"No one tasted your bitter orange dessert."

Translation:Personne n'a goûté ton dessert à l'orange amère.

June 26, 2020

31 Comments
This discussion is locked.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KenAndresen

"Personne ne goutait ton dessert à l'orange amère." Why was this rejected?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Luminous_Moose

It could be correct in context but more it's more likely that it was a one-off event and the next time you brought something chocolate.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Dominikolo1

So it's "bitter-orange"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/slowsummits

yep, duolingo not understanding english grammar and thus bollixing the exercise - yet again!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/magisterfuscus

I know, right?!?!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Leslie483050

Is bitter an negative statement (as in the dessert should be sweet) or is "bitter orange" a description of the flavor?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/claude295345

l'orange amère (une orange). Le dessert amer


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/GScottOliver

Yes, the flavor is "bitter-orange". There should be a hyphen there in the English. As there was not, I applied "bitter" to "dessert", and got it wrong. Now I know.
Timor mortis conturbat me.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Myktylgaan

Bitter orange is a specific flavour. Not everyone's favourite...


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SamSuitt

Well, THAT is a key piece of information Do neglected to pass on. I assumed orange was the color of the dessert, and bitter was its taste. Why is this interpretation not acceptable, given the sentence to translate?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Myktylgaan

I got away with "amer" instead of "amère"... So I've bittered the dessert, rather than bittering the orange..

Fair enough for Duo to be cool with either for those people who don't know about the desserts...


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/GScottOliver

I didn't, but it's probably because I put it immediately after dessert and not at the end.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/GraemeSarg

So for clarity and Poef9's benefit, although I think I already know, where in the sentence did you position "amer" ?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/stupefaite

personne n'a goûté ton dessert à l'orange amer


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Bas807769

I thought it was about a dessert with an orange colour. Duo came back with 'you did not show any skill ...'


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/fH6lclhu

Why "Personne n'a goûté ta dessert à l'orange amère.... wasn't accepted? isn't ....amère... feminine? and therefore ta and not ton.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/claude295345

In French the possessive adjectives have the gender of the noun that follows "dessert" is masculin so it is "ton dessert" But if the noun stars by a vowel or an h that you don't pronounce it is always masculin. it is easier to pronounce . "Ton orange amère" but " ta voiture" ( starts by a consonnant)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/--Roody--

I think it's because amère modifies the noun (une) orange, which is feminine. "Une orange amère" or "a bitter orange" is a compound term for a variety of fruit.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Poef9

Also see Myktylgaan's comment above. It is "ton dessert" because dessert is masculine, there is no way around that. Now it can be either "Personne n'a goûté ton dessert à l'orange amère." signifying that the orange (f.) is bitter or "Personne n'a goûté ton dessert à l'orange amer" saying that the dessert (m.) is bitter (or perhaps rather "ton dessert amer à l'orange", perhaps native speaker can resolve; see LenReed's comment below). So it depends on what "amer/amère" modifies. The English sentece is (almost unavoidably) ambiguous in that respect.

(edited 21 August 2020)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/GScottOliver

The English is ambiguous because the hyphen is missing from "bitter-orange".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/GraemeSarg

First, you agree that there is no way around "ton dessert" and then you get both sentences wrong by saying "ta dessert" instead of "ton dessert" !!!

Of course, one could always avoid the issue by saying "votre dessert".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Poef9

Thanks GraemeSarg for pointing this out. My post has been corrected by now.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LenReed

Poef9, you noted correctly that it must be "ton dessert" but then twice wrote ta dessert. I suspect that's just a bit of hasty carelessness. (Lord knows I'm guilty of that, too.)

I think if you wanted to say that the dessert was bitter and orange-flavored rather than flavored with bitter orange you could try "ton dessert amer à l'orange" or maybe even "ton amer dessert à l'orange". I doubt you could say "ton dessert à l'orange amer" and even if you did no one would hear that you said amer not amère. Maybe one of our native speakers could comment.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Poef9

Thanks for your comment LenReed. I have edited my comment. You may well be correct that "ton dessert à l'orange amer" is a doubtful translation. Hopefully a native speaker will be able to resolve the issue.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/GraemeSarg

But we already know from GScottOliver that "ton dessert amer à l'orange" is not accepted.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Steve286496

There is no way to know whether "orange" is being used as an ingredient/flavor or as a color in this sentence. The bitter dessert could be a sweet potato pie or pudding with too little sugar. It would be orange-colored and bitter, i.e., "un dessert orange amer".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LenReed

Steve, by "this sentence" do you mean Duo's original French? If so, that cannot mean orange as a color, since it is ton dessert à l'orange, not ton dessert orange.

I'm still curious if the sentence unambiguously refers to bitter oranges, the kind used in some marmalades and as a flavoring in Grand Marnier. Surely the Crêpes Suzette are not going untasted, through.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Steve286496

I was referring to the English sentence. It was a "translate this sentence to French" exercise. As GraemeSarg points out, the lack of a hyphen between "bitter" and "orange" makes it ambiguous.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LenReed

I can't find a single English use of "bitter-orange" with a hyphen. The bitter orange, e.g. the Seville orange, is a small orange citrus fruit used in some marmalades, flavourings and liquors. It is generally considered too sour and bitter to eat directly.

I find it a stretch to think that the French or English is referring to anything but this flavour. The fact that amer is accepted as well as amère is weak evidence; I've had Duo accept mistakes like many times without even a warning.

French Wikipedia calls this fruit la bigarade ou l'orange amère.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/GraemeSarg

Well, if we take the original French sentence and translate it into correct English we get: "No one tasted your bitter-orange dessert.".

The English sentence is now unambiguous and can only translate back to: "Personne n'a goûté ton dessert à l'orange amère.".

However, if we take Duo's bollixed version of the English sentence; "No one tasted your bitter orange dessert.", "orange" can now be interpreted as a colour (which was not a possibility in the original French, as LenReed points out) and the sentence can then be translated as "Personne n'a goûté ton dessert amer orange.".

You can bet that Duo won't accept this as valid though, because they will not have realised or acknowledged their original translation error (as confirmed by GScottOliver).

But we still don't know for certain where Myktylgaan positioned the "amer" that he says Duo accepted, but it was presumably "Personne n'a goûté ton dessert orange amer.".

I would think of the latter as a bitter dessert that was orange-flavoured because a bitter dessert that was orange-coloured would (IMHO) be "ton dessert amer orange", on the basis that the colour should be placed last.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LenReed

No source that I could find uses a hyphen in "bitter orange."

Given how common bitter orange (aka the Seville orange) is in desserts, I find it a huge stretch to think that the English could refer to an orange flavoured (or coloured) dessert that is bitter. I'll allow that it is a possible interpretation, though barely so.

The French, as you say, is unambiguously a dessert flavoured with the small, sour orange known as bitter orange.

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