of people will quietly downvote everything they see from someone who says something that they dislike, but that's just the internet, and more broadly the way people are, in general.
Just today I've posted something in one of the discussions in the Latin course, and someone has apparently decided that it's such an affront to their person that they've sought out other comments of mine and downvoted them, too. Doesn't matter. Keep learning the language, keep asking questions, keep chiming in if you have something to share, participate in anything in the forum that you're interested in. Don't worry about people being rude.
The forums are broken. A working system would regulate users behavior, not be dependent on it.
I left a comment on one of your posts. While I expressed a point of view opposite to yours, I didn't say anything negative about you or about your post (which I also upvoted).
I understand exactly how you feel due to your posts getting taken down. It's a stupid system that gets worse over time.
One way the system does not work is that it causes reposts instead of preventing them. It's better to have one silly discussion over cartoon characters, than to hide it and get three new ones every freaking day. Same with all the inane questions.
Another way the system is counterproductive is that it builds resentment. Today I downvote your question, tomorrow you are still angry and you downvote my idea. And it grows over time.
Thanks! I guess I just expected something different. There's no right or wrong I guess, I just thought the best thing about something like this would hearing the success stories and sharing different cultures and questions, and encouraging others. I find Twitter an easier forum to interact on lol It's just not for me, and my personalty I suppose.
I can think of four people whose spam and downvoting is needlessly tolerated - while interesting posts sink as a result of their behaviour..
The forum is a place where people have the right to be protected.
Sadly it seems this issue will never be addressed - by those "watching" the forum from above.
If anything, it just further encourages this tiny minority, who are allowed to run rampant.
I am so sorry the meanness has affected your time here.
I'd love to tell you to stay - but only you can make that decision.
I can only wish you the very best and know that everyone here has only the warmest wishes for you in their hearts.
I've done Duolingo off and on for years. The number of reposts on the same topic is the same as it's always been. Even before they "hid" posts after so many downvotes, there were multiple posts on the same topic many times a day, every day. So, I doubt that no longer hiding posts that are downvoted would make it any better.
Well, rather than leaving, try ignoring the forums and putting all of your energy into the lessons.
I was hoping that the community would be a big part of my energy to help me carry on my Duolingo efforts
People can't learn the language for you, so use all your effort simply to learn the language, not to post on the forums.
"Try ignoring the forums..." this is excellent advice. I know several people who have left Duo because of how they were treated in the forum. While I understand they felt hurt, it still seems like a poor reason to give up on using Duo. The solution is so simple: avoid the forum and use the time one would spend here speaking with native speakers instead. After all, if one needs to be cheered on by strangers to stay motivated, one probably won't be very successful regardless.
"After all, if one needs to be cheered on by strangers to stay motivated, one probably won't be very successful regardless."
NovemberVee, I agree that one can use Duo without spending a lot of time in the forums. However, learning a language is HARD, and people always need some actual HELP with it, practical and emotional. Without this forums recommendations to other websites and youtube instruction series I feel my learning here would have been a lot more frustrating and less successful.
The downside to the forum -- and the reason to limit time on it -- is comments like the above. Suggesting that anyone who needs help and encouragement is a weakling who would never learn a language anyway, is a comment that is sadly made very often here. But it is blatantly untrue, as I am sure you and the other who make this kind of comment already know perfectly well. If there is any field of endeavor where success or failure can depend on how much encouragement a person gets, then language learning is probably it. The forums are full of people who have failed to learn a language through other less encouraging methods, but found success with Duolingo. If you want to look down on people who lack the grit and determination to learn a language all on their own without help, best not to do it from a website that constantly cheers you on with encouraging owls, streaks, and shiny lingots.
I don’t come to the forum much, but from what I can tell, nearly everyone agrees with you that this is a serious issue. Reading through the replies, I can also make guesses at a few of the people you described (the ones who immediately became defensive once you posted this).
Not being funny but are you sure you read that one right?
