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  5. "Lei pensa che l'abbia lascia…

"Lei pensa che l'abbia lasciata."

Translation:She thinks I left her.

May 17, 2013

75 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/brandon376

The subject of the clause "che l'abbia lasciata" could be "I" or "he" or "she" or "it" if the subject pronoun is missing -- isn't that so?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/f.formica
Mod
  • 2664

Yes, it works for all of those.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/crazy4hazy

But it should work with "you", too, no? (It wasn't accepted)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Teresinha

I think it should be accepted because "abbia" is the same for all persons of the subjunctive present singular.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RomancePhilology

No, a singular subjunctive form without a subject is interpreted as first or third person.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Raimundo474613

If it were you, then you would have been written as 'Lei'.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SchubertNo21

I think you have been downed because Duo has not included the formal 'you'- Lei, in their course so far.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SlawomirJakubek

Could this sentence mean: She thinks that she has left it


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/brandon376

Thanks for the confirmation. Looks like duolingo now agrees.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Revilo_N

The little green owl thinks differently.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Tcclimber

So where should we put the subject pronoun?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/madmd1961

My answer "She thinks that she left it" was accepted.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/lbyler

As I wrote elsewhere, I was taught that since the person is indeterminate for the congiuntivo presente singolare, it is conventional to include a subject for the dependent clause unless it is the same as that of the independent clause. By that convention, the answer above is correct (it is accepted, btw), and DL's answer violates the convention.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/homa2001

It is correct, but it's a weird one, because the first she must not be the second she. Meaning the subject of the 2nd clause cannot be the same as the subject of the 1st clause for subjunctive to be triggered. If the subject is the same, then the phrase would have been "lei pensa di l'aver lasciata".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Budd01

Is it a “Rule” or an “Option” to not use the subjunctive if the subject of both clauses is the same. The site below states: “If the subject of both clauses is the same, you DON’T NEED to use the subjunctive, …” The site does not state that it is incorrect to use the subjunctive. http://learnitalian.web.unc.edu/home/verbs/subjunctive/


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Roan866446

The statement is misleading. One normally does not say the equivalent of "I am happy that I am not ill"--which is perfectly good English--but rather "I am happy not to be ill": Sono contento di non essere malato.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Dalingo8

I also wrote "She thinks that she left it" and was accepted


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Dalingo8

Second time I wrote "She thinks that he left it" and again it was accepted


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Andrea376088

I do not think so. the object complement is feminine: lasciatA


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Dalingo8

That's right. "It" can be something that is male or female gender. That's why you can put either "it" or "she" for lasciata, when translating from Italian to English.

With the same logic, if it were lasciato you could put "it" or "he".

Who has "left it" it's not stated, so it can be "he", "she" or even "it".

I hope you understand now :)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/audrey233739

Gianni what does that mean?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sedona2007

Giustissimo! = Absolutely right!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Roan866446

Am I correct in thinking that the subjects here cannot be the same? Otherwise, shouldn't one say "lei pensa di l'aver lasciata" ('She thinks that she left it/her.')? In French and in German, one can say the syntactic equivalent of "I think/believe to have done it," but in English, it seems, that sounds odd with "think" in the present tense, cf. I had thought to have finished the task. Right?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/rljones

This is one of those abysmal Duo context-less sentences that could mean almost anything. Why is someone always leaving someone? Are all Duo staff people unhappy in love?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Germanlehrerlsu

rl: I agree. It makes me so sad I think I'll have another glass of oil.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/rljones

Just be careful not to spill it anywhere near the Gulf.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/motylek-8

She thinks that she has left him. Is it wrong??


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/marygbaker

I think it has to be wrong because lasciata ends in the feminine ending, so the article "l" must stand for something feminine (so it can't be a "he" that got left).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/CaraDePauUK

Am I right in thinking that the subject of abbia here could be I, you, him, or her? Do people actually use subjunctive in day-to-day speech in Italian? Seems like it would cause a lot of confusion.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Germanlehrerlsu

Matt: Context should eliminate most of any possible confusion. When I studied in Bologna my teacher told us that the subjunctive is much more common in Italian than it is in English -- he'd lived in SF for several years and his English was quite good. He emphasized that knowing how to use the subjunctive is what separated speakers (native & foreign) who could express themselves from those who could express themselves WELL. His point was the subjunctive is very important to learn.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Roan866446

This is also true of French...Even seemingly "uneducated" speakers use the subjunctive systematically--and in casual conversation. I've had discussions/arguments with non-native speakers of French who are quite fluent but also careless, claiming that it doesn't matter. It does, that is, if one cares about how one's proficiency is judged. It may seem snobbish, but that's the reality...


