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  5. "Avranno saputo che arrivavam…

"Avranno saputo che arrivavamo."

Translation:They must have found out that we were arriving.

August 6, 2014

74 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/GregoryCasteel

I have been entering the correct solution over and over again, and yet Duo keeps rejecting it for some reason. I even went so far as to copy and paste the correct solution that Duo recommended just in case I was somehow making a typo each time I typed it myself, but Duo still wouldn't accept it. I've reported it, but apart from that, I'm not really sure what I'm supposed to do.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/kajar0

I have the exact same problem! How are we supposed to continue?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/TheSecondStain

As far as I can see, with the word blocks there is no correct solution, as DL deems that the correct one is wrong. There's no method of moving on directly from this point in the lesson. One can only quit and start again on something else.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/unaduetre

There are many of us who had the same issue and have been able to move on. I keep reporting the problem and even went to their fb page and complained. I did stay away from the course for a few days when I went back I found that they had changed some of the questions and that sentence was missing and was able to move on. Don't give up keep reporting the problem.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Graeme953087

That's funny. I gave that solution and it was marked correct. Maybe DL has acted on your reports!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/carolynn357728

The unusual answer, definitely not English as I speak it, which was accepted as correct was: They will have "learnt" that we arrived.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Hazel-Anne4

I am having the same problem! What am I supposed to do? I did it right more than ten times! I just keep losing points and cannot go on!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JeandAlembert

Same problem today!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/carolynn357728

The very stilted translation that was accepted as correct is "They will have learnt (is that English) that we arrived. Strange, very strange.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/malcolmissimo

Look up any English conjugation resource. "Learned" is past indicative: they learned. "Learnt" is the past participle, used in all perfect tenses, and therefore the correct choice here. Neither strange nor stilted.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Dino705106

Certainly not in Canada. Where I have lived all of my 48 years. Native speaker. I have never used the word learnt, or heard anyone else ever use it.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/carolynn357728

I'm Canadian too Dino. Indeed, we never say learnt. I have heard it from a well-educated, well-spoken Australian. Language is fluid, and regional. I am pretty sure from some of the more unusual translations (unusual at least to the Canadian ear) that DL creators are not native English speakers. Tha't;s fine. I would appreciate though if there was a broader range of responses graded as correct.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/malcolmissimo

Which of these do you use? I burned/burnt the toast by mistake. He dreamed/dreamt about his holiday. Luke kneeled/knelt down to find his contact lens. Tanya spoiled/spoilt her dinner. She spelled/spelt her surname an unusual way.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/carolynn357728

Hello Malcolm. In eastern Canada, we would indeed use burnt toast but say I burned the toast. Kneeled and knelt would be used for prayer for example. We would never say spelt in any circumstances except for a kind of wheat.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Dino705106

It is worth mentioning this. I have found that Duolingo often uses British English for describing things that is just not commonly practised in Canada or the US. Canada is a bit of a hybrid between being very influenced by the US, but still retaining a lot of British English such as how we spell things like 'colour' etc. Interesting this comment from the Oxford dictionary: These are alternative forms of the past tense and past participle of the verb learn. Both are acceptable, but learned is often used in both British English and American English, while learnt is much more common in British English than in American English.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Flysalot

My experience has been that American (US) english was the first style used. I have had to report and wait for many British English translations to be accepted. e.g. biscuits instead of cookies sweets instead of candies and many more. I think we're still waiting for grandad to be accepted for Nonno.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/GregHullender

This is also the conjectural future, although this time the English isn't incomprehensible. Duo rejects "They must have learned that we arrived" and I reported that as an error.

https://www.duolingo.com/comment/3997791


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/pilpilon

this one sounds like a genuine future prefect for me


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/GregHullender

The point is that both should be accepted.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Uyterschout

Meanwhile "They must have known that we arrived" is accepted by DL. 28032016


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/anna567121

But not in April 2017 :-(


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/malcolmissimo

That's because the imperfect tense translates to "were arriving".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/TippiUnge1