I just read it now and I got the impression the poster was only saying that not getting involved was sadly sometimes the only option due to the very elements you, I and others have noticed. I didn't see it as inappropriate at all. I could be reading it wrong myself of course.
You have the best reasons in the world to learn Portuguese, so you will stay here and be happier than people who are nasty. You will be enjoying your life in the light with all the good people, and they will be looking for yet another place to lurk in the dark and throw badness. Best wishes to you!
yeah, i remember this racist person trying to start an argument with me about ugly accents. I really wasn't expecting Duolingo to have such rude people around, I assumed those voluntarily learning new languages would've been the least ignorant when it comes to things like that. It's strange
Good post EuSouPai. My thoughts are that there exists roughly the same number of sarcastic, negative people wherever you go, whichever site you are involved in. I absolutely ignore the naysayers and take motivation from, what seems at times like, the ' silent majority' of good, decent folks who are truly coming from a good place. I do believe social media has in some ways made it seem worse due to the ease and anonymity provided. Don't stop engaging! The small bits of encouragement or just seek g others are having similar thoughts or struggles does help; ignore the idiots and best of luck to you, your journey and family!!
Excellent advice, jcupp. Adding to that, one other consideration is that as human beings we tend to take for granted the people who are on the same page as us, while focusing on the criticism of the few.
The other day I subbed as a choral director and there were 18 singers in the room who appreciated my efforts. There was one however who never smiled, on the contrary seemed to frown at me the whole time. Instead of appreciating the 18, I am obsessed to know the reason the one seemed unhappy. And if I don't sub again, that would be one of the reasons.
Can you think of any examples in your life where you took for granted positive reactions, while focusing obsessively on a negative one?
the one who never smiled to you was probably an angry person, jealous of what you did. I never focus on negative reactions because I've noticed that some people really don't appreciate my character (I am too frank) so I just ignore them, it makes them even more angry and that's really funny:D
I'm sorry to hear about your experience. I don't spend much time in the forums, but the few times I've posted, I've noticed an abundance of no-reason down votes. It turns out that anywhere there's internet, there are trolls. An unfortunate fact of life. But there are plenty of positive people too as you're now starting to see. I for one, hope you continue to use Duolingo to help you learn. Don't let the trolls run you off. P.S. I'm sure you'll find that if you look a little deeper, that those people learning their 15th language haven't learned a 2nd and probably struggle to master their own. They're likely the type that stick around for the gamified aspects, not really caring about the actual language learning.
I've only been here a bit over a week so I haven't had any nasty comments as of yet. However, hearing this I'm actually very frustrated that the community is filled with such toxic people. Learn whatever language you want dude, some people are just too stuck up for their own good. Besides, how is anyone supposed to actually LEARN 15 languages from a website. That's just ridiculous and if you ask me, you've probably learnt more than them.
Hey, I'm sorry you've had a bad time. Myself being an introvert I don't talk on the forum much unless I have something important to say. Though there are several uncompassionate people, there are many encouraging ones here as well. And from your update, I see you have found them. You have my best wishes to your language learning! Just keep doing, it everybody learns at different speeds. Some people can master 15 languages in no time flat. Others may take years to master one, and that doesn't matter. I have17 languages that I want to learn, and am still struggling to learn the first one on the list, but the point is try your best, the fluency and other languages will come in time and dedication. So again, best wishes to you and your language learning!
Don't forget that Duolingo has members of all ages and maturities. They all look the same on line. That "dislike" or "sarcastic comment" may be coming from some teeny-bopper. So when it happens to me, I consider the source, shrug my shoulders and move on.
By the way, I started learning Russian for my Russian wife and my then new son. He's four now and the Russian is coming along. I wish the same for you with Portuguese.
That is a perfect example. Some people can learn 15 languages without even a need for one, and others will go on a long journey to learn one that involves tip and tricks and techniques. Some people lack empathy for the people it doesn't come naturally too. Thanks for taking the time to reply.
