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  5. "Wir laufen, obwohl wir müde …

"Wir laufen, obwohl wir müde sind."

Translation:We are running even though we are tired.

May 28, 2013

83 Comments

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https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Vitality

I though 'wir rennen' was 'we are running' and 'laufen' meant 'walking'....at least that is what rosetta stone teaches. How can laufen be walking and running? please help

July 1, 2013

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Alphathon

AFAIK, laufen basically means "to travel by foot" (as well as "to flow", "to run" (as in a computer program), "to be in progress" etc), so I think "to walk" would, in some situations, be accurate. However, it also seems to imply at least a certain swiftness, and so in this case "to run" or "to jog" (rather than, say, spazieren which would mean "to walk leisurely" or "to stroll"). Of course I'm not exactly an authority on the subject.

July 10, 2013

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/martofunes

I know its tempting to associate run with rennen, but from my experience, rennen is jogging. Laufen is walking, and even if you say you're going out for a run, people will say "Ich gehe laufen". Spazieren/gehen/laufen/rennen. Those are the verbs and there's no 100% clear concensus on how they should be used. For every ten people that said X, I found just as many swearing by Z. So... Google and know you are not alone in this.

November 18, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/baylonious

Sometimes it pays to be deliberately ambiguous when it comes to exercise. The Germans have figured this out.

November 18, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/cgrunchj

Why not "rennen" in stead of "laufen"?

April 21, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JonathanHo216938

I believe laufen can also be jogging, while rennen is more of a sprint

December 25, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jak1583

Why doesn't the "sind" go after the obwohl?

September 25, 2013

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/fredcookse

Because obwohl makes the second part of the sentence a dependent clause, in which case the verb goes to the end of the clause.

February 1, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JudeLiebhaber

Can you explain like I'm 5?

January 21, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/chcallag

Words like 'obwohl' (dass, ob, weil, wenn) are 'verb scaring' words. Verbs are scared away from them to the end of the clause.

April 2, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/lexilove_04

Does this apply for all connectives? Or only certain ones??

July 5, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Alphathon

I assume by "connectives" you mean conjunctions.

This only happens with "subordinating conjunctions", which are conjunctions which connect two clauses together in such a way that one relies upon (i.e. is "subordinate" to) the other. In German, when a clause is "subordinated" the verb(s) go(es) to the end; in this case "wir sind müde" becomes "wir müde sind". The clause is "subordinate" because it relies upon the "main" clause for it to make sense or elaborates on the information in the main clause. "We are tired" makes sense on it's own, but "Although we are tired" does not, so "although" (obwohl) is a subordinating conjunction. The subordinating conjunctions are: als, bevor, bis, da, damit, dass, ehe, falls, indem, nachdem, ob, obgleich, obschon, obwohl, seit(dem), so dass, während, weil and wenn. However, I wouldn't worry too much about learning the list as their meaning is usually enough to figure it out and they are more-or-less equivalent to English's subordinating conjunctions.

Coordinating conjugations (such as und) and correlative conjunctions (e.g. weder … noch) don't subordinate either clause and so don't change the word order. If this sentence were changed to "Wir laufen und wir sind müde" ("We're running and we're tired") neither clause would be subordinate so the verb-second word order is retained; this makes sense as und merely joins two pieces of information, it doesn't imply that one is related to the other (although it may be).

P.S. I'm not sure whether the und sentence needs a comma.

July 16, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/marquigonzalo

you made me laugh, but not in a wrong way... It is just the perfect sentence "Like i am 5". I felt the same :-)

July 23, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/martofunes
November 26, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/wizwisdom

I think it's something like this, >Wir sind mude obwohl wir laufen. Then, making part A the dependent clause changes word order, thus: >Wir laufen obwohl wir mude sind.

June 21, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/NeinOderJa

Subordinating conjunction

January 28, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Levi
  • 2097

@jak1583 : I think it's because the second part is a subordinate clause. See http://german.about.com/library/weekly/aa010910a.htm

September 25, 2013

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JonathanVa60

German verbs go to the end of a clause for various reasons. Obwohl and others are good signals that it's been sent to the end (because it is a relative clause)

February 1, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Alphathon

I can't think of a reason why it would ever go there unless you were asking a question*; even then I don't think it would go there in this instance since it is the second verb. If German worked like English you'd expect it to go after the „wir“, not after the „obwohl“. I believe it goes at the end of the sentence here because it is the second verb in the sentence.