Same thing happens to me, and I am stuck in the program. Two years later. Grrrr


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KittN1
  • 1323

No, not two years later - the bug seems to have only started this week. These comments from two years ago are just the usual sort about wanting more variations to be accepted. The bug we're all encountering now, just simply doesn't accept anything - not even that correct translation shown at the top. But welcome to the club! I think you're member number 12?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/unaduetre

Not matter how long the issue has been going on is crazy. Yes, the program is free but this is a hell of a way to get people to use it and tell others about it. Very SAD!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JeandAlembert

same problem one month later on 3 May 2017


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KittN1
  • 1323

If you read through all the comments on here, you'll see some workarounds suggested (obviously it'd be best if there wasn't a bug in the first place). The only one that was suitable and worked for me was to use the Test Out option on the whole Future Perfect skill. If you've tried lesson 2 several times, trying to get past the bug, then you'll already have a good grasp of how the sentences work. You'll know a fair few of the ones in the Test Out off by heart as well. So, don't be scared of it and give it a try.

If, like me, you really want to still go through all the other lessons, you can afterwards. Completing the Test Out will unlock them and allow you to progress.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/TheSecondStain

Hi. Thanks. Already solved the problem and posted it on here. Just leave out 'that' in the translation. DL accepts the resultant wording and the lesson can move forward. Cheers


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Doug4484

duolingo will not accept the correct answer. How can I progress?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JustinTunl

I may be a little slow on the uptake here- but where is the 'must' part of the sentance implicit?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/unaduetre

It is not part of the Italian sentence but the word "must" is in the duolingo translation. They are the ones who is in error. Can't get them to respond to all of these requests for HELP.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KatherineT463851

It does say in the dropdown info for "avranno" that "must have" is a colloquial usage. Just because it isn't a word-for-word translation with English that you recognize, doesn't make it wrong. Think idioms. : )


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/malcolmissimo

It's not an idiom and is more than just colloquial. One use of the futuro anteriore is conjecture about the past. In English, 'must have' is the shortest way to say it, hence the translation. The only way to know it is intended is when it's the usage that makes most sense in the context. See https://www.thoughtco.com/future-perfect-tense-in-italian-2011696 for useful detail and examples.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Joseph297228

"They will have found out that we were arriving" is actually incorrect, as the correct meaning would be "Avranno scoperto che arrivavamo". The word "saputo" is the past tense of the word "sapere", which means " to know. The correct answer is therefore, " They will have known that we were arriving"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/selly2015

But I still find it illogical in English - Future Perfect and Past Continuous - unlikely combination! I would have failed an exam if I had written something like that.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/malcolmissimo

You are unaware of this unusual usage of several past tenses of sapere, which mean: learned of, came to know, got to know about, heard about, and other synonyms.

It makes more sense when you reflect on the passato being a completed action in the past. The literal English translation (I knew/have known) is silly in relation to knowledge, as this is continuous and so requires the Italian imperfetto. However the various options above do work, and that's why avranno saputo has this meaning. The same logic lies behind the 'meet/met' meanings of conoscere.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jan534792

Absolutely correctly perfect... Thank you!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MariaIramendy

Why DL wants to make it so difficult. Wouldn't it be easier to say:"They will have known that we arrived"

Sapere means "to know” in the sense of "to be able to," or "to know how to." It can also be understood as knowing about a situation or a fact, like “Non sapevo che tu fossi qui.

  • I didn’t know that you were here.”

Conoscere, on the other hand, means “to know” in the sense of “to know someone” or “to know an area, town, restaurant, etc. https://www.thoughtco.com/italian-verbs-sapere-conoscere-2011690


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/malcolmissimo

Two issues with your version compared to Duo.

Che arrivavamo uses the imperfetto tense, signifying continuous or repeated action in the past: hence we were arriving. "We arrived" is not continuous and so would need one of the passato tenses.

Imagine a film scenario in which some bad guys have just realised they are about to be intercepted by some cops ...