Screw the haters! Keep going. Portuguese was the first language I learned on duo lingo. I studied for a year prior to my trip to Brazil. I only spent about 20 to 30 minutes every day on it and Completed the “tree” within 6 months. It was extremely helpful and I was able to communicate with ease with Brazilians from all walks of life. The only disadvantage for me was the pronunciation, which tends to lean towards Spanish. So many people in Brazil asked (sometimes condiscendingly) if I was Argentinian. But you have your wife to help with phonetics.
So, once again I say Screw the haters . It’s not for them you are learning. I encourage you to carry on and not give up because the course will become more enjoyable when u persevere and cross the initial hurdle of starting a foreign language, which may seems intimidating.
I think I am a nice person, but I can't please everyone, and I don't even try. However, if you are a transparent person like I am, we will get along fine!
I love this new adventure I am having with Duolingo. I find it to be so much fun that I have difficulty stopping my studies. I am learning French and have always loved the language but stopped learning it after college as life took over. I am back now with lots of enthusiasm!
I hope to meet people here and make friends too/ Thank you for your post and realize, you don't need proud or arrogant people anyway. Look for the nice ones who encourage you.
Might I suggest that you use the "search" function before creating a new discussion?
A search for "maintain streak" yields almost 3000 results.
People do tend to down vote discussions when they're tired of seeing the same thing rehashed over and over. To you, it's new. To someone who's been a part of the Duolingo community for a few years, it's irritating.
It shouldn't be that way - we were all new once - but it's reality.
Stick around. The forums need more serious language learners.
You make good points, but I do think the 'old-timers' at the very least can be indifferent if not supportive...there is no reason to down vote it...
Part of the attraction of Duolingo is the live forum - and part of the attraction of the forum is that it is live...to engage with people in real time...while there are things that can be solved/addressed by using 'search'...there are others for simply sharing...engaging etc.
I have to agree with the OP - there are some lovely people here, but there are some bad apples as well, who are ruining it with their presumptuousness and arrogance, not to mention the silent down voters.
The search function is useless. It sorts hits with the oldest (least relevant) on top, and gives no option for additional sorting. The least it could do is allow sorting by date and popularity.
The post was in fact quite original, compared to the average drivel we see. It was not taken down due to lack of novelty.
Many posts get downvoted simply because of the downvote brigade in action, and the twisted mentality cultivated by faulty forum mechanics.
Lrtward. Just to confirm the Search function works exceptionally well. I often use it when answering grammar questions. Type in the right words and all is revealed. (Edit: Sasho - I'd rather encourage people to benefit from Search than tell them it's useless, just saying).
Thank you Linda for pointing out how the search function can be helpful. And thank you for being that person who looks to find answers for other users. ❤️
Vie108 has a point, that one of Duolingo's attractions is to engage with people in real time. Since the removal of the Activity Stream I have been suggesting that admin invent some other safe channel to harness the potential social attraction Duolingo could have. Imo, it would greatly benefit them as far as boosting their KPI as well. Idk why they don't make it a priority.
EuSoPai, unfortunately in the world there are deviant people. Downvoters are on the less serious side of the spectrum. Don't let them define you. Sometimes I see perfectly good posts or comments that have been downvoted. I give them my one upvote and some lingots. Then often when I revisit the page I'll see that the tendency has changed and there are upvotes. So either be prepared for a negative initial reaction, or use other channels for social interactions (they say, "If you can't stand the heat, stay out of the kitchen"). Depending on where you live and your availability, Duolingo also hosts regular events where you can meet other language learners -- I have heard great feedback about them. Look for them under the tab "More."
Finally, there are other platforms where you might find a more sympathetic system... Quora, Discord, ConversationExchange.com (for using your language skills), and so on.
I want to thank you for your post, as it has reminded me of Duolingo's need to improve the search function. That's another point I have voiced regularly over the years. When we choose to follow a discussion, that page should be referenced at the top of our followed list. Instead, apparently it is put on the list according to the date the discussion was created. And as Sasho pointed out, there should be filters. Many times I simply use a Google search to find things in the Duolingo forum. That's a pretty good clue that DL's search feature needs improvement!
