"Ik sta in de krant."

Translation:I am in the newspaper.

4 years ago

71 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/Meaghatron

This section would be less confusing if there could be a Tips & Notes section added

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/patrickmccarron

Literally the most confusing unit, and no notes. It's just frustrating to not understand an entire lesson.

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/SkillsInPills

I'm so glad that I'm not the only person who has no idea what the hell is going on.

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/UnitarioRe

These are Phrasal Verbs, easy to use, the problem is...No one teaches us these verbs!

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Dubhaltach
Dubhaltach
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Definitely, or if some of the words were introduced to us before we're expected to recognise them on audio questions...

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/lewandowsk239676

why did the not use ik ben in de krant

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/tyedye67
tyedye67
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Every lesson in every language shoild have a tips and notes section to make it clearer for everyone.

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/salems24

colors doesn't really need it in my opinion

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/SeptimusBones
SeptimusBones
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Unless there's some wonky conjugations or other such unexpected things.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/olyakorikosha

true! why not every lesson has a tips & notes section added?!?!

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/jamesjiao
jamesjiao
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So how do you express the idea that you are physically wrapped in newspapers?

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PaulineStinson
PaulineStinson
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ik ben ingepakt in kranten (you need that very often, then? ;) )

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/jamesjiao
jamesjiao
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My answer would be inappropriate for this website :P.

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/MarimerP
MarimerP
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Hahaaa

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/kieran_lillis

Why is the word 'sta' used here? Confused

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/johaquila
johaquila
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In Dutch (and German), something that is written in a book or newspaper is not said to 'be' in it (basically only children talk like that until they know better) but to 'stand' in it. Maybe think of the letters as physical objects that stand upright.

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/RubenFGDS
RubenFGDS
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You, Mr/Mrs, deserve a lingot!

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Virmyth
Virmyth
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So this sta is applied to printed or web paragraphs and texts. Dank je wel, mijn goed man.

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/CyrilofAlabama

So would this rule extend to all forms of publication in general (e.g., websites, magazines, billboards, blogs) as noted below?

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/johaquila
johaquila
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It has absolutely nothing to do with whether it's published or not. It's the same for everything that is written, including a private diary. For an appearance on radio or in film, other verbs are used.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/CyrilofAlabama

Ok got it. Anything typed or written, then, regardless of its form. Dank u wel.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/firerosearien
firerosearienPlus
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I am not a native Dutch speaker, but I read it is "I stand in the paper" -> "I have standing in the paper" -> "I am in the paper". It's convoluted to me but it makes sense.

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/johaquila
johaquila
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I am sure it helps in this particular case, but there are many other situations in which there is no such trick. Maybe look for similar idioms in English and then remember that Dutch uses them much more generally and often quasi-obligatorily.

E.g. "Wales lies to the west of England". This sounds much nicer than "Wales is to the west of England". I am sure in many other languages only the second way of saying it is correct. (Of course in Dutch you must say it the first way. By the way, in French they have a third solution: "Wales is situated (or: finds itself) to the west of England.")

I think there is even a case in which English does this and Dutch doesn't: "I stand corrected." I am not sure if there is an exact equivalent in Dutch (there isn't in German); I guess in a pedantic Dutch translation of that phrase you would have to say something like "Ik ben corrigeerd worden" ("I have been corrected").

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Jackel98

I am not a Dutch speaker, but does the end translate to, "I am/have become corrected?"

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/johaquila
johaquila
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Yes, as an overly literal translation this is correct. Dutch forms the passive with worden, which literally translates to become. However, when used in a passive construction, the past participle of worden is worden, whereas in its standard sense it is geworden. (Exactly the same phenomenon occurs in German.) Of course for the proper translation of a passive construction to English you have to use be instead. Example:

  • Ik werd rijk. - I become rich.
  • Ik ben rijk geworden. - I have become rich. ("I am become rich." - This was correct English in Shakespeare's time.)
  • Ik werd corrigeerd. - I am corrected. ("I become corrected.")
  • Ik ben corrigeerd worden. - I have been corrected. ("I am become corrected." But with a variant of the past participle that is only for the passive construction.)

At this point I have already stretched my response beyond all reasonable bounds. Nevertheless I felt like going a bit further...