Given that, "will have" is acceptable but so is "must have". It signifies a conjecture about the past - one of several uses of the futuro anteriore. I heartily recommend https://www.thoughtco.com/future-perfect-tense-in-italian-2011696 to learn about this. Note the second example in the list at the end.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/cseverin80

"They will have known that we arrived." What is wrong with this translation?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/hanna958948

I sometimes wonder if DL reads these comments. If so, they don't seem to bother, otherwise they would have improve some of the things.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BrianPhilipBlack

Finally, I am no longer a single voice in the wilderness.... Have a lingot, it may make you feel better


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Flysalot

Duolingo is made up of volunteers - I believe they start with the 'reported problems' so they won't see these comments unless they stumble in here.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/unaduetre

there is something wrong. answer is correct. need to move on


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/italian90-

but it won't let me! it won't allow me to 'skip' it, and when I get to the end, it's the last question again, and it keeps saying wrong, wrong, wrong and removing my bar until I just quit. how can I move on? there has been no response to my many 'report a problem's . . . help?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/unaduetre

I have not idea of how to get this corrected. No response from Duolingo as of this time.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Caterinabella

I have reported the same problem - my answer is correct and is marked wrong. The same answer I gave is the one DL marks wrong. I see others have the same problem. It's got to be a glitch somewhere in their system.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/unaduetre

Problem is still there. Just tried again and no luck. I belong to an Italian language group and we use this program as an additional learning tool. Need this corrected so that we can continue our learning.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/CIS2SR

Help! Does anybody know how to get past this. It is a severe software defect and will force me to exit the course permanently since there is no way past it. Does anybody know how to get help from Duolingo staff?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/unaduetre

I've checked Google and didn't see anyway to contact them. There's a lot of us "stuck".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/unaduetre

Can you explain how?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ralimaru

Well i had the same problem and then i did the same lesson on my phone and this sentence is not even there, then you can just complete the lesson no problem.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ralimaru

Good news Duolinguers! all you have to do is go through the App instead!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KittN1
  • 1323

Not good news for any of us without anything compatible, is it? So...not really a solution.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/colors_

Really? Sounds great. I'll try that! Thanks.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SarahStack8

Just do the "test out" of that whole lesson - and you will be able to move on.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KittN1
  • 1323

This is how I finally settled for doing it - and it's actually not that difficult. If you have attempted lesson 2 several times to see if it's been fixed, then you should know about a quarter of the test out questions really well by now! ;)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/GeorgiaRom

Wouldn't "would have known" also be an acceptable answer? If they "would have found out" they "would have known."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/malcolmissimo

That's the translation of avrebbero saputo, the past conditional tense.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/B1126

I still don't know how to report a problem . HELP please.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Bruce55312

After you have submitted your answer there are two flags at the bottom of the screen. One for "report" and one for "discuss". Use "report" wisely and sparingly and only after you have read all the comments - often the answer is in the discussion.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BrianPhilipBlack

Oh come on DL for the love of Pete, to have known and to have learnt are the same damn thing, and certainly sapere is 'to know' so far as we know and imparare is to learn.

Oh come on, this is the same session and now the answer is supposed to be "They must have found out that we were arriving"

Tell me, where is 'the supposed to have found out' coming from?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/malcolmissimo

See reply to Joseph297228 earlier.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BrianPhilipBlack

Er, thanks, I think. Basically I have no idea what you're talking about and will have to take your word for it. Have a lingot for your trouble.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BobMallord

Look Duo, if "found out" or "learnt" can be used of SAPUTO then why can't "known" be used? Because if something was learned of found out it is then known, vero?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ladyvyper

I give up. Duo's "correct" answer is "They will have learnt that we arrived." Really?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/malcolmissimo

That's just a correction of your error, whatever it was; the preferred answer is at the top of this page. Duo is a machine. When 'he' finds an error, it seems that one isolated correction is made to what you wrote and the rest is unchanged; also if there are 2+ errors, only one is changed. These can produce junk - I've seen worse than yours.

Therefore I long since ceased to be bothered, and instead I (a) note what is marked in the suggestion and (b) try to understand its relation to the preferred translation. You learn more that way. Sometimes the preferred translation itself is not great, perhaps from a non-native speaker, which to me is worse. But this is a good one.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LindaNordin

what's wrong with: They will have learned that we were arriving. ?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/malcolmissimo

It's too distant a synonym. 'Learned' isn't the same as 'got to know' or 'found out'. When we deviate that far, Duo simply thinks we haven't got the vocabulary.

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