I'm sorry that you are having a bad time. Also, I would have liked to have seen "Share how Duolingo has improved your life." Even if some posts get downvoted, those of us who do like it can follow the post and will continue to be able to see it if you don't delete it.
I've been doing Duolingo off and on for a few years and it's helped me a lot. If you stick around long ago, you will find some nice people, but of course like anywhere, you will run into some that aren't so nice. I try to ignore those people.
If you have any such posts which got downvoted and you feel they shouldn't have been, you can post them as "Daily Rescues" in the DailyDuo, and others will either upvote them or explain why they were downvoted.
Many downvoters are spammers who don't bother to read the posts. Their opinion doesn't necessarily reflect the community at large and how people usually are, but it can affect how one perceives it at the receiving end. Sadly, there is little enough that can be done about them, except for reporting them when one pops up (look up "Duolingo report abuse" if you feel the comments you received were out of line with the Duolingo Guidelines - link: https://www.duolingo.com/guidelines ).
Best of luck with Portuguese! :)
Volgav vitsenanieff nivya kevach varatsach.
To locate the "DailyDuo", it can be an idea to earmark this post : https://forum.duolingo.com/comment/33518396
Also/instead, keep an eye on [GUIDE] Weekly Incubator Update WIS (WIU)
This post is sometimes a dayish late in updating the link to the DailyDuo. Though it will get you there.
You can relocate this post by typing in "WIS" , or picking up the weekly [WIS] Weekly Incubator Summary:. The [WIS] Weekly Incubator Summary can also often be found in the "Popular" tab of the discussion boards. Especially if you go direct to the board : https://forum.duolingo.com/topic/1
The [WIS] Weekly Incubator Summary is produced normally approximately every Sunday.
Another thing you might be interested in reading is the pinned post Duolingo Wiki & FAQ (unofficial, but still amazing)
And I do hope you may choose to alter your decision EuSouPai. I have also enjoyed reading your posts.
And I am sad you felt the need to delete them.
Sometimes posts also have a resurgence of up votes over time. Also, if you link to your key posts, it means through time, they are more likely to be found by people who could be interested in them.
To find out how to do that, check out: [GUIDE] Formatting : Jump to other posts (links)
Though I also understand and fully accept that this is your choice, and I support whatever your choice is.
I honestly feel that a person's motivation....well, what I feel is that a person's own motivation should be enough; they shouldn't be dependant on others for motivation. Perhaps I misunderstood your post, but it seemed to say that you'd quit because you couldn't get your motivation from others? If that's what you meant, I disagree; motivation has to come from yourself.
Welcome to the internet.
Be clear about your goals and make the platform work for you accordingly. For instance, I rarely follow anyone outside my target language. Why? For me excessive social networking is a distraction from language learning. But I'm an introvert so YMMV. I find generally to get a positive response here, one should avoid cutesy posts better shared with friends on Twitter, and focus on adding information/value to the subforms of your target language/s .
Wow, this post got a big response! I'm still not sure what the best solution could be regarding downvotes, but I entirely agree with you and others about the sarcastic comments from some quarters.
They serve absolutely no useful purpose whatsoever, and only cause resentment and further bad attitude. Keep smiling. ☺
Does basing your opinion on downvotes make your opinion bias towards negative?
It only takes 5 downvotes to hide a post.
Say there are 100 people on the forums.
95 are indifferent to your post but 5 are trolls or dislike it, if they downvote and your post is hidden.
But that’s 5 negative people vs 95 neutral people. Or 5 vs 900 neutral people, or 100000 neutral people.
Isn’t that like saying a music festival is a bad place because a small group got in a fight over the last deep fried mars.
If 95 people don’t have the time to see the thread because it’s been already tagged by the 5% and ends up hidden, it’s not the fault if the 5%, it’s the downvote system which is a insipid unpragmatic wreck. The system is giving way too much power to a minority. Way too much.