It's unfortunate that become, the normal English translation of worden, starts with the prefix be- while worden doesn't. This makes it even harder to see what's going on with these variants of the past participle. I'll try anyway:

Germanic languages have traditionally formed the past participle by changing the main vowel and adding the suffix -en (or by just adding the suffix -ed). However, the resulting past participle also had to have a prefix. If the verb didn't already have a prefix anyway, it got a special one reserved for this purpose. You can see this e.g. in the first line of the famous 13th century Middle English rota song:

  • Sumer is icumen in. - Summer has [lit. is] y-come in.

As you can see, the past participle of come in the Wessex dialect of Middle English the song was written in was icumen. The initial i- is the prefix in question. A more standard spelling in Middle English is y-. In Old English it was ge-, and that's also what it still is in Dutch/Afrikaans and in German/Yiddish. So English is the only major West Germanic language that lost the past participle prefix - apparently under the influence of the North Germanic (Nordic) languages, which lost it earlier. (Scots and Frisian are also West Germanic and also lost it, as did most Low German dialects.)

By the way, the prefix y- has survived unchanged on the past participle of a single Modern English verb. I guess this is because the verb clepe is so antiquated that modern speakers can't regularise the past participle yclept because for all they know the verb could be "yclep".

Some modern English dialects have developed a similar phenomenon with the present participle: adding the prefix a-, which apparently started life as the preposition on. Example: "The times, they are a-changing."

In some American English dialects this phenomenon even extends to some past participles. Even better, it appears that in dialects spoken in the south west of Britain y- has survived and been modernised to a-! Therefore, even though ge-/y- has been lost almost without trace in standard English, we can still get a somewhat similar effect by prepending a-:

  • Summer has a-come in.

Just like ge-/y-, the prefix a- (even the modern American one for present participles) is not added to verbs that start with an unstressed prefix, though. But since we are already modernising obsolete grammatical phenomena, let's also modernise our verbs. Get is slowly taking over many of the functions of become, and it doesn't start with a prefix. So let's substitute get for become, but use the non-standard past participle gotten, which in American English seems to be more suitable for the become sense. Now everything is in place for English translations that closely mirror the Dutch grammar:

  • Ik werd rijk. - I get rich.
  • Ik ben rijk geworden. - I am a-gotten rich.
  • Ik werd corrigeerd. - I get corrected.
  • Ik ben corrigeerd worden. - I am gotten corrected.

(Part of this post is based on discussions I found at this source.)

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/johaquila
johaquila
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@Delire6: Yes, it's a pity that Duolingo doesn't offer Dutch for French speakers yet. Unfortunately I have no chance to help with that. My French might not be good enough for that, and my Dutch certainly isn't. It's a very simple language for German native speakers who are also fluent in English, but when I started learning it on Duolingo I hardly understood a word! I can help with some isolated problems, but I do not have a proper feel for the entire language.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Delire6
Delire6
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I'm a frenchspeaking belgian and I wish we had teachers like you at school! Don't you want to be part of the dutch for frenchspeakers DL project? It's still missing ;-)

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Ayisha36

You can also say "I stand rebuked/accused/convicted/condemned." There's a definite trend here.

I don't have any proof of this, but I suspect that all of these phrases come from actual standing in a formal setting like in a court or town hall, where one stands up for sentence to be passed, or, in the case of "I stand corrected," one stands up to take responsibility for a mistake. At the very least it is figuratively standing, (as in "where do you stand [on an issue]?" "taking a stand [for a cause]" "That [evil thing] is not what I stand for" or "stand up [against tyranny]!") I don't think it's a neutral use of stand, like "the lamp stands on the table," because it does not mean "I have been corrected." What it means when you say "I stand corrected," is "I publicly acknowledge that I made a mistake," or "I publicly submit to your judgement/superior knowledge," which is why I suspect it originates from some sort of court situation.

Is there any equivalent to that in Dutch?

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/kieran_lillis

Dank je wel

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/marcin201

as far as I know , dutch people like to describe their location of location of other things very specificly; for instance: ik zit in de bus instead of Ik ben in de bus; or de suiker ligt/staat op de tafel ...whenever you can use some other word instead of "zijn" - "to be" do it ;) I am begining my journey with dutch so I am not 100% sure that above is correct

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/sjudel
sjudel
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You're right! And not only liggen, staan, zitten, also lopen (to walk) is a nice replacement of a form of 'to be'. 'Ik loop te bellen' -> I'm calling, I can say it like that even though I may not be walking at all!

