"Non mangi finché non li leggi."

Translation:You won't eat until you read them.

5 years ago

57 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/ackworth

This sentence does not help students to understand about clitics. A few more simple sentences please!

5 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/mukkapazza
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Thanks for the comments! A few points:

We'll definitely aim to add a few more simple ones, thanks for the suggestion ;)

Finché non = until, finché = while

The idea of the sentence is along the lines of what @hoffmannov95 suggested.

5 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/corbettf75

The point is not the meaning of "finché non"; a glance at the Collins dictionary makes that clear (http://www.wordreference.com/iten/finch%C3%A9%20non). The point is that people struggle to find meaning by creating contexts. If duolingo provided even a simple context (in English or Italian) no one would have had to waste time writing these comments. Read the comments again: notice the number of times "mean" and "sense" occur. Then people make up little scenarios to find meaning. It astonishes me that this sentence is still being used after so many people have made this obvious point.

5 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/MariaIramendy

Bravo!!!

5 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/marliner

It would be useful to define that before asking questions on it.

5 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/JenniferAron
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I have to disagree with ackworth. I like the difficult sentences; bring them on!

5 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/RaymondWil20

I agee!!

4 weeks ago

https://www.duolingo.com/guiletheavenger

What exactly is "You do not eat until you read them" supposed to mean?

5 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/hoffmannov95

Maybe a child wants to eat some junk food (chocolate!), but mom and dad want him/her to finish reading for their homework assignment (some news articles? short stories? three chapters of the book?). That's what I'm sticking with.

5 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/xyphax
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Yes ..to read 'to them' makes 'them' an indirect object, which would be a different sentence

non mangi finchè non gli leggi
.. or ..
non mangi finchè non leggi a loro

This is from my recent understanding from clitics. So, when this sentence says 'read them', them is a direct object. It does not answer to whom are you reading, it answers what you are reading. So, a your context makes sense, the kids must read 'some things' before they can eat. ;-)

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/KarenColle

You don't eat until you read them (the Boarding House Rules posted on the wall over there)?

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/RaymondWil20

I agree with tis too! What the hell is this supposed to mean in ANY language

4 weeks ago

https://www.duolingo.com/lynnfhoffman

that's such a bizarre sentence that i couldn't believe i had it right. . .

5 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Viaggiatore

Here the present in Italian is translated as the future in English. Sometimes Duolingo rejects such translations.

5 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/jlco

Don't eat 'em till you read 'em. I think this must be an instruction to read the labels of things before you gobble them down. In any event it's pretty zooty. Translate that, Jackson!

5 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Alf42
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I put, "Don't eat until you read them" and it was marked incorrect. Is the 2nd per. sg. imperative a different form?

5 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Viaggiatore

"Non mangi" could be a polite imperative form of "don't eat". But "leggi" is an informal form of "you read". So you're addressing the person in two different ways, one polite and one not. That translation doesn't quite work.

5 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/gordon_gregory

I wrote that too assuming that the first "you" was unnecessary as it was implied quite definitely by the second "you"

5 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/lostordimento

Is adding "you" really all that necessary? :P

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/johnson.barry

Clitics leaves me puzzled - the earlier stages need a wider presentation of this area to aid learning.

7 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/mdsawyermd

A philosophical musing on the sentences that seem weird: Yes, context is nice sometimes to help one figure out a sentence, but it can also be a bit of a crutch. I think having sentences that don't seem to make much sense as part of the mix is good, because it forces you to translate without any contextual clues.

And pronouns often don't make sense as they are substituting for a person or other noun from earlier in the conversation, so they're prime candidates for this.

5 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Raymond904

"It forces you to translate without any contextual clues" - which would never happen in real life

5 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/antomol
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You don't eat until you have read them. You won't eat until you read them. past participle and/or future ??? I was trying to use present is there a way ??

5 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/jovada

Hard to translate without context. The message below warns me to "stop the clutter", but I do post this comment since nothing seems to change...

5 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Kmandadad

Bizarre sentence

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/poncine
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Stupid sentence - means nothing and really difficult undertand

5 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/MelissaM1212

I put "to them" and was marked wrong. I think this is because "li" is a direct object, not indirect. So, "You don't eat until you read to them" would be something like, "Non mangi finchè non leggi a loro." Could anyone confirm this? Thanks!

