"Your beef."

Translation:Bhur mairteoil.

4 years ago

22 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/Hopswatch
Hopswatch
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I didn't dare try. Does "Bhur mairteoil" work as well?

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/alexinIreland
alexinIreland
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Yes!

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Kana_Kaida
Kana_Kaida
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I was marked wrong for it

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/JacobsD8

nope, not for me. :(

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Rae.F
Rae.F
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  • 1793

I'd gotten confused with m. It lenites, but it doesn't eclipse. My notes say that b takes an m eclipsis and I somehow thought the reverse worked as well. Fortunately I got a typo alert instead of a point docked.

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Grace419433

I love when that happens to me

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/RichardMik2

does anyone have a link to a site where one can really hear the difference between the slender and broad pronunciations of the consonants?

4 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/balbhan
balbhan
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Teanglann has recordings for a lot of words. You could have a listen to the difference between [bˠoː] ("boh" cow) and beo [bʲoː] ("byoh" alive), or cad [kadˠ] ("kad" what) and cead [cadˠ] ("kyad", permission). You can also check Wikipedia, which has information about how various sounds are pronounced.

Very basically, you can think of slender consonants as having a slight hint of "y" after the consonant. This can get tricky at the end of a word, but you can get around it by keeping your mouth open at the end, instead of closing it. For broad consonants, leave your mouth hanging open like for "uh"; for slender, leave it in the "i" position. Kind of like ending with a vowel, but without pronouncing that vowel: leabhar [lʲəuɾʲ] "lyowrᵘʰ", vs. leabhair* [lʲəuɾʲ] "lyowrᶤ".

Consonants are always slender before "e" and "i" in English (which is why English speakers don't notice themselves doing it), so to make them broad, you insert a "glide" in front (like a "w", but without rounded lips for consonants that aren't pronounced with the lips). So [bʲiː] ("bee", be) vs. buí [bˠwiː] ("bwee"), yellow. And saor [sˠɰiːɾ] ("sweer", free).

Annoyingly, there don't seem to be many sources for palatalization (making sounds slender) in Irish, but Russian has the same feature, and it's quite well explained in a lot of places: http://therusblog.com/2012/02/18/palatalization-in-russian/

Here are some diagrams for what to do with your tongue for palatalization (slender) and velarization (broad): https://www.quora.com/What-is-the-difference-between-hard-and-soft-consonants-in-Russian

Nualeargais is specific to Irish, and hopefully thorough without being too technical: http://nualeargais.ie/gnag/phonol.htm

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Rae.F
Rae.F
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  • 1793

There's also this video on YouTube, which I think covers the whole thing rather well.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oIokUII7LX0

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Medeann

This is what I've been looking for! Thanks

7 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/SilverDolphin218

Ideally it would say whether it was your (singular ) or your (plural).

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Masofon

I went with "bhur mairteoil" but assuming it could also be "do mhairteoil"??

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Rae.F
Rae.F
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Yep. "bhur" goes with "sibh" (plural you) and "do" goes with "tu" (singular you).

3 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/the13thfirefly

So, why was "d'mairteoil" marked wrong and corrected to "bhur mairteoil" when it's been telling me that "do" and "d'-" both mean "your"?

I am so confused.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Rae.F
Rae.F
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  • 1793

https://www.duolingo.com/skill/ga/Possessives

You only contract before a vowel, or fh+vowel

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/the13thfirefly

Right... @.@ I'll get this eventually.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/India25444

ok so when using bhur we don't put an h in mairteol, but when we use do we do. can someone explain why?

11 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Rae.F
Rae.F
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11 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Dar...

The link doesn't go to the Lenition 'tips' page for me, just the whole skill tree, perhaps they've re-organised the site?

I did check out the Lenition tips though and it doesn't explain why there's no lenition of mairteoil following bhur. It does use mairteoil as an example of a feminine noun being lenited by the definite article, and of it causing lenition in a directly following adjective, (which also has to be feminine?).

In the tips "3. Possessive Adjectives" it states "Lenition occurs after mo, do, a"; but no exception is mentioned for this feminine noun following bhur. Is it because bhur is plural? The possessive adjectives cited are all singular I think?

Or is mairteoil just one of those exceptions that has to be remembered?

6 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Dar...

I did a bit more digging and did find the answer in Tips for this skill (Possessive) and in Eclipses.

Bhur causes eclipses not lenition, regardless of the noun being feminine, however words beginning with 'm' are not eclipsed.

I still suspect though that the division between whether something is lenited or eclipsed at all by possessive adjectives has something to do with singular and plural?

6 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Rae.F
Rae.F
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  • 1793

has something to do with singular and plural?

I think it's a lot more complicated than that and also involves how the end of the previous word sounds.

6 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/LexCastle
LexCastle
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the correct option (mairteoil) was not one of the available choices

9 months ago
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