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  5. "Sängyt ovat hotellissa."

"Sängyt ovat hotellissa."

Translation:The beds are in a hotel.

July 26, 2020

19 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/nimporte-qui

Could you tell that this is not "There are beds in the hotel" or would you need more context?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/annika_a

Yeah, your sentence translates to "Hotellissa on sänkyjä.".

(I'd actually suggest "The beds are in the hotel" as a more natural translation of the given Finnish sentence here, but the given one is also correct.)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/chartsman

Why sänkyjä? What case is that? Why not Hotellissa on sängyt?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Juha_Metsakallas

Its plural partitive. More about the partitive for instance in the Wikipedia article.

If you have not taken this course with a webbrowser, I strongly suggest doing so at least once, because that version has grammar lessons. The mobile application version lacks those.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/chartsman

I am only using a web browser for this course but partitive has only been introduced for the singular so far so I'm surprised it even exists in plural.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Juha_Metsakallas

Depending how you calculate there are about 15 grammatical cases in Finnish. I think this course takes up only four most common ones. All those have separate singular and plural forms.

  • nominative: sänky/sängyt
  • genitive: sängyn/sänkyjen
  • accusative: sängyn/sängyt
  • partitive: sänkyä/sänkyjä

Only some of the rarest cases, which this course does not teach, have just one form.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Juha_Metsakallas

This sentence is so called existential clause, jotakin on jossakin : something is somewhere, which very common in Finnish. Duolingo seems mostly to have opted for "There is/are..." for these existential clauses.

An additional fact is, that in Finnish one prefers a clear structure from theme to rheme, more than in English. So here the old, given thing is the beds and the new info is their location.

Given those two points I agree with Annika, that "The beds are in a/the hotel" better captures the meaning of the original sentence.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Steve122198

Exactly - re the beds in a' vsv'the' hotel.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/sekondname

What are you saying?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sarah803697

I was expecting the pronunciation of "sängyt" to sound more like SANG-oot, but here it sounds like SAN-noot. Not hearing the G at all. Tried it in Google Translate and it sounds like SANG-oot there, so have reported audio sounding wrong. Anyone else hearing this a bit off?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Juha_Metsakallas

While sticking to the standard speech, you have probably heard that Finnish follows the principle that every letter is always pronounced the same way. Well, eh… There are a few exceptions to that otherwise very true rule.

  • nk as in kenkä is pronouced as [keŋkä], see voiced velar nasal
  • ng as in kengän is pronounced as [keŋŋän]
  • gn as in magneetti is pronounced as [mɑŋneetti] (note, the letter combination gn always indicates a loanword)
  • np as in onpi is pronounced as [ompi]

So in the word sängyt you are not supposed to hear a sharp g but a double nasal sound in the middle. Having said that the text-to-speech generator is known to make mistakes, so it is fully possible that the audio is wrong.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sarah803697

Thanks for this! I wasn't meaning a sharp g, though (like in the Liverpudlian accent) - I wasn't very clear on that - I meant the effect of the g (or soft g), if that makes sense? There's clear difference between Duolingo's version of "sängyt" and that which is on GT.

Anyway, that link was great ... I lived in NZ as a child, so grew up hearing the ŋ sound a lot in Maori words and placenames (e.g. the word 'the' is 'nga'. Never knew it was called a voiced velar nasal, though :)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Andrew713382

Finnish has a really soft G, I cannot go into Juha's level of detail but my Finnish family surname has a G in the middle of it, and I spoke Finnish as my first language, sadly now rusty, and my G sound starts in the nose and finishes in the back of my throat. There is no exact sound in English. Soft is the best I can offer.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sarah803697

I think I understand. Like taking the standard UK English of the word "singer" (not rhotic) and taking away the "si" part?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Andrew713382

Spot on - that is the mouth shape I make for Helsingissä or sängyt.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/chartsman

It's the first time I see G in a Finnish word, hahaa. I was starting to think that it's absent from the Finnish alphabet.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sarah803697

And if a G is ever in a native Finnish word (i.e. not a word that's 'borrowed' from elsewhere) it is always preceded by a N.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AndrBallon

Säng means bed in swedish

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