Sadly, it is the mean little fish that make the big waves in the forum. It seems that positive encouragement is frowned upon by those who have nothing better to do than stir up negative feelings. It is best to focus on learning new languages without getting overly involved in gossiping and complaining.
Sometimes the not-so-nice people have the microphone - and sometimes, they're just nice people having bad days. And sometimes, they really are just mean, bitter jerks who have too much time on their hands. Either way, you have an awesome goal, and wonderful people to help you keep your eye on your goal- all the best to you, and i hope you achieve fluency!
You know some of them just do a bunch of lessons and say they know the languages to look like big language titans. You can't be good at everything in the world. Keep going. You can do it. You can be beyond them salty [word I'm not supposed to say] It's all in the mindset. :)
To those who dislike the Search suggestion: this forum has changed beyond recognition, the good old days are long gone. So we have to change with it. Rather than an op waiting hours for an answer or not getting one at all, it is kindly suggested using Search "in the meantime" while waiting for a better response. The search function also teaches us to think for ourselves occasionally instead of posting very simple questions that are repeated on the hour almost every hour. No nastiness is intended, just a better way to get info while waiting. Spend a morning reading the forum and you'll surely appreciate the use of Search.
I'm sorry you had that experience. I've been learning languages in various settings for many years, (I don't have 15 different language badges but I do have a few) and I tend to agree with you. LiveMocha, post-acquisition, was incredible in that regard. The people there were very generous and kind, (though there were bad apples, they were few and far between). It did help that positive interactions were incentivized by the system of "beans" they set up. So a positive online language learning community is possible. However, the forums here are generally underutilized and hard to navigate -- this is after all, primarily, a mobile app.
I truly hope that you continue on learning languages despite your experience here, this is but one website and it's still unpolished in many ways. I will say that websites and apps are convenient, especially if you have a young child/family, but if you can get out to meetups or more formal language learning settings, perhaps whatever is the Portuguese equivalent of Alliançe Française, you'll feel as though you have more support.
Gotta have a sense of humor and remember that this is the internet. If you were in a physical class, it would be a lot different. Ignoring lots of the "mean" stuff will help. Keep in mind that the other person might not have that intent into how you're interpreting the words.
Also, be aware of the Troll. There's a sign, "don't feed". But we feed anyway.
In short I agree with you. I still use Duo but I also found another app called “ Busuu “ it has a great world wide base with great energy. You take a placement test before you start so you don’t have to start at the beginning. The ppl are great and you help each other learn. Really cool.
Stop reaching out to others and just learn your language(s) of choice. You can always dabble in a converstaion as long as you realize trolls are always lurking...just over the next sentence. Bottom line, don't take it seriously, at least I don't, but the I am old fashion.
The general gist of you comment might make sense, but then why have forums in the first place except to reach out to others? I generally agree with your assessment of reality and the strategy of coping per my comment above. However I disagree with the implied nihilism. Just because we have to cope this way doesn't mean we SHOULD have to cope like this.
After much thought I came to the conclusion that this forum on Duolingo's general issue or functional issues is not useful. On the contrary, I believe that it is useful in matters that some phrases are discussed. So I avoid discussing Duolingo issues. But it is essential to keep track of the issues related to the phrases. Although most such issues have already been covered and therefore very little is discussed.
Oh and I agree, but I agree a lot more when it comes to the Dutch forum (my native language). It's just a mess over there imo. There are a lot of children (literally) spamming sh**. I made some post and received 3 downvotes. I don't think I will ever post any message there again! I think that the English forum is still okay, but of course, it's only my own experience.
The Polish community is very helpful. So I do not have the same negative experience. Although some people ask questions about things that you really need to do some research for on the Internet. Those questions are very annoying. Because it expects me to answer your question knowing you didn't check it yourself on the Internet.
I know the feeling, but I have to say that, in my experience, teaching is learning. By which I mean that, if I can't explain something well enough from my own knowledge, but need to look things up to verify what I think I know, by the time I've done that I have a much better understanding of the topic!
