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"Bean agus fear."

Translation:A woman and a man.

4 years ago

45 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/SherrinfordH
SherrinfordH
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I noticed that if one crosses out the 'e' in the 'ea' group of these words I remember the pronunciation more easily. So it becomes "Ban agus far" - which is much more like it's pronounced. Don't know if anyone else uses these tricks to remember pronunciation, but I thought I'd share it.

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/ataltane
ataltane
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That's a handy trick. The 'e' is actually there for a reason, though. It gives you a clue to the pronunciation of the 'b' or 'f' before it. It's quite subtle, but the b in 'bean' (woman) is different from the b in 'bán' (white). It has a 'y'-like quality.

This is much more obvious with other consonants. For example, the first syllables of 'teampall' (temple) and 'tamall' (while)' have the same vowel (a) but the Ts are different. In 'tam' it's normal (let's call it), while in 'team' it's more like 'tya-' or 'cha-'.

If that's confusing, just trust your ears. They'll figure it out eventually :).

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Swiftrun7.62

Thank you

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Mortenll
Mortenll
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Why are the vocal sounds in "bean" and "fear" pronounced differently? Is it just one of those things?

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/talideon
talideon
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It's partly a dialect thing. In other dialects, there's no difference, but the Connemara dialect (which, in spite of the course being An Caighdeán - the official standard dialect) appears to be the speaker's native dialect.

That's OK. The Connemara dialect is widely understood.

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/mokusei
mokusei
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Here is the link to a text-to-speech site somebody posted in another thread: http://www.abair.tcd.ie/?lang=eng. It's quite helpful as it includes two different dialects (Ulster Irish and Connaught Irish), along with a map.

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/bin_weg

It sounds soooooooo beautiful, I could listen to it for hours. :-*

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PrincessLolly

Why are bean/fear spelled with an "h" in some cases (bhean/fhear), and not in others?

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/galaxyrocker

Irish has initial word mutations, so it just depends on the context they are used. Feminine nouns lenite (add an h) after the definite articles; masculine ones don't. So, an bhean. But, an fear.

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/tu.8zPhLD72zzoZN
tu.8zPhLD72zzoZN
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When do masculine words mutate?

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/galaxyrocker

Nominative singular if it starts with a vowel (t-prefixing). They also mutate in genitive singular

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/tu.8zPhLD72zzoZN
tu.8zPhLD72zzoZN
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Thank you!

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Rae.F
Rae.F
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And yet it accepts "an bean" as perfectly correct without so much as a "You have a typo in your answer". Should this be reported as an error?

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/galaxyrocker

I would, but I think they decided to be lenient on lenition/eclipsing in the course. There was a discussion about it a while back.

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Kilyle
Kilyle
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Lenition is one of the most arresting aspects of the Irish language, and one of the reasons I keep going back to it despite having more trouble with it than with any language I have ever studied (I've studied over two dozen, though none to fluency (not my aim at present)).

I actually love it so much that I made it a vital case marker for one of the conlangs I'm designing. In my language, words divide into categories based on whether they're primarily active, like people and predators, or primarily acted upon, like prey animals, babies, and inanimate objects. The words get lenited when they're outside the two or three classes they're most likely to be found in (there are some other changes that take place too, such as sneaking an R into some cases, as ten - tren or - thren).

But yeah, Irish lenition occurs for a ton of reasons, and the only one I tend to remember is the vocative ("Hi, Bob!"). Here's Wikipedia's list: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irish_initial_mutations#Environments_of_lenition

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/ahogan86

What's lenition?

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/talideon
talideon
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Lenition is a kind of sound change. It's basically the change of a stop sound (such a 'p', 't', 'k', &c.) into a fricative (such as 'f', 's', 'ch' as in 'loch', &c.) pronounced in more or less the same position.

An example of lenition in English would be the words 'act' and 'action'. 'Action' is basically the word 'act' + the suffix '-(t)ion'. However, you'll notice that whereas the 't' in 'act' is pronounced as a stop, in 'action' it ends up pronounced as an 'sh' this is because when when '-ion' is added to the end of a word, it causes the 't' to lenite to 'sh', even if it's already part of the word.

In Irish, this happens all the time because it's grammaticalised.

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/rwohl1

As I read through many of these comments, I feel that I am out of the loop on lots of the lango used. Language interests me a great deal, and it would be lovely to increase my knowledge so as to help me more easily learn languages. Can anybody suggest some sort of reading material to look into...linguistics, phonology, etc.? Thank you!

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Rae.F
Rae.F
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Linguistics is a rather broad field. I have a BA in the subject and I've only scratched the surface. But Wikipedia is a really good resource for getting started in understanding the basics.

Lenition

Category:Phonology

Category:Linguistics

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/GrandApple
GrandApple
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During the creation of the Earth..

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Gill84

Biddy and Miley, the Irish Adam and Eve ;-)

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/ThatOneKidJosh

Really? Cool!

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Gill84

Eh, no not really. Sorry, you'd understand if you watched terrible Irish TV ;-)

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/flint72
flint72
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I would have gone with "John and Mary", as made famous in Father Ted.

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/AyHaich
AyHaich
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Up with that sort of thing.

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/ThatOneKidJosh

Oh. :P

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/ahogan86

So when you want to practice speaking Irish to someone, which dialect do you use? Do you have to learn all dialects or is there a "general Irish" language you can learn?

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/talideon
talideon
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There's an artificial standard dialect, An Caighdeán Oifigiúl, which is what this course is teaching. However, It's not actually spoken in practice. No dialect is considered superior to the others, though Munster Irish speakers have a tendency think that theirs is the best.

While I'm far from fluent, the dialect I picked up from my grandmother is an intermediate between the Connacht and Ulster dialects (basically Ulster Irish with Connacht vowels) because I'm from Sligo, and that's more or less how the last Irish speakers in my locality spoke and how my grandmother taught me. As far as which one you should learn goes, you should stick with CO for now so as you get the fundamentals of the language, and when you're comfortable, try to pick up whichever of the three major dialects takes your fancy.

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/ataltane
ataltane
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I might add that dialect differences are not seen as a big, big deal by Irish speakers. They can be confusing to the learner, but essentially everyone comes to speak their preferred form and to understand everyone else. It's like English dialects that way.

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/brainynut

Here the pronunciation of "bean" doesn't sound (to me) like in other previous sentences... I couldn't come up with that word when listening to it :/

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/robagio
robagio
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Is there a word for "a/an"?

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/mokusei
mokusei
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No, Irish doesn't have an indefinite article.

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/ataltane
ataltane
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No. You should supply it in your translations where English requires it.

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/_i_love_nature_

This helping me with irish and french

I AM SO HAPPY!!!! :):):):):):):):)

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Spygirl1342

This question is so touchy I barely got it correct

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/amberm5480

this is hard for me :() but I love it

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/_i_love_nature_

can i get a friend?

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Spygirl1342

Sure you have me

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Umamor

I've used a rosetta stone trial and they spelled "bean" as "bhean" and pronounced it with a "v" sound? Is that correct or more of a regional pronunciation? I just want to make sure I'm learning it right.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Rae.F
Rae.F
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That's lenition, which is a grammatical feature. https://www.duolingo.com/skill/ga/Lenition

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/milgurl15

Interesting how 'ban' is bean and 'far' is fear

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/ChloeDae1

i dont like they count it wrong for using lower case

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Rae.F
Rae.F
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That's strange. I've never had that issue. Did you report it?

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/TylerAube

You can't hear it very well

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Martyn731976
Martyn731976
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"a woman and a man"

1 year ago