*there may well be one that I haven't come across yet in my studies, but I'm not aware of one.

September 25, 2013

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/laks94

Back when we learned about conjunctions, we learned that when we have two clauses like this, if the 2nd clause starts with a conjunction, then the verb is placed at the end of the sentence. Sind is the verb in the 2nd clause.

However, if you rearrange the sentence to say "Although we are tired, we run". You would write "Obwohl wir sind mude, laufen mir". So in that case, if the conjunction is in the first clause, then the second one has the word order switched so that the verb is first instead of at the end.

November 2, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/nhaines

The dependent clause still needs the verb to go at the end. In the independent clause, the verb goes in second position. So when the dependent clause fills the first position, it should be:

Obwohl wir müde sind, laufen wir.

November 2, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/forgoetz

I guess DL is not concerned about correct punctuation; however, it doesn't make sense to learn to spell if you are not learning how to punctuate. There is always a comma before the subordinate clause in German.

August 13, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MarinaAndr2

Why "even if" is not accepted?

December 21, 2013

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Alphathon

"Even if" doesn't make sense in English here. It would imply that "we" will (potentially) become tired in the future, while the rest of the sentence is in the past tense. To work with "even if", it'd have to be something like "We will/are going to keep running even if we are tired".

December 21, 2013

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/TobyBartels

I disagree with the other reply, which claims that "even if" wouldn't make sense . However, it would mean something different. "although" states as a fact that we are tired, while "even if" leaves it unknown or unspecified. As for which of these is a better fit for "obwohl", that's a question that I can't answer with certainty.

December 24, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Strato79

does it sound too weird if I say it in this order: "...wir sind müde" ? Thanks

January 30, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/nhaines

Yes, that does sound wrong. In a dependent clause, the verb always goes last. Even if you reverse the sentence, "sind" goes last in the clause:

"Obwohl wir müde sind, laufen wir."

Note that the verb "laufen" in the main clause always goes "second"--you have to have that in the right place first. Don't worry, with practice it all becomes second nature. :)

February 5, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jakob400

why doesn't however work?

November 4, 2013

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Alphathon

"However" doesn't capture the sense of "despite the fact that we were tired" that "although" or "even though" do. With "however" you'd have to reverse the sentence to retain the meaning (something like "We were tired; however, we kept running"), but then the emphasis would be shifted, so it wouldn't be a very good translation as part of the original would be lost/changed.

November 4, 2013

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MartinaDzim

what the heck i wrote "we walk although were tired" and i got it wrong, but in the corrections it said "we walk although we're tired" like usually it corrects it for me but not this time what's wrong duolingo??

January 21, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Duolessio

If your mistake gives rise to a different word, you'll get marked wrong. Since "were" is an actual word, Duo doesn't accept it.

February 8, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/astrid__vegan__

Why are there so many commas in the german language, although other languages like english or dutch don't need them. Like: "Hallo, Anna." instead of "Hello Anna". Is that not oldfashioned and doesn't it make the language more stiff?

March 5, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/nhaines

Commas are compulsory for forms of direct address in English, as well. So if you are speaking directly to Anna, there must be a comma before and after Anna in the sentence: "Hello, Anna, how are you?"

In any case, no--what is old-fashioned and stiff in one language does not have any influence on another language. For as many similarities as there might be, they evolve separately.

For example, nouns weren't traditionally capitalized in Old High German, Middle High German, or [modern] High German, but around the turn of the 20th century, there was some kind of nationalist movement that advocated for capitalized nouns that eventually won out. This is completely independent from the capitalized nouns we sometimes see in older Modern English (such as in the US Constitution).

German is pretty structured, and commas are required between main and subordinate clauses. This is just the way it is, and it's better to focus on recognizing this than worrying about how it might be optional in English.

March 5, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Bart-A

Laufen is walking is it not?

July 17, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

It can be walking or running, depending on the context and where in Germany you are from.

July 17, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Tai673581

How would you use "renne" then what situation is appropriate for "renne".

