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"We will be in the church on Sunday."

Translation:Bidh sinn anns an eaglais Didòmhnaich.

February 16, 2020

23 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PhilipWhitaker

So there are two words (or phrases) for Sunday? What are the rules on when you use each one?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RubyFisher7

It explained in the "tips" section at the beginning that they can be used interchangeably with each other. Didomhnaich is used more by Catholics and Episcopalians. Latha na Sabaid is used more by Presbyterians. Hope this helped!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DaibhidhR

Please be careful with the accents on this word:

Là na Sàbaid 'Day of the Sabath'
Là na Sabaid 'Day of the Fighting'

which is not quite the same. It is also Didòmhnaich but that does not matter quite as much.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PhilipWhitaker

Is an accepted shortening of Latha, the same way is can be short for agus?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DaibhidhR

Yes. But it is treated as an alternative modern spelling, not an abbreviation.

Edit: see here for discussion of this point and my argument that they should always accept both.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mairtin682362

From the irish for sunday Dé Domhnaigh = Day of the Lord (from the Latin “dominus”: lord) i wonder what name was used prior to Dé Domhnaigh


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DaibhidhR

It is certainly related but Irish and Gaelic are sister languages so I don't think we can say it comes from the Irish. Old Irish maybe, especially as that has the ch not a gh.

The problem with your suggestion is that there is no explanation for the ch/gh. eDIL says it is día domnich and that the domnich is a genitive, so it is 'day of domnach'. Domnach is in the dictionary meaning 'Sunday', but that would mean that Día Domnich meant '*Day of Sunday' which does not make sense.

More plausible to me is that domnich is from Latin dominica, the adjectival form of dominus, as MacBain suggests

Domhnach, Sunday, so Ir., E. Ir. domnach ; from Lat. dominica, " the Lord's."

hence 'of/pertaining to the lord'. From this, día domnich would be dies dominica 'the day of the Lord', 'Sunday'. Now since domnich looks like a genitive with the i in it, and some other days are genuine genitives with i in, such as día lúain, it is easy to see how domnach could be backformed from that, since it looks like the word that domnich would be the genitive of.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/IainFarrel2

Why is "Latha na Sàbach" not accepted here?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/tj4234

Because you've spelt it wrong.

Sàbaid


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DaibhidhR

Yes. The dental sound (sound made with the tongue against the teeth) has always been part of this word. It comes from

Hebrew שַׁבָּת (shabát)

(Modern Israeli Hebrew) [ʃaˈbat]
(Ashkenazi Hebrew) /ʃaˈbɔs/, /ˈʃabɔs/
(Yemenite Hebrew) /ʃæbˈbɔːθ/

The reason for the th in English is a bit obscure but it is the traditional transcription of the Hebrew. It appears from the Wiktionary entry on ת that it is thought (as in not known for certain) that it was a /θ/ 'th' sound in Classical Hebrew.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Joyce80051

I was told that my answer was wrong because I used Latha na Sàbaid instead of Didòmhnaich. That's incorrect; either term will do.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DaibhidhR

You probably made some other wee mistake. Unfortunately when you do that Duolingo is rather arbitrary about which of the various correct answers it gives.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Joyce80051

No, I checked very carefully to be sure there were no other "wee mistakes" as I've been doing Duolingo for a while and know about that, but there were none. And since others seems to have had this problem, i think Duolingo should check on it.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/joannejoanne12

Nope, 'Latha na Sàbaid' will be accepted here :)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AlanNorman

Just realized that Didòmhnaich breaks the broad and slender rule! Is that because it was originally two words?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DaibhidhR

I had not spotted that. You may well be right. Whilst with some words there is some doubt that the modern word comes from the high-register Old Irish that we have recorded, there is little doubt that this explicitly Christian term would come from the sort of Old Irish we have recorded.

eDIL entry for domnach says

Sunday, the Lord's day , [on its own] or with dia, laithe

but most of the examples in that entry are 'on their own'. It comes from domenicus, the Latin for 'Lord', so logically the di would be needed.

Several of the other days of the week also break the spelling rule, such as

Diluain - Monday
Dimàirt - Tuesday
Disathairne - Saturday

Dihaoine - Friday is a bit odd as h is not a normal letter in Gaelic, so maybe it's short for Di na h-aoine 'Day of the fast'.

But there is another possible reason or part-reason: the clue is in the quote from eDIL. The old spelling of di was dia. This is the Latin for 'day', which is presumably the origin of the Irish/Gaelic word. If this were the original spelling, then there would be no problem with the spelling rule.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MargaGuill1

Actually, those days you mention there are Roman in origin. Pre-Christian, shall we say. They have evolved in many romanic languages the +/- same. Lundi/Lunes: day of the moon (luna) Mardi/Martes: day of Mars (Marte) Mercredi/Miércoles: day of Mercury (Mercurio) Jeudi/ Jueves: day of Jupiter Vendredi/Viernes: day of Venus

Sábado sounds more like derived from Sabbath, but it is also referred to as the day of Saturn (Saturday is more similar here)

Interesting, really enjoy etymology and seeing how words evolve in different languages.

I am seeing some words on this course quite similar to the Spanish equivalent, for instance.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DaibhidhR

I agree, but you write as if you are contradicting me although I cannot see the contradiction. I assume the terminology used in the Romance languages and in Gaelic for some days was the system used by Latin-speaking monks, so (I am hypothesising) they used the Latin term dia even if attached to the Roman god name.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MargaGuill1

Not a contradiction. Pointing that the etymology goes beyond early Christian into Roman times.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Doug141405

Then why is this sentence with Latha na Sàbaid getting rejected?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DaibhidhR

Joanne says above that this is accepted, so perhaps you made some other wee mistake?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MikeWalton2

Why cannot I use sinne to stress that WE will be in church on Sunday, (even if YOU are watching the football on telly ?)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DaibhidhR

It is debatable whether you SHOULD assume emphasis when there is none shown and I do not know what their policy is. However, there is an additional problem that I would say is overriding, and that is that if I wanted to emphasise the WE I would move the sinn to the front as well as adding the emphatic suffix

Is sinne a bhios anns an eaglais Didòmhnaich.

It would be less usual to use one form of emphasis without the other. I don't know if this has been covered at this stage in the course.

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