I read somewhere you can continue this pattern by wishing 'God and Mary and St Patrick be with you' and possibly a second reply with God, Mary, St Patrick and St Brigid... (I don't know how long you can continue before you run out of saints.)
I really want this to be true :D. Does anyone know?
You could go a long, long, LONG time without running out of saints. There are way more saints recognized by the Catholic Church than there are days in the year to give them separate feasts. You would certainly run out of memory (or patience) before you would run out of saints, probably even if you just used the ones especially popular in and Ireland.
Yes that is correct. But I only meant that All Saints Day (which also happens to be a holy day of obligation) celebrates all saints, known and unknown, in part to honor those saints which do not have a recognized feast day. All Souls Day is principally celebrated for the holy souls in Purgatory. And yes, but every soul in heaven is a saint though many are unknown.
Indeed. Days also known as All Hallows. Which then yields Halloween or All Hallows Eve. Both days are pasted over the autumn equinox traditionally representing the Celtic New Year, when the fabric of the universe was parted and spirits would freely roam between the worlds. The pre-christians worshipped a huge number of gods and most likely greetings would invoke their protection as in gods protect you etc. Curses of course would go the other way. The irish (and descendents like me) generally remain deeply spiritual
(I know I'm late) but I have reason to believe it was actually made by the Christians so that the pagans won't celebrate their festivals anymore because they'd have to celebrate a Christian festival, and the 50/50 would come out of the fact that they the theme of the party was of course similar to Samhain in the sense that it was about the celebration of the dead.
Dia duit/ Dia is Muire duit/ Dia is Muire is Padráig duit/ Dia is Muire is Padráig is Naomh Bríd/ Dia is Muire is Padráid is Naomh Bríd is Naomh Eoin Baiste duit/ Dia is Muire is Padráid is Naomh Bríd is Naomh Eoin Baiste is Naomh Phroinsias duit/ Dia is Muire is Padriag is Naomh Bríd is Naomh Eoin Baiste is Naomh Phroinsias is Naomh Cholm Cille duit that's as far as back as I can remember, but you can keep going and going and going... the last one translates exactly to: "God, and Mary, and St Patrick, and St Brigid, and St John the Baptist, and St Francis, and St Columcille be with you." Hope that helps :)
Can someone explain to me the phonology behind how the initial "d" in "duit" is coming off (to this American ear) as a very clear G sound, closer to the English "g" even than a Greek "gamma" sound? I know that broad and slender vowels are a huge determining factor but it seems to have the same effect either way coming off the broad "a" in "dia" as well as the slender "e" in Muire. I do not hear this "g" sound for the letter "D" in other Gaelic words; is this purely idiomatic?
In intervocalic positions in Irish, consonants frequently become palatalized or velarized depending upon the quality (front/back) of the flanking vowels. The 'd' of duit here is intervocalic: diA dUit; this is why we can see the d written with h sometimes, for example dia dhuit, the h indicating the change of pronunciation. In this particular case, the d is velarized as it is surrounded by back vowels. Velarized 'd' in Irish sounds like Greek γ (gamma).
So do you reckon I'm always safe using a gamma sound when I see the letter d surrounded by similar vowel sounds on both sides? I'm just trying to establish a baseline; not to mention I'm fascinated by these little linguistic minutiae. Much obliged to smrch & magrise for the in-depth info.
Both dia dhuit and dia duit are possible. There are two problems in this question:
The written form says "duit", but the voice is (trying) to say "dhuit".
The "duit" version should be pronounced with a /ɣ/ (a voiced velar fricative—a 'gh' sound), but she's just saying /g/. Maybe that form is possible in Ulster (not sure), but it would be better if she said it the more standard way (/ɣ/), and also if she read what was written instead of using a variant form.
A real gaelgeoir (Irish speaker) would have to explain this to you, but I have a vague recollection of reading it's something to do with 'd' changing in pronunciation before a slender vowel (e/é, i/í).
