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"Je hebt deze oude tandpasta toch niet gebruikt?"

Translation:You did not use this old toothpaste, right?

September 13, 2014

28 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/feyMorgaina

LOL... I was wondering when "toch" was going to cause me some problems.

In my other Dutch material, they used the following in a dialogue:

"Je hebt toch schoenen?" (translated as "You have shoes, don't you?")

I think the negative "niet" is throwing me off here. :-s

Can "Je hebt deze oude tandpasta toch niet gebruikt?" be translated as "You haven't used this old toothpaste, have you?" or "You didn't use this old toothpaste, did you?" For some reason, "have you?" or "did you?" feel more natural to me in this instance than "right?" I think I'm more likely to use "right?" with a positive sentence construction such as "You went to the story already, right?" This might be because "right?" simply asks for confirmation of the positive statement (in my example, confirming that the person indeed went to the story already). However, to confirm the negative sentence "You haven't used..." or "You didn't use...", we also want to confirm that the opposite ("You have used..." or "You did use...") didn't occur; hence, the use of "have you?" or "did you?"

In either case ("right?" or "have you?" or "did you?"), the expected answer is "No, I haven''t..." or "No, I didn't..."

As another example, I might ask someone "You haven't gone to the store yet, have you?" or "You didn't go to the store yet, did you?" (the expected answer is "No, I haven't..." or "No, I didn't..."). Again, "have you" or "did you?" feel more natural to me with the negative sentence construction than "right?".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/rick329813

Yes, some words can be a pain in the tochis


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/TristanoSuriani

I'm not sure about this translation. It would be much more natural to translate it as: "Je hebt deze oude tandpasta niet gebruikt, toch?".

Or there is something I'm missing?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Susande

Your sentence is fine as well, but it's not more natural than the given sentence.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Dani_girl12

What's the best way to know that 'toch' here meant right and not still?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Susande

Toch can only mean still in specific situations, see Simius' post below. Usually still will be translated to nog.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Nitric666

Still was given as the second possible definition of toch when I hovered over it.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Simius

Yes, actually "toch" can sometimes be translated as "still", but only for one specific meaning of "still". One that wouldn't make sense in this sentence. In this dictionary entry, only definition #14 (yet, nevertheless) would be translations as "toch" in Dutch.

  • Hij heeft honger, maar toch eet hij niet - He is hungry, but still he does not eat.

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Dani_girl12

Ahh, okay. was misinformed by some mates! Thanks :)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/luigipinna

And we are supposed to know that how? By being Dutch experts while we are studying it? Sheesh!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/feyMorgaina

Oh, but isn't the fun part when you wake up one day and you suddenly realize you're thinking in another language? After all the hurdles, it just all clicks together. ;-)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Susande

The sentence uses the most common meaning of toch. But you're right the dictionary translations you see when hovering over a word can be misleading, since these don't include usage/context.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JeffHK

How would you say, "You STILL haven't used this old toothpaste?" Dank je wel!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/fruitbakje

Je hebt nog steeds deze oude tandpasta niet gebruikt? Although earlier it was said by Susande that 'still' in this case would be 'nog', in this case I (as a Dutch native) would use 'nog steeds'.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Laure605988

Even though it makes sense in English to use the question mark, both after "right?" or "have you?" or "did you?", I don't see a question in the Dutch sentence, and the structure is certainly that of an affirmative sentence. That said, is the question mark still needed in Dutch in this example?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/edwardshor3

This was marked wrong: "So you haven't used this old toothpaste?" But this is perfectly idiomatic.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/loulou744616

How would i say in Dutch " you have not yet used the old toothpaste? "


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/loulou744616

Sorry i wanted to ask how you say " you have nitbyet used THIS old toothoaste?"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Marion647635

I think that "right" here is not idiomatic English. We would say ",have you"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Ibykos

Why is it gebruikt and not gebruiken since we have hebt here?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Mor_V

As far as I know, "gebruiken" is a regular verb, and as such, its perfect form is "(ge+)stem+t(/d)".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Ibykos

Oh my god yes you are right I don't know why I even asked this I guess I was absent minded thank you though


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/luigipinna

Why not "you have still not used this old toothpaste?" Where does this arbitrary "Right?" come in? I do not see it.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/fruitbakje

In this case 'toch' is not referring to 'still', but rather to 'right?'. See Simius above


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Deningrad

Should "Haven't you used this old toothpaste, right?" be accepted?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/fruitbakje

that sentence doesn't make sense in English


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/feyMorgaina

I wouldn't say so.

"Right?" as an interjection isn't used that way. It's used to confirm a statement. Since you're already asking a question (with "haven't you...?") you don't need to add "right?" to the end of it.

Saying "haven't you used this old toothpaste" also changes the meaning and the expected answer. Your example implies that one should have used "this old toothpaste" and the expected answer is "yes, I have". With the Dutch example, the expected answer is "no, I haven't" or "no, I didn't" and it's suggesting that one should not have used "this old toothpaste".

"Haven't you used this old toothpaste?" implies that one should have used.

"You haven't used this old toothpaste, right?" implies that one should not have used.

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