Think of it as "Our company is at the door," where "company" is singular but can refer to more than one visitor being at the door.
DL accepts "company" in some phrases to translate "Besuch", but not this one. Not yet, anyway. :-)
Of all the comments and discussions about how best to translate "Unser Besuch" in this thread (~35), yours seems perfect and right on the mark. Thanks.
Duolingo now accepts "Our company is at the door" (February 2018). I agree with Janneine that this is the better translation.
an is a two way preposition.
Please have a look at http://lw.lsa.umich.edu/german/hmr/Grammatik/Praepositionen/Prepositions.html#twowaynotes. To quote from the site:
nouns following the
`two-way prepositions(in, auf, unter, über, vor, hinter, neben, zwischen,
an, entlang...) are
accusative: MOTION--if the verb is describing a change of location: where someone or something is going or being put. OR
Dative: LOCATION--if the verb is describing where something is located or where an action is taking place
"Am" is a contraction for "an dem." So "am der" would be "an dem der," which is of course wrong.
I think it's because you translated "Besuch ist" as the plural "visitors are", not the singlar "visitor is".
Thank you, helen. That's what I was looking for. The questing now is, and I should have pointed that out b4, that "Besuch" can mean the following in German: 1. der Besuch (visit) can have a plural (die Besuche)
der Besuch (the visitor(s)) has no plural in German and this is our case here!
der Besucher (male) visitor (sing),
die Besucherin (fem.) (sing)
As you see, example 2 has no plural, so am free to translate sing or plural except the context tells me. As there is no context, I can translate what I want. And I thought it would be: "der Besuch" (pl) = the guests. And then I was asking for opinions. Christian was a bit to fast I would say, I do only report things when I, or we here together know that we are right. So keep up to good work in commenting, to find the bottom of the truth. DUO is still learning, and they need our input. I also heard them saying, that less than 50% of the complaints/error reports are true errors, -hence better not to report too much. :-)
If they were meaning the Plural form of Besuch, I believe that in that case the possessive determiner should be Unsere and not Unser
"Unsere Besuche sind an der Tür" would translate to "Our visits are at the door". That doesn't make any sense. "Besuch" meaning "guest(s)" is uncountable. It's "Unser Besuch ist an der Tür" no matter how many guests there are.
Physically and for things:
"an der Tür" -it sticks on the door like a note/post-it etc. As in: "Der Zettel ist an der Tuer." (angeklebt)
"bei der Tür" - it is located close to the door like a bell button or umbrella holder. As in: "Der Regenschirmstaender ist bei der Tuer" (an, bei, neben, in der Naehe is also ok)
Physically and for person(s):
"an der Tür" a person cannot just be or stick physically "an der Tuer" like paint or a note. A person may hang on the door. "Er haengt an der Tuer"
but semantically "Er/Sie ist an derTuer"
"an der Tür sein" -he/she is outside and in front of the door (facing the door) most likely awaiting entry
semantically "Er/Sie ist bei der Tuer" "bei der Tür sein" ist nicht Hochdeutsch!
In some regional dialects it is used, it would be too confusing to explain.
"Besuch" does not imply a single visitor, it could be more. "Visitors" and "guests" should be accepted.
Sorry, but I have to correct you.
"Der Besuch" can be one expected person or a group of ten people, hence, "Der Besuch ist an der Tuer" can be many. :-)
Right. To expand on what backtoschool said, "Besuch" meaning "visitor(s)" or "company" is uncountable and always takes a singular verb, regardless of how many people there are. "Besuch" meaning "visit" is countable. The singular "Besuch" takes a singular verb, and the plural "Besuche" takes a plural verb.
Just wondering if "auf der Tur" would be an acceptable translation, and if not, why?
Could be plural. If it were sing. it would be unser Besucher (mas. sing) We cannot tell without context if it is sing. or pl.
"our visit is at the door" was accepted, I think this is not correct in English but I believe I got the idea...
No, "am" = "an dem". You have to say "an der" for feminine nouns in Dative.
no, der Besucher is the masculine form and die Besucherin is the feminine form. "Der Besuch" is the noun formed from the verb "besuchen"(=to visit). Here the noun of the activity went over to describe the persons.
- Der Besuch bei Tante Ani war toll. = The visit by aunt Ani was super! ~activity
- Der Besuch kommt morgen um 8 Uhr an. = The visitors arrive tomorrow at 8 o'clock AM. ~persons
I am going by Dutch so I'm not sure if this is right in German, but I put 'the visitors' as well which in Dutch would be correct (het bezoek)
You could but that means the visitors are about 2 to 5 meters away from the door.
Shouldn ' t it be dem Tur because an is a two way preposition and without any movement it is dative. Please explain
"Dem" is dative for masculine or neuter nouns. "Tür" is feminine and the feminine dative form is, in fact, "der."
Then what's the difference between the prepositions um, an, and maybe also bei? I've seen them all translated as ''at'' at least once
Just so people maybe learning a third language here "Our 'stay' is at the door." would not be said in emEnglish. Visitor, guest, company, arrival, but not stay. Stay is only a verb in English not a noun.
I agree with you that "Our stay is at the door" would not be said. But your last sentence is incorrect. Stay can be used as a noun. Examples: "How was your stay?" or "Enjoy your stay."
The correct answer for an Der tuer given by duolingo is at the door.. but it supposed to be, to the door..
If the sentence takes the dative form how come it is unser instead of unserem? I'm confused
It's individual nouns that are dative, nominative, etc.-- not sentences. "Der Tür" is dative because it's the object of "an," which takes a dative object when it's not referring to motion. "Unser Besuch" is nominative.
Similarly, in the sentence "He talked to her," "He" is in the subject form and "her" is in object form. Just because "her" is in object form doesn't mean "he" should be too.