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RomancePhilology

It could be I, he, or she, but not you.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/dinnernugget

Perché è lasciatA e non lasciatO? Non è riflessivo questo verbo!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Germanlehrerlsu

It's lasciatA and not lasciatO to convey the idea that the 'l' in "l'abbia" = 'la' and refers therefore to a female. If the writer had intended the 'l' in "l'abbia" to equal 'lo' and a male, then and only then would the past participle have been lasciatO.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/craaash80

This subject is called "concordanza" or "accordo" of the past participle and it is one of the trickiest italian grammar topics :)

( See here )


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jae633849

E non è vero? Faresti meglio a correggere questa idea sbagliata subito!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Andrea376088

in Italian " che l'abbia lasciata" may be first or third person. You never put the subject!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Armusj

'She thinks she let it go' rejected?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/dxrsam

She thinks she left it is better and is accepted.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/leahjae

it doesnt work anymore


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/cosmopolita61

I suggested DL should also accept "left it behind"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JohnGadway

I agree with d.alphart


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Chrismakem

Where is the subject? Surely for this to be 'I' have left her it should have io abbia..... just to show the person involved? Otherwise l'abbia could be anyone!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Mico_di_Ostia

I'm working on a version of this sentence where you are given the Italian and are asķed to translate into english from a limited set of english words. The correct answer is given as, "She thinks that I have left her". What a tricky owl you are.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Germanlehrerlsu

Michael: I think there are several correct answers besides the one given which you cite depending on context: She thinks that she has left her/She thinks that he has left her, maybe even She thinks that you (formal) have left her -- since the verb 'abbia' is the same for all 3 persons in the singular. In fact instead of "her" you could substitute any feminine noun, so: She thinks that I have left IT -- or any of the other subjects.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SarunasP

How come is "She thinks that I had left her" not accepted?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/zimtladen

That is not English. To make it grammatical you would have to add a reference to another time in the past later than the time 'I had left her'; otherwise the past perfect "I had left" makes no sense with the main clause in present tense

eg "She thinks that I had already left her before she met you, but she is wrong".

But the equivalent Italian for this would be "lei pensa che l'avessi gia' lasciata...", using the congiuntivo trapassato, and not the congiuntivo passato used here.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JFizza

I do not understand this sentence, it is not clear who the speaker is talking about


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JamilHilal

Where does the " come in.. instead he or she?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JamilHilal

I wrote h she thinks he left her and wank marked as wrong, why?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ScoutsManyZZZ

How can you determine what the context is? Like saying i left her without there being me, or io.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Edward927427

"abbia" could also be "he" or "she". I think my answer "She thinks that he left her" shoud have been accepted


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/schulzwh

"l'abbia lasciata" is "he left her." "I left her" is "l'ho lasciata." Isn't DL wrong on this one. Or is it me?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/YuriMykolayevych

You would be correct if this was indicative and not the subjunctive. This however is the subjunctive.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SteveKillick

Could that read as she thinks that I left it?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/EldorD

Why is it not "lasciato" but "lasciata"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/YuriMykolayevych

Because in the context of the sentence the object of lasciata is feminine and could very well be the same person as Lei.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Tommaso27gz

Duo is wrong. I don't understand why they try and make this so confusing. A pronoun would clearly identify "who" or "what" left her. If we said Lei pensa che "io" l'abbia lasciata, then "I" left her. If we said Lei pensa che "tu" l'abbia lasciata, then "you" left her. If we said Lei pensa che "loro" l'abbia lasciata, then "they" left her.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/zimtladen

Well, not "loro". "loro" would demand l'abbiano.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ArgentaMoon

It accepted "She thinks that she left it"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mjw360

it did not accept that "she thinks tha he has left it


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Germanlehrerlsu

mjw360: i think it's correct and should be reported. The past participle being feminine is to agree with the pronoun object not with a subject, as i understand it.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/cseverin80

Where does this sentence indicate first person?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/lschwaegle

Why isn't the "I" mentioned. How would you know who is being talked about?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/juddmin

I added "behind" and it was counted as wrong!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Germanlehrerlsu

juddmin: I think you're adding something that's not necessarily there. "Leave behind" sounds like abandonment, while the original might simply be saying she thought I'd left her...for another woman, to go play golf, to go get the car, whatever, rather than 'left her behind' which is stronger.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/homa2001

I'm pretty sure for this to mean "leave behind" it would have to be "Lei pensa che l'abbia lasciata perdere". That perdere, meaning to lose, would kind of literally mean to "leave it perish" i.e. "behind"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MAUROJOAO

where is "lui " in such sentence


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Germanlehrerlsu

There is NO "lui" in the sentence. "Lei" is "she" and the "a" ending on "lasciatA" tells you the "l'" refers to a female.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DarioMontecello

Yes. Could be him as well. Duolingo should correct it.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Germanlehrerlsu

DarioMontecello: No, I don't think so. For it to be 'him' than the past participle would have to be "lasciatO". Since it's "lasciatA" it has to be either 'her' or "it" referring to some feminine noun.

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