5 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/xyphax
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I think, if you want to say 'to them', then yes, a loro (following the verb) is correct.
The Declension of Pronouns Personal

Also ..
non mangi finchè non gli leggi
pronouns

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/KarenColle

So far I feel like I am keeping pace with my understanding of clitic pronouns, but I just possibly might have turned gray (capelli) before I get through this section. Thank you for all the help you give us, xyphax!♡

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/bjojoe

Hopeless example......

11 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/LilyCamille01

Why not "You don't eat until you read them"?

10 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Sedona2007

Your sentence is correct. If you were marked wrong, it maybe because of the contraction "don't". You should submit it, if you come across it again.

8 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/LilyCamille01

Thanks!

8 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Al_Piergiorgi

Since when we are learning future tense?

10 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Tjb59

Weird sentence! Not just complicated, but on its own, it doesn't really make sense.

9 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/StephenCoates

I put "you cannot eat" but it was marked wrong.Is this sentence showing an imperative? If so, DL, please stop confusing us. There are already too many negative comments about this sentence, change it or drop it!

9 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/f.formica
Mod
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It's not an imperative, that would be "non mangiare": it's a statement and a not so veiled threat like mothers do.

9 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Piero93166
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Why does it not accept "You are not eating until you read them"? That is a direct English translation with the same meaning as the Italian.

3 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/gmattucc

How come it is "Non mangi finché non li leggi" and not "Non mangi finché li leggi"? I thought it was: "You do not eat until you do not read them" (wrong)

4 weeks ago

https://www.duolingo.com/CharlesPit19

As I understand it, "finchè" means "as long as" and "finchè non" means 'until.' Also, in English a double negative is considered incorrect, but in Italian it can be proper usage.

4 weeks ago

https://www.duolingo.com/gmattucc

Ah I see, thanks for the explanation!

So I can kind of think of "finché non" in this context to mean "as long as you don't read the book," while also remembering the meaning of "finché non" being "until."

Double negatives, although incorrect grammatically in English, are used in common speech, although a bit yokelish ;) "You ain't done nothing!"

Thanks again! :)

4 weeks ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Bettemc
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I refuse to lose a heart over a nonsensical sentence. I'm starting the lesson over.

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/frankbenf

what?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/winterfaller

It should be 'tu non mangerai' as will not (won't) is in the future

9 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/CharlesRit3

As noted throughout this discussion, there are many problems with the translation. I think that the Italian sentence is in the present tense, so "You do not eat until you you read them" should be an acceptable translation into English. Furthermore, if DL wanted to create an Italian sentence that would translate into a future tense in English, it should have presented a sentence something like "non mangerai finche' non li leggi."

7 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Sionel
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Five years after people said this sentence is confusing I'll add that I completely agree.

3 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/YuriMykolayevych

Is "finche non" interchangeable with "fino a" and when would you use one way over the other?

3 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/CharlesPit19

My notes say "finche non" is used when followed by a conjugated verb whereas "fino a" is used when followed by a noun or infinitive verb. In this case "finche non" is used because it is followed by "leggi." I am guessing that "li" is sort of transparent in this rule.

2 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/YuriMykolayevych

Thank you Charles. Impressive detail on your notes.

4 weeks ago

https://www.duolingo.com/BartS1965

what kind of sentence is this !!!!!

1 month ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Simon920910

I swear these clitics are killing me...

1 month ago

https://www.duolingo.com/CharlesPit19

Agree. I finally completed Clitics level 4 and then got to the point I could access Present Perfect. That is more useful to me, just like Future tense will be. At some point I'll finish Clitics, but I can't say that I will have mastered it.

1 month ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Henry_Bob

present functioning as future?

3 weeks ago

https://www.duolingo.com/MrMOOstachE34
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Where is the "won't/will not" in this translation? Explain.

1 week ago

https://www.duolingo.com/AmineK
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why "Do not eat until you read to them" is wrong ? UNBELIEVABLE

5 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/MelissaM1212

"To them" would need an indirect object pronoun. As it stands, it uses "li," which is a direct object pronoun (i.e. "them" is the object which you are reading, not who you are reading to.) "To them" would need "loro." Hope that makes sense.

5 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/clmerali
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Maybe I got it! I used to "read" my guests faces when serving food to anticipate their reaction. Otherwise, I would say is "...until you read to them". Only DL!

8 months ago
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