"Vi ricordate quegli anni?"
Translation:Do you remember those years?
81 CommentsThis discussion is locked.
The verb "ricordare" can be reflexive, so it becomes "ricordarsi". Io mi ricordo Tu ti ricordi Egli-Lui/Ella-Lei si ricorda Noi ci ricordiamo Voi vi ricordate Essi si ricordano
What is the difference in meaning? I think "ricordate quegli anni?" Would also mean "Do you remember those years" - is this correct? What added meaning does the reflexive version add? I would expect it means something like "Do you remember yourselves in those years", but that's not the translation given. Or does it mean, "do you yourselves remember those years?" to stress who is doing the remembering. It would be great if someone could clarify.
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Romance languages have reflexive verbs that aren't reflexive in English. "Remember" is one such verb. In Italian, the reflexive pronoun is grammatically required, but it would not be translated in English. So "[Io] mi ricordo" = I remember; "[Voi] vi ricordate" = you (pl) remember, etc.
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Uhm no. This verb is optionally reflexive, albeit its one of the few, but it can be ricordate as well.
Incorrect. The reflexive pronoun is not required with ricordare. Both "ricordare" and "ricordarsi (di)" are correct and they mean the same.
The "di" is optional in "ricordarsi di" when the expression is followed by a noun. It is only required when followed by a verb (eg "Ricordati di mettere fuori lo sporco"). Ref: https://italian.stackexchange.com/questions/10785/does-ricordarsi-require-the-preposition-di
I have updated my previous comment to make it clear.
Very nicely put...Having read all the comments I think we definitely need some help here!
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For me it helps to think about it as a passive voice and then translate the sentence as "Are those years remembered to you?". Not sure if it's a valid translation, but it does help wrap your head around it.
Here's a link that helped me understand the difference between "ricordare" and "ricordarsi": https://langsandlit.tumblr.com/post/146947201038/when-does-one-use-ricordarsi-di-vs-ricordare
As mentioned at the end of the article, "Treccani maintains that the use of ricordarsi instead of ricordare is quite common today, especially in speech".
If anyone from the staff reads this: Please fix these sentences, so they all approve both ricordare and ricordarsi. It's a bit ridiculous how I have to gamble between them.
Report it. Don't post it here. The comments section is meant for discussion among us students, not for reporting mistakes.
I have been told that the best way to get things changed is to report it. I suspect they are overworked, but I have been successful in having some translations added or changed, so they DO read the reports submitted.
yes, they are beginning to add and/or fix some translations. After 6 months waiting, they have started now to e-mail me the adding of some of my suggestions on reports. "Meglio tardi che mai"
What is the difference between "quegli anni" and "quei anni"? Aren't both adjectives?
Both are masculine. Quei comes before a consonant and quuegli before a vowel.
I think "quegli anni" is correct, because "anni" is maculine and begins with a vowel.
"quei" is used before a noun which begins with a consonant (except s+consonant, z, ps, x, nh), "quegli" is used in all other cases except before a noun which starts with the vowel i. In this case, quegl' is used.
If I understand correctly "Vi" indicates that "ricordare" is a reflexive verbs, see: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reflexive_verb This should be taught in a seperate section i.m.o., it's very confusing coming across it sporadically.
it was introduced in a prior lesson so why isn't it fair game now? that is how we learn
You understood incorrectly. "ricordarsi" is a pronominal verb, not reflexive.
In a reflexive verb, the object of the action is the subject (eg tagliarsi = to cut oneself).
In a pronominal verb, the object of the action is not the subject. Either the action has no object (eg svegliarsi = to wake up) or the object is something/somebody else (eg ricordarsi dell' estate = to remember the summer). The reflexive pronoun has no purpose in those, but it is idiomatic to use them.
In the specific case of "ricordare", the non-pronominal and pronomimal forms are interchangeable.
Why would I ask "Vi ricordate quegli anni?" versus "Voi ricordate quegli anni?" or even "Ricordate quegli anni?" Is the first better better Italian?
Actually, the full sentence would be, "Voi vi ricordate quegli anni?" When you drop the subject, it becomes "Vi ricordate quegli anni?" That's because the verb here is "ricordarsi" and not "ricordare;" and "ricordarsi" is what's known as a reflexive verb. So to be grammatically correct, the "vi" must accompany "ricordate."
What I'm still confused about is why, since we're using the reflexive form here, it's not "vi ricordate DI quegli anni?" Why don't we still need the di?