Disclaimer: this could all be nonsense. I would like to find out from someone who does know though.
When your granny was in school, the h's after other consonants were written as a dot over the other letter, so mh mwould have been m with a dot, and so on. The only actual h's would have been for imported words and times where an h was added for grammatical reasons. Granny is always right!
Ask her what the Irish for "hat" was in her day.
Or what she said instead of ná habair é or Poblacht na hÉireann, and other places where words that start with a vowel get a h-prefix.
It is true that, particularly in handwriting, the séimhiú that indicates lenition, which we now mark with a h after a consonant, used to be indicated with a dot over the consonant instead, but this buailte was not used for h-prefix words. And even the use of the buailte wasn't entirely universal - lenition had been indicated with a h for centuries in some texts.
Irish is not the only language like this. Arabic has "Insha'Allah," and in Spanish and Italian (and Portuguese, etc.) Adios, Adieu mean literally "to god" - they've just been shortened. Holiday originally meant holy day . It is impossible to get away from religion in language due to historical impact. And although many people think it, good never meant god.
Adéu (often shortened to "déu") is used all the time in Catalan. Spanish speakers, on the other hand, usually refuse to use adiós because, as you said it happens in Portuguese, for them it sounds like a deep good-bye and they prefer to say "hasta luego". I guess we Catalan speakers are simple people.
I have been asking that same questions for years. I have even contacted the official body that overseas Scottish Gaelic (as Scots Gaelic speakers are overwhelmingly Protestant and so would not invoke Mary) to see if they had a non-Catholic alternative response. But they don't greet each other with Dia duit, so that turned out to be moot. The short answer is no - so far no one has come up with a widely accepted alternative to "Dia is Muire duit!"
The fact that the only available greetings are clearly understood as references to religious icons does make one wonder about the culture in which the language has been revived. How accepting are Irish speakers of people who hold different religious views and may not feel comfortable invoking the Catholic saints in greeting? How did the Irish greet each other before Catholicism?
You can just click on "my answer should be accepted" or something like that, and the team can see it and add it as a valid answer. At least that's how it's done in other languages in duolingo. Unfortunately, you'll get those "mistakes" as it takes some time to perfect the course. It's your way to help the Irish course become better I guess.
No, it means "Hello", like Icelandic "Blessadur" means "goodbye" even if the literal derivation is from "blessed".
Meaning is how people use the language to communicate, not necessarily the origin behind the words.
When we say "It's two o'clock", it doesn't mean "It is two of the clock", you're just referring to a specific time. Translating it into (say) French as "Il est deux de l'horloge" is not translating "what it actually means" because that's not what people think of when they say "two o'clock", nor the meaning they want to convey.
I do not understand your point about meaning here. The meaning of a word or phrase is not limited to the commonly understood meaning from a majority. It always ties back to origins, as well as the intent of the speaker, particularly in written form. When I hear "two o'clock", it means two of the clock, as opposed to some other count of time increment. Are you saying that most people are wholly unaware of the origin when they use these phrases, or that they should lose awareness? The words we use without thinking indicate something about our culture and something about ourselves. And I think some people remain aware, despite the possible masses who may use words thoughtlessly. Without awareness of the effect of the origin on a word's connotations, English speakers might still accept the word jew used as a verb to be a simple synonym for cleverly negotiate or cheat, rather than recognizing it for the ethnic slur that its origins make it.
Thank you. I believe that I might have bean confused by 'maith', and since Duolingo doesn't correct me if I write 'muire' in stead of 'Muire' (at least in the early exercises) I have probably tricked my self into to believing that the word/name may sometimes be spelled with a small 'm'
Ah, yes, the always reliable "friend".
Given that Irish wasn't widely taught in schools until the 20th century, and the generally negative attitude of the 19th century Catholic Hierarchy to the language generally, I get a whiff of 21st century anti-Catholic ideology leading to convenient "facts".