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Erven.R
Erven.R
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So If you are in the newspaper you use stand instead of sit?

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/UnitarioRe

I think, in this kind of case, YOU ARE NOT in the Newspaper, you appear in the Newspaper or something as well

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/mreaderclt
mreaderclt
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So, how would one say "I am in the news?"

Ik sta in het nieuws

Ik ben in het nieuws

Ik zit in het nieuws

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/UnitarioRe

Creo ... Ik sta in, ya que acaba de aparecer, sólo un pic. no físicamente

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/mreaderclt
mreaderclt
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Gracias.

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/UnitarioRe

Why I wrote this in spanish? Well, I hope you understood!

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/mreaderclt
mreaderclt
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No problem. It's good practice.

No hay problema. Es buena práctica.

Geen probleem. Het is goede praktijk. ( with help from Google translate)

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/sjudel
sjudel
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I think you mean: het is een goede oefening :)

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/UnitarioRe

In fact making translation online, I have learned too much!

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Jun-Dai
Jun-Dai
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Unless the fact that krant is not plural is somehow quite significant, it seems to be me that "I am in the papers" would be a good translation.

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Ghostranch

Would it be okay to also say "ik ben in de krant" or is that incorrect? I am finding the prepositions lessons incredibly confusing and agree there should be a Tips & Notes section here. I feel like there has been a massive leap in difficulty level from what has come before and am now feeling rather disillusioned!

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/olyakorikosha

bingo

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Lagiacrus

What does this mean exactly? Is it referring to you being featured in it?

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Citrine
Citrine
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Yes.

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/thelivingmartyr

The use of 'staan' is difficult to understand unless you have already learnt German. Dutch seems to use it in the same way as German uses 'stehen'.

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/UnitarioRe

Stand in - Horen bij - Houden van - Aanraken, All this are Phrasal verbs? Please!, clear my mind

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Godbluff

So, when is it necessary to use 'sta', 'lig' and 'zit' in locating things?

Are there rules for it or do you just have to know which words to use for each object you're positioning. Also, is this a strict rule? Because I don't want to end up sounding ridiculous if I say something like "Ik lig in de wc"

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/johaquila
johaquila
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I don't think it's ever strictly necessary to use the more descriptive verbs if you don't mind sounding like a non-native speaker. You will be understood, and it's not all that jarring to native speakers. Using zijn for everything is certainly better than hilarious mismatches.

On the other hand, when you are confident about the best verb either because you have heard it so often in a specific context or because it's obvious (of course you sit in/on the toilet!), then you certainly shouldn't go out of your way to avoid it.

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Godbluff

Okay, I'll just get it over time by listening to different contexts, thanks.

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Saartjeislief

if you say "ik lig in de wc" you accitialy say= im laying in the toilet. sta would mean: im standing in the toilet. zit means: im sitting on the toilet

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Godbluff

Would that mean that you'd say "Ze zit in de wc" but "Hij staat in de wc"?

I'm just joking. But could this possibly be true?

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PaulineStinson
PaulineStinson
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We'd say: ze/hij zit op de wc (where the wc is the actual toilet) or ze/hij is in de wc (where wc stands for the cubicle). Hij staat in de wc is unusual, but you would say: "Hij staat te plassen" (he is peeing) and "Ze zit te plassen" (she is peeing). If you need the phrase "Ik lig in de wc", you're probably sick/drunk/hurt and lying on the floor of the cubicle... not a good situation to be in.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/HannahHummel1

Am I the only one still confused about how to pronounce "krant"? Do you pronounce the r or not?