June 20, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/tjrogers85

Anyone else hear an "L" pronounced in "mude" here? Even knowing what the word is, I still hear "mudel"

March 13, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LingPenguin

The first time around I actually heard "Nudeln", but after that I listened again and it continued to sound like müdel. I would have preferred the sentence "wir laufen, obwohl wir Nudeln sind.", though. :)

April 16, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Herr_Klotz

If you eliminate the term signaling the subordinate clause, does the verb still go at the end? E.g.:

"Ich weiss, dass er klug ist" could be "Ich weiss er ist klug?"

April 23, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/TobyBartels

I've seen that done in informal contexts, but I don't know how well it would be accepted in formal writing. In any case, you need a comma between the two clauses.

December 24, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Mauersegler

Both versions are right, formal and informal. And you need the comma.

August 19, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mhku722

Am I the only one having trouble understanding the spoken questions?

November 21, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/antimatr

I put we are walking, why is walking correct

July 22, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/nhaines

Laufen in this sentence can mean "we walk", "we are walking", or with extra context (like "Laufen wir morgen?") "we will walk".

July 22, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/VinzeDiesel

Why is Duolingo not gives an explanation like in Duolingo's site?.. please give us the explanation to make us understand which time or which word is used for...

January 14, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/2GreyCats

They do explain these things in the Tips and Notes for each lesson section

October 9, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/dyaitskov

Why nonetheless does not fit?

February 15, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Alphathon

It depends how you worded it. Nevertheless isn't used in the same way as even though etc. Even though is a conjunction which connects two clauses together. Nevertheless is an adverb and is usually used at the beginning of a clause/sentence. To form a phrase using nevertheless that means the same as "We are running even though we are tired" would I think either require two separate sentences or two clauses connected with a semi-colon. For example: "We are tired; nevertheless, we are running." This is not particularly natural/idiomatic English and nevertheless is intrinsically a bit outdated and fairly formal. Also, while it is an accurate translation of the German in that it conveys the correct meaning the fact that it is structured completely differently means it changes the emphasis etc. (TL;DR: While you can form a correct translation using nevertheless I wouldn't recommend it.)

February 15, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/_chapstick

why is the adjective and sind swapped round?im confused help

June 18, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Alphathon

Read the other comments, particularly the replies to jak1583's and Strato79's comments. In a nutshell, ...obwohl wir müde sind is a so-called subordinate or dependent clause* and in German all verbs (in this case sind) in a subordinate/dependent clause go to the end.

*In other words it cannot exist on its own and be a sentence. You cannot simply say "Even though we are tired" because the even though requires extra information from the main clause, which is missing. Hence it is said to be dependent on or subordinate to the main clause.

June 18, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/2200Lucia60

Is "We run, even if we're tired" correct too?

August 2, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

I would say no.

even though is concrete: we are tired and we are running despite that.

even if feels hypothetical to me: as if you promise to run even if, hypothetically, you should be tired in the future. That would better be selbst wenn in German than obwohl.

August 2, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Andrew662949

Is this also acceptable word order? "Wir laufen, obwohl müde wir sind."

December 24, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

Not really. Maybe in poetry, but it's not natural word order in everyday spoken language.

December 24, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LL765842

"We run" should be acceptable. U r WRONG, DUO!

August 6, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

"We run" would be a good translation of Wir laufen -- but the entire sentence is Wir laufen, obwohl wir müde sind. You have to translate the second part as well.

August 6, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LL765842

I did. But Duo corrected me on the first part only, and it is wrong. We could be running now, at this moment or just run and still be tired :-)

August 6, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

What was the entire sentence that you wrote?

What was the entire correction that you were presented?

There are accepted sentences with "we run" in them, but without any further detail I have no idea what might have happened.

Do you happen to have a screenshot?

August 6, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Zacknxs

Voice recognition doesn't like to pick up correct pronunciations.

October 18, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Gabriele714028

Why is not correct the translation 'we are running even if we are tired'?

November 19, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

You can use “even if” for a future hypothetical: “we will run even if we are tired”.

But for an actual event (you are tired, but despite that, you run), you should write “we are running even though we are tired.”