It might be optional, as this comment suggests: "It seems to be a bit of a grey area, and some people say that with ricordarsi it is just a matter of personal taste if you use the 'di' with the object or not. It seems that if you are using ricordare then you do not need the 'di' but if using 'ricordarsi' you can either use the 'di' with a following noun or not." (Found at https://www.duolingo.com/comment/3801975)
Thanks so much for the reply! But I didn't think it was optional when using the reflexive form? (The comment you kindly linked in seems to be for the non-reflexive form?)
Beats me -- couldn't turn up an answer in extensive Googling! If you get an authoritative answer, please let me know :-)
This comment is misleading. Using di in "ricordarsi di qualcosa" is obligatory.
Yes, the "di" is required with the pronominal verb "ricordarsi" and this Italian sentence is wrong. Please report it.
I wonder why duolingo doesn't consider "you guys" to be an acceptable translation of "voi."
I wholeheartedly agree. I'm a midwesterner and we do not say y'all or you all. We, among others, say you guys to represent the second person plural that is absent from English. I do understand that "you guys" is somewhat of a colloquialism and would not be used in academic or formal writing but c'mon duolingo.
The second person plural is not absent from English. It is the second person singular (thou) that is archaic.
because if you use you guys you are not learning Italian. You are not learning!
I do not understand why is 'vi' used here. In previous comments I saw many explanations that said that it is there because the verb used here is 'ricordaRSI' (I see ricordate). I don't know if I have missed something, but I haven't yet seen such a word in DL, and have no idea what it means and also because of that do not understand the explanation
You remember those years? = Do you remember those years? And I was marked incorrect.
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I think "You remember those years?" should be accepted. It can be said with a rising inflection.
I answered 'You remember those years?' With the question mark in place it means exactly the same as 'Do you remember those years?' but it was marked as incorrect.
"Do you remember yourselves those years?" not valid? (because the verb is ricordarSI, not ricordare if there is a VI in the sentence)
More like " Do you (yourselves) remember those years?" I believe.
But not sure
The reflexive pronoun has no reflexive purpose here. "ricordarsi" is a pronominal verb.
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And what is the role of the " do you all" part of the suggested translation? Is it due to using the reflexive verb? "Do you remember those years" was also accepted. Is there a distinction between the two in Italian?
Pretty sure "do you all" was just to be able to differentiate in English between you singular and you plural. (you all... all y'all :)
Yes, exactly - although it's pretty much a southern U.S. way of talking. In the north we'd just say "Do you remember ...?, which DL accepts. I wonder if they'd accept "Do you guys remember ...?", which is what young people might well say.
It is not just young people who say "you guys". It is used by adults to denote the plural you in at least New Jersey, Pennsylvania, and Ohio.
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Or possibly "yous guys". Here's a helpful map http://myfunnymemes.com/you-guys-youse-yall-map-chart/ But I only type that when I am feeling cheeky and not trying to get an acceptable answer.
It's amazing that in a language as rich as English, full of redundant words nobody knows, cares to know, or uses, you can't differentiate between you singular and you plural... When I hear my coworker say "you guys's" on the phone, it makes my skin crawl. Of course, she only does it so that nobody takes it personally and gets "offended"... Because Americans are such fragile and easily offended critters! For the record, I'm talking about AZ. In TX, for instance, they have "ya'all." Glad I don't have to hear at least THAT!
Please explain the difference.... with the "actual translation" and mine..." do you remember all those years?"
I think "do you remember all those years?" in Italian would be "Vi ricordate tutti quegli anni?".
Please someone explain when to use quelli and when to use quegli. They sound the same. But written i keep getting my qeull(s) marked wrong, or if i put quegli for those it is wrong. Aren't they interchangeable?
"quei" is used before a noun which begins with a consonant (except s+consonant, z, ps, x, nh), "quegli" is used before all other nouns except before a noun which starts with the vowel i. In this case, quegl' is used.
"quelli" is the plural masculine pronoun and thus it is used on its own. Example: Questi cellulari sono costosi. Quelli sono più economici. (= These cellphones are expensive. Those are cheaper. )
I think quelli is used when you use plural "i" and quegli when you use plural "gli"
I assume you meant "remember". Although questions without the auxiliary verb "to do" is sometimes heard in informal speech, it is required in formal contexts and Duolingo usually requires it.
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Does anyone else notice that the male speaker in this sentence (as well as in other sentences) puts the accent on the wrong syllable? I can always understand the female speaker but I can't understand him half of the time :/
All of a sudden 'ricordare' becomes reflexive. Watch out guys, what you've learned before about this verb will be marked down!