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PaulineStinson
PaulineStinson
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Yes, you do.. the pronunciation here is a bit odd. The sound on Google Translate is better https://translate.google.com/#auto/en/krant

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/lewandowsk239676

why did they not use "ik ben in de krant"

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/johaquila
johaquila
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For much the same reason that English speakers say "I stand corrected" rather than "I am corrected". Sometimes - and this depends on the language in question and many other circumstances - it is customary to use a metaphor rather than the most 'logical' word - especially if that most 'logical' word is a very common verb such as be or have. Normally only children and non-native speakers ignore this.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/SeanMeaneyPL
SeanMeaneyPL
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Is this like Latin sto, stare used existentially? Would you revert to been for the copular "I am the man in the newspaper"?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/johaquila
johaquila
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(1) No. (2) Yes.

I think the trick to understanding what's going on is to realise that the same thing actually happens in English as well. Only the demarcation between 'be territory' and 'more specific verb territory' differs between the two languages. Consider the following examples in English:

  1. The headquarter is in Amsterdam.
  2. The town is at the foot of the mountain. The town sits at the foot of the mountain.
  3. He is on the committee. He sits / is sitting on the committee.
  4. I am at my desk. I sit / am sitting at my desk.
  5. I stand before you today to tell you ...

The examples are ordered roughly in order of decreasing acceptability of be and increasing acceptability of sit/stand/lie/....

For 1, a native speaker of English would be very unlikely to say that the headquarter 'sits' in Amsterdam. For 2, you can say it as a conscious figure of speech, but be is definitely the normal choice. For 3, it doesn't really matter whether you use be or the common idiom of 'sitting' on a committee. For 4 you would probably prefer sit as you are physically sitting. For 5 you are very unlikely to use be, nor could you replace it by sit just because you are physically sitting. The idiom used here always comes with stand.

Dutch works much the same way except that the gradual move from be to more specific verbs happens earlier.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/shockandaudrey

I get that it's an idiomatic meaning, but it's weird that the literal translation, "I stand in the newspaper", is not accepted.

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/TobyBartels
TobyBartels
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I did a literal translation just to see Duolingo's reaction, but I don't think that it should be accepted. You just can't say that in English with that meaning.

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/sjudel
sjudel
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Well you're not actually 'standing' in the newspaper; you're only appearing in it.

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/MokeiAkita

The page shows a possible translation of "in" as "into." I translated this sentence as "I am into the newspaper," which I think is a reasonable sentence in English. Yet it was marked wrong. Would my translation modify the sense of the original Dutch sentence?

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/johaquila
johaquila
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Yes, your translation is wrong because it changes the sense. Into is displayed as a possible translation of in because in English you sometimes use into for clarity. In Dutch you can get a similar effect by adding something like naar binnen. But I think that's generally done a bit less often than in English, and therefore just plain Dutch in is sometimes best translated as English into.

However, in this sentence, there is no movement, as the verb clearly indicates. (Literally the meaning is "I am standing in the newspaper.") And there is no movement in your English sentence, either, because it's a special idiomatic meaning that exists only in English in this form: to be into something = to like something (a lot) = van iets houden.

  • Ik sta in de krant. - I am [mentioned] in the newspaper.
  • Ik sta in het huis. - I am in the house.
  • Ik ga in het huis. / Ik ga naar het huis binnen. - I am going into the house.
  • Ik hou van de krant. - I like the newspaper a lot. / I am into the newspaper.
3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/MokeiAkita

Thank you; that is an excellent explanation.

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/jamesjiao
jamesjiao
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Why do you think it's a reasonable sentence in English? In English, if you are 'into' something, then you are describing that you really have a penchant for the said thing, which is very different from 'in the newspaper' as in 'appearing in an article in the newspaper'.

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/MokeiAkita

I it does make sense in English, but it appears to have a very different meaning. This was the basis of my question. "Into" was offered as one of the possible English translations, but it appears that it is not appropriate in this sentence. I made a mistake, and learned something thereby. It was not initially clear to me that the sentence in Dutch did not mean I had a penchant for the newspaper, but now that is clear.

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/johaquila
johaquila
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Yes, I agree that your question made perfect sense. English and Dutch are closely related languages, and sometimes you can get a correct Dutch idiom by translating an English idiom word by word.

Because of the misleading hint, a lot of people will ask themselves the same question. Now they will get an immediate explanation.

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/olyakorikosha

interesting about word by word translated idioms. i'd love to hear the examples)

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/achmadsyar13fha

What is mean "sta"

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/johaquila
johaquila
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stand

1 year ago
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