That said, when people do things like asking, "what does that word mean?" I generally just give them a link to WordReference and let them look it up themselves. I do think that sometimes people come here with very "schoolish" notions, and think they are somehow "cheating" if they look things up. So I try to give them permission. Learning is learning.
They don't delete them. They are still there but perhaps a bit hidden. I follow posts that I'm interested in right away so that I can continue to see them if they get downvoted for some reason.
I also upvote posts that I'm not necessarily interested in if it seems they've been downvoted unfairly.
The SPAM was truly awful before the downvotes and while it's not ideal, the SPAM was much worse.
It is very discouraging to realize that the trolls are invading the forums and that our sincere positive contributions are relegated to the bottom of the responses. As a result of this, I have become much more selective in offering advice, but I still like to offer encouragement from time to time. Let's not ruin our days by paying too much attention the negativity of others.
I very much know how you feel about the discussion sections. I often force myself not to check the discussion pages because I can't face seeing so many of the same posts equating to people just whining because Duo didn't accept their response. I work at a place where we tutor kids while they work with software similar to Duolingo, and their behaviour when they couldn't get 100% because, according to them, they programme must be bugged for not accepting their answer.
My response is the same to them as it would be here: why does it matter? The point is to learn enough that you can use it in the real world, not to get bragging rights for acing an arbitrary quiz; but as soon as people are told they're wrong, they become angry, especially if they think they're right... and so we have a discussion section that is a cesspool of angry children, annoyed because someone's told them they're not always right.
"they programme must be bugged for not accepting their answer. "
What strange behavior. 99% in my target language subforum people usually have clear reasons why they THINK their answer should be accepted. Sometimes they're right and are encouraged to flag, but most times they are wrong, it is explained, and they accept it with grace and gratitude.
They ONLY time I've seen a knock down drag out fight over who was "right" was between a fluent mod and an expert speaker in the language with a peculiar bias(IMHO the mod was more correct).
But maybe interest in minority language self selects different quirks among learners.
Hahahaha Don't worry about them. Most of them are trolls with no profile pic. They don't have a life and feel better making others bad. Faceless users' opinions don't have any value. It's a shame this website doesn't have any tools to let people communicate other than this forum.Here, I share this cool link for English-speaking learners. It helped me understand Portuguese:https://ielanguages.com/portuguese.html. Don't give up,man!! Duolingo needs more users like you!!!
So what decides whether or not your post is positively or negatively received? I made a post asking what the benefits of learning multiple languages are, saying that I wouldn't fit it worth it to learn languages beyond Spanish if they didn't have any other use beyond cultural value. After all, since I probably won't be travelling abroad any time soon, and if very few people in America speak a given language, I don't know what would make it worth it to spend a few years learning it. And from asking that question, I got a bunch of downvotes. Anyone know why?
Duolingo has been evolving and changing yet some things remain the same. Various and sundry complaints about the forum have persisted for years. Overall, I have found a positive experience on this forum and particularly on the Sentence Discussion in the Vietnamese course. My experience has been if you have a positive attitude the response will be the same.
A 141 year old science magazine, Popular Science, shut down its comment section because of a minority who were flooding every comment with religious, anti-science nonsense. In explaining their decision, I liked their phraseology to say the shutdown was not solely because of "shrill, boorish specimens of the lower internet phyla. Most sites cannot afford to hire hall monitors for forums and Duolingo is no exception. With some moderation and self-policing via voting system, this forum works reasonably well. For comparison, consider the 4chan site. That is what happens when you have no moderation or self policing. But as bad as 4chan is, it has come up with some amusing memes like "rick rolling". Even Duolingo has evolved a meme, the attack owl who visits truant students.
Without wanting to sound disrespectful in any way, if you want something achieved in life people and their comments shouldn't be your priority at all.
Do you think Hannibal stayed in Carthage because Romans didn't like him? He crossed the Alps and invaded Italy with battle armored elephants.