November 19, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/elkingrey

Would trotz work here instead of obwohl?

December 13, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

No.

trotz is a preposition and comes before a noun; obwohl is a conjunction and comes before an entire clause with a verb.

trotz is a bit like "despite" -- you can say "despite the rain" but not "despite it was raining" or "despite we were tired".

If you wanted to use trotz, you could use trotz der Tatsache, dass... (despite the fact that...).

December 14, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/elkingrey

Perfect! Thank you!

December 14, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MarcusCoop8

Duo says the conjunction moves the verb to the end of the sentence but 'sind' is not A verb. Why has it moved to the end and in the previous question 'er ist suss' changed to 'ist er suss'. I thought 'ist er suss' meant 'is he suss?' Why is this and how do you know which word order is correct if there is no verb. Also in the case of 'er ist suss' changing to 'ist er suss' how would you ask the question 'is he sweet?'.

February 4, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/nhaines

Sind (sein/to be) is a verb in both English and German.

The verb in this sentence is moved to the end by the conjunction obwohl (although technically, it's more correct to say that the verb is moved to the end of the clause because it's a subordinate clause).

In simple German sentences, verbs belong in the second position in the sentence:

Ich gehe morgen im Park.
Morgen gehe ich im Park.
Gestern bin ich im Park gegangen. (note the verb bin/sein again)

In a simple question, the verb and subject are swapped:

Gehe ich morgen im Park?
Bin ich gestern im Park gegangen?

Likewise, to ask if someone is sweet, you would ask "Ist er suß?"

In sentences with subordinate clauses, the verb in the clause goes at the end, and the subordinate clause takes up one "position" in the sentence.

I'll eat lunch after I go to the park:
Ich esse Mittagessen, nachdem ich im Park gehe.

After I go to the park, I'll eat lunch:
Nachdem ich im Park gehe, esse ich Mittagessen.

It's very regular and consistent. It just takes a little practice.

February 4, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Mauersegler

Grammatically you are right, but no German would use your sentences like this. I would say: "Ich gehe morgen im Park spazieren" or "Ich gehe morgen in den Park." Likewise: Ich esse zu Mittag , nachdem ich im Park spazieren gegangen bin/nachdem ich in den Park gegangen bin." (The walking in the park is finished.)

February 5, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/nhaines

That's the risk, sometimes, of trying to keep sentences very simple not to overshadow the lesson being taught. Thank you for your corrections and feedback. :)

February 5, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MarcusCoop8

thanks for your help, it kinda makes sense however I am struggling with the word order changes in this section, but I couldn't get used to die/der/das/den at first but soon learn't so as you say it just takes A little (or in my case A lot) of practice, which is is exactly why I'm doing this course.

February 10, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Moonlight10198

From what I can tell, you could literally translate "Obwohl" to "if well", which actually kind of makes sense to me.

February 11, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jotapsoares

'We run, even though we are tired' shouldn't be wrong... Should it?

March 30, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

"We run, even though we are tired" is one of the accepted translations.

Please check whether you had a listening or a translating exercise; if you are still not sure what the error might have been, please provide a link to a screenshot.

March 30, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jotapsoares

Thank you! I might have typed 'thought' instead of 'though' I noticed this because the same sentenced popep up, and this happened!

March 31, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

This is why screenshots are good.

March 31, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Robbie5203

The word "even" is not always needed in English

April 4, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sandy54630

Has anyone started translating the sentence structure in English the same as German. I think I am concentrating too hard!

May 24, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Gransview

Laufen is walking!

May 28, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

laufen can mean either "walk" or "run".

It's one of the trickier parts of German, and its meaning moreover depends on where in Germany you are.

May 28, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/xMiS9

I wrote the answer and it say it is wrong even though the correct answer was the same one as mine.

September 3, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

I'm guessing that you had a listening exercise and you translated into English rather than writing down the German words.

But without the URL of an uploaded screenshot, I can only guess.

September 4, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Ufnal

Why is although not ok?

October 3, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/martin914178

Why can't I use ...we run despite we are tired

January 4, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MartinaDzim

I think it's because when you use the word despite, you say "despite the fact that" and that's probably too long/complicated for Duolingo : sorry

January